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Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course



 
 
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  #21  
Old July 27th 20, 03:07 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Charles Longley
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Posts: 288
Default Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course

Ahh good points. I’ll take a look at my POH when I get my glider out again.
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  #22  
Old July 27th 20, 03:46 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Dan Daly[_2_]
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Posts: 668
Default Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 9:01:28 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
Charles Longley wrote on 7/26/2020 11:33 PM:
I would think land gear up. It might float indefinitely. Depends on how much foam/wood is in it. I would certainly try and get out as quick as I could.

I'm not sure the advice is in the ASW20 handbook, as I haven't read one for 30
years or so, but it is in my ASH26E handbook: water landings should be done with
the gear extended to reduce the tendency of the glider to dive into the water, and
to absorb the shock of hitting the bottom of the lake in shallow water.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1


It will also get rid of a lot of energy in a hurry so you are going more slowly.
  #23  
Old July 27th 20, 03:57 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Dave Nadler
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Default Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course

On Sunday, July 26, 2020 at 8:56:27 PM UTC-4, John Cochrane wrote:
I've seen traces that retreat to the Carson valley via the 50 gap.


I did that once, and pretty much followed the terrain down 50.
Even though no useful ridge lift inside the bowl, plenty of
sink on the lee side. Crossed the valley and ridge soared back
to Minden. Won't do that again...

Glad you're OK Ramy!
  #24  
Old July 27th 20, 03:58 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
2G
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Posts: 1,186
Default Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 6:01:28 AM UTC-7, Eric Greenwell wrote:
Charles Longley wrote on 7/26/2020 11:33 PM:
I would think land gear up. It might float indefinitely. Depends on how much foam/wood is in it. I would certainly try and get out as quick as I could.

I'm not sure the advice is in the ASW20 handbook, as I haven't read one for 30
years or so, but it is in my ASH26E handbook: water landings should be done with
the gear extended to reduce the tendency of the glider to dive into the water, and
to absorb the shock of hitting the bottom of the lake in shallow water.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1


This is from my ASH31 flight manual:

A landing on water of a plastic sailplane with landing gear retracted has
been tested. Due to the experience gained on that occasion it is supposed, that the aircraft will not skim across the water, but that the whole
cockpit area will be pressed under the surface. If the depth of the water
is less than 2 m = 6.5 ft, the pilot is in the greatest danger. Touching
down on water is, therefore, recommended only with landing gear lowered, and as the only way out.
  #25  
Old July 27th 20, 04:06 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
2G
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Posts: 1,186
Default Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course

On Sunday, July 26, 2020 at 11:33:50 PM UTC-7, Charles Longley wrote:
I would think land gear up. It might float indefinitely. Depends on how much foam/wood is in it. I would certainly try and get out as quick as I could.


I know a guy who landed in a lake near Arlington, WA. Two fishermen in a nearby boat came to give him a lift to shore. He insisted that he had landed in shallow water, and jumped up and down in the cockpit to prove it - the glider was absolutely rock solid. They said no, the water was 10 ft deep. He didn't believe them and jumped into the water to prove it - he promptly sank in over his head. The glider was towed to shore and damage was limited to one mechanical vario.

Tom

  #26  
Old July 27th 20, 05:33 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
jfitch
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Posts: 1,056
Default Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course

On Sunday, July 26, 2020 at 5:56:27 PM UTC-7, John Cochrane wrote:
On Sunday, July 26, 2020 at 2:56:33 PM UTC-7, 2G wrote:
Good part was it was late in the day and there were no golfers on this hole:

https://www.onlinecontest.org/olc-3....l?dsId=8033935


Glad you're ok and no big damage or golfers injured. And now someone else gets a chance on OLC for a few weeks!

I usually don't try Sergio's unless I see wind on the lake. Good streaks or whitecaps needed, well before I cannot escape over the back to Carson.

The water south of sand harbor looks possible.

I've seen traces that retreat to the Carson valley via the 50 gap.

I gather the golf course in Kings beach has also been landed on, but these seem very chancy.

Anyone else have a half decent plan B for the Tahoe basin?

