Any news/update on GP Gliders?

On Monday, 10 October 2016 00:09:13 UTC+3, wrote:
On Facebook I have little knowledge. Just a dummy account to keep track of some sites.

I just read the FAI rulebook for Benalla. The 13.5 mtr class is having a wingload limit of 35 kg/m2. GPGlider is designing them for 32-60 kg/m2. Looks like the design might not be optimised for the current rules or the rules are changed by the FAI.

13.5m class 35kg/m2 wingloading has to be most stupid rule IGC has ever written (I know, there are serious contenders to this award). We have fantastic aerodynamic knowledge which allows us to fly modern gliders fast and comfortably with 50+ kg/m2 wingloading. 35 kg/m2 rule makes this class expensive club class, taking all the fun out of flying fast, plus it effectively bans all designs with engine, sans Silent (which has club class performance because of too big wing).

On Monday, October 10, 2016 at 11:15:10 AM UTC+2, krasw wrote:
On Monday, 10 October 2016 00:09:13 UTC+3, wrote:
On Facebook I have little knowledge. Just a dummy account to keep track of some sites.

I just read the FAI rulebook for Benalla. The 13.5 mtr class is having a wingload limit of 35 kg/m2. GPGlider is designing them for 32-60 kg/m2. Looks like the design might not be optimised for the current rules or the rules are changed by the FAI.

13.5m class 35kg/m2 wingloading has to be most stupid rule IGC has ever written (I know, there are serious contenders to this award). We have fantastic aerodynamic knowledge which allows us to fly modern gliders fast and comfortably with 50+ kg/m2 wingloading. 35 kg/m2 rule makes this class expensive club class, taking all the fun out of flying fast, plus it effectively bans all designs with engine, sans Silent (which has club class performance because of too big wing).

As a reference I like to add the link to the FAI rule book which were published on Oct 4, 2016 and which will be in effect in Benalla. http://www.fai.org/downloads/igc/SC3A_2016a
Page 18 highlights the limit to wingloading for the 13.5 mtr class. Or is anticipated that the rules will be revised before the summer of 2017? If not I understand the push in developing a 15mtr version. The package GPGlider is developing seems very attractive on paper (light groundhandling, good performance and a wide envelope of uses (also for 13.5 mtr) but with this restriction in place the 13.5 mtr is a lot less appealing.

The 13.5m class wingloading was certainly NOT discussed during last IGC Plenary, while a lot of other stuff concerning that class was. I'm not sure if wingloading change would have to go trough several year procedure as with Sporting Code. On the other hand, 20m class max weight was changed basically overnight.

On Monday, October 10, 2016 at 3:48:46 AM UTC-7, krasw wrote:
The 13.5m class wingloading was certainly NOT discussed during last IGC Plenary, while a lot of other stuff concerning that class was. I'm not sure if wingloading change would have to go trough several year procedure as with Sporting Code. On the other hand, 20m class max weight was changed basically overnight.

Hoping to see progress on the GP15, looks great on paper.
I always thought a Ventus 2Cx/13.5 or ASG29/13.5 would be the right glider for the 13.5m occasion.
The wing loading handicap to me appears to condemn the class. Should have stayed with the PW5 in that case. (gulp)
Jim

On Monday, October 10, 2016 at 9:18:03 PM UTC+2, JS wrote:
On Monday, October 10, 2016 at 3:48:46 AM UTC-7, krasw wrote:
The 13.5m class wingloading was certainly NOT discussed during last IGC Plenary, while a lot of other stuff concerning that class was. I'm not sure if wingloading change would have to go trough several year procedure as with Sporting Code. On the other hand, 20m class max weight was changed basically overnight.

Hoping to see progress on the GP15, looks great on paper.
I always thought a Ventus 2Cx/13.5 or ASG29/13.5 would be the right glider for the 13.5m occasion.
The wing loading handicap to me appears to condemn the class. Should have stayed with the PW5 in that case. (gulp)
Jim
The Italians pushed the rule change to favor theirs glider. It has 13.5m wing and engine, all below 35 kg/m2. this eliminates 13.5 Diana, Mini Lak and GP 14.
Mark

I believe the wingloading is still a leftover from the previous World Class..

As far as I can see IGC did not discuss Wingloadings for the 13,5m Class in the IGC 2016 Meeting see http://www.fai.org/igc-documents (Meetings, Minutes 12th May Section 8.2.3 and 8.24) Year one proposal is to have all 13,5m with SelfLaunch capability and at the suggested Wingloading they would be all in the UL category. I guess there will be further discussions about this.

maanantai 10. lokakuuta 2016 7.02.45 UTC+3 Sean kirjoitti:
Not to be a complete GP14 cheerleader (I do have some skepticism), however, I do think a 45:1, extremely high performance electric self launch glider (HUGE at this price point) has the potential to be a true game changer. 45:1+ is more than enough performance for me personally. IF the 13.5m class was to catch on, the idea of paying double for 15/18m for an extra 5 to (perhaps) 7 LD points (at low speeds) is fairly difficult to justify.

I talked to one 13.5m class pilot (flew a brand new, advertised 45:1 ship) and asked about performance, he told me that performance is a bit less than modern std. class ship in slow speeds and little bit better with high speeds (comparable wingloading). These comments were made based on test flights.. 45:1 is fantasy, sorry.

On Monday, October 10, 2016 at 5:15:10 AM UTC-4, krasw wrote:
13.5m class 35kg/m2 wingloading has to be most stupid rule IGC
has ever written (I know, there are serious contenders to this award).

Everything will be much improved with the upcoming 11m class.

On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 at 12:35:27 PM UTC-7, Dave Nadler wrote:
On Monday, October 10, 2016 at 5:15:10 AM UTC-4, krasw wrote:
13.5m class 35kg/m2 wingloading has to be most stupid rule IGC
has ever written (I know, there are serious contenders to this award).

Everything will be much improved with the upcoming 11m class.

Does anyone have any info on the new Penguin class ships? Redline is supposed to be approaching 300 knots, L/D better than 10:1 Should move the bar way up for Sierra mountain wave speed records. Comes standard with a solid fuel rocket sustainer - very important to be pointed towards home when doing a low save.

bumper
Minden
MKIV & QV

Bumper, are you going to have to redesign your yaw strings to be able to handle the higher speeds?

Boggs