John Cochrane


Sergio (and a few like him) would enter Spooner Pass with sufficient altitude to take one pass at the Elevator, then exit if it did not work. Even in the best circumstance, this is a very risky move. Most of us Truckee regulars believe that if you are low enough to feel any ridge lift there, you are WAY TOO LOW. A retrieve from Carson is very inexpensive compared to even slight damage to a glider, let alone a funeral (and attempts at the Elevator have resulted in both). Ramy found an empty fairway, but even checking it with a crosswind pass does not guarantee that some duffer won't wander back out on your final, having retrieved his slice from the woods.
  #27  
Old July 27th 20, 05:36 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
jfitch
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Posts: 1,056
Default Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course

On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 5:54:44 AM UTC-7, Eric Greenwell wrote:
kinsell wrote on 7/27/2020 1:51 AM:
On 7/26/20 10:03 PM, Jonathan St. Cloud wrote:
On Sunday, July 26, 2020 at 5:56:27 PM UTC-7, John Cochrane wrote:
On Sunday, July 26, 2020 at 2:56:33 PM UTC-7, 2G wrote:
Good part was it was late in the day and there were no golfers on this hole:

https://www.onlinecontest.org/olc-3....l?dsId=8033935

Glad you're ok and no big damage or golfers injured. And now someone else gets
a chance on OLC for a few weeks!

I usually don't try Sergio's unless I see wind on the lake. Good streaks or
whitecaps needed, well before I cannot escape over the back to Carson..

The water south of sand harbor looks possible.

I've seen traces that retreat to the Carson valley via the 50 gap.

I gather the golf course in Kings beach has also been landed on, but these seem
very chancy.

Anyone else have a half decent plan B for the Tahoe basin?

John Cochrane

This land out really highlights the need for a good short game when flying XC.
If you had a two stroke, you wouldn't have been penalized.* Good drive to the
green!* Stay safe everyone.


I think he scored a birdie didn't he?

Better than a two-stroke handicap, with an electric he could have just flipped a
switch, turned a knob, and ended up in an attic.* Worked great for the guy in
Connecticut.* And that Kawa guy in Italy.


And 100s of uneventful saves by electric gliders we never hear about, because they
were successful. The two incidents you mention were caused by pilot errors, not
electric glider failures.

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1


Any crash involving an inoperative powerplant on an auxiliary glider cannot be blamed on the power plant. That failure only made obvious the chain of errors the pilot made prior to its attempted use.
  #28  
Old July 27th 20, 07:07 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
John Godfrey (QT)[_2_]
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Posts: 310
Default Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course

On Sunday, July 26, 2020 at 5:56:33 PM UTC-4, 2G wrote:
Good part was it was late in the day and there were no golfers on this hole:

https://www.onlinecontest.org/olc-3....l?dsId=8033935


Glad this turned out mostly well. Good advice to heed and lessons learned. Thanks for sharing.
  #29  
Old July 27th 20, 07:27 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
RR
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Posts: 76
Default Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course

Interesting, I had nearly the same experience. With the wings providing stability it did seem rock stable, and thought I might be sitting on the bottom. But as I entered, I too was over my head in the water.

  #30  
Old July 27th 20, 09:04 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Eric Greenwell[_4_]
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Posts: 1,573
Default Scary story about landing on a Lake Tahoe golf course

Tango Eight wrote on 7/27/2020 6:03 AM:
On Monday, July 27, 2020 at 8:54:44 AM UTC-4, Eric Greenwell wrote:
kinsell wrote on 7/27/2020 1:51 AM:
On 7/26/20 10:03 PM, Jonathan St. Cloud wrote:
On Sunday, July 26, 2020 at 5:56:27 PM UTC-7, John Cochrane wrote:
On Sunday, July 26, 2020 at 2:56:33 PM UTC-7, 2G wrote:
Good part was it was late in the day and there were no golfers on this hole:

https://www.onlinecontest.org/olc-3....l?dsId=8033935

Glad you're ok and no big damage or golfers injured. And now someone else gets
a chance on OLC for a few weeks!

I usually don't try Sergio's unless I see wind on the lake. Good streaks or
whitecaps needed, well before I cannot escape over the back to Carson..

The water south of sand harbor looks possible.

I've seen traces that retreat to the Carson valley via the 50 gap.

I gather the golf course in Kings beach has also been landed on, but these seem
very chancy.

Anyone else have a half decent plan B for the Tahoe basin?

John Cochrane

This land out really highlights the need for a good short game when flying XC.
If you had a two stroke, you wouldn't have been penalized.* Good drive to the
green!* Stay safe everyone.


I think he scored a birdie didn't he?

Better than a two-stroke handicap, with an electric he could have just flipped a
switch, turned a knob, and ended up in an attic.* Worked great for the guy in
Connecticut.* And that Kawa guy in Italy.


And 100s of uneventful saves by electric gliders we never hear about, because they
were successful. The two incidents you mention were caused by pilot errors, not
electric glider failures.

Starting an electric motor now counts as a "save"? :-)


I'm not counting, but sure, if something "saves" you from an undesired landing,
let's call it a "save". If the method of your save is important to anyone, they
can always ask you for details. It doesn't save your scoring in contests, of
course, unlike blundering into lift on the turn to base (for example).

--
Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me)
- "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation"
https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1

 




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