Emergency Descents with ATC COMS - Video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxkiT8gWIQo

Had never done an emergency descent with banking as a tool. It was
suggested to me to try this with a 90 degree bank.

Very interesting experience as it really works and works quickly! I
tried 2 without banking and 2 with banking of which the video contains
one of each.

Video contains both outside and instrumentation views but the
instrumentation view unfortunately wasn't as good as I hoped. Camera
power saving feature shut the camera off and I lost my zoom setting.

Comments here or on the video most appreciated on helping me improve
the technique as this was my first time doing this

On Aug 22, 9:51*pm, " wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxkiT8gWIQo

Had never done an emergency descent with banking as a tool. *It was
suggested to me to try this with a 90 degree bank.

Very interesting experience as it really works and works quickly! *I
tried 2 without banking and 2 with banking of which the video contains
one of each.

Video contains both outside and instrumentation views but the
instrumentation view unfortunately wasn't as good as I hoped. *Camera
power saving feature shut the camera off and I lost my zoom setting.

Comments here or on the video most appreciated on helping me improve
the technique as this was my first time doing this

Question for you -- What are the Sundowner limits on pitch and bank?

Another speedy way down is a slip of course -- it also allows enough
throttle to keep the engine warm.

On Aug 22, 9:41*pm, a wrote:

Question for you -- What are the Sundowner limits on pitch and bank?

Another speedy way down is a slip of course -- it also allows enough
throttle to keep the engine warm.

Interesting question as I don't think there is a limit for pitch and
bank? I never heard of this?

Per FAR 91.303, 90 degree bank is not considered an acro maneuver as
banks are not abrupt changes in attitude the way I understand it. It
would be considered a commercial maneuver I think.

In article BeechSundowner writes:
On Aug 22, 9:41=A0pm, a wrote:

Question for you -- What are the Sundowner limits on pitch and bank?

Another speedy way down is a slip of course -- it also allows enough
throttle to keep the engine warm.

Interesting question as I don't think there is a limit for pitch and
bank? I never heard of this?

Per FAR 91.303, 90 degree bank is not considered an acro maneuver as
banks are not abrupt changes in attitude the way I understand it. It
would be considered a commercial maneuver I think.


91.303 clearly says:
For the purposes of this section, aerobatic flight means an intentional
maneuver involving an abrupt change in an aircraft's attitude, an abnormal
attitude, or abnormal acceleration, not necessary for normal flight.

I think it can reasonably be claimed that 90 degrees bank is "an abnormal attitude".


91.307(c) says that if there were any passengers, everyone must be wearing
an approved parachute. I guess you could play with these solo, but it would
be a lot smarter to have an instructor experienced in this along for the first
few times.

Alan

On Aug 22, 10:41*pm, a wrote:
On Aug 22, 9:51*pm, " wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxkiT8gWIQo

Had never done an emergency descent with banking as a tool. *It was
suggested to me to try this with a 90 degree bank.

Very interesting experience as it really works and works quickly! *I
tried 2 without banking and 2 with banking of which the video contains
one of each.

Video contains both outside and instrumentation views but the
instrumentation view unfortunately wasn't as good as I hoped. *Camera
power saving feature shut the camera off and I lost my zoom setting.

Comments here or on the video most appreciated on helping me improve
the technique as this was my first time doing this

Question for you -- What are the Sundowner limits on pitch and bank?

Another speedy way down is a slip of course -- it also allows enough
throttle to keep the engine warm.

I don't have the documentation handy and my memory may be in error,
but I think the Mooney's limits when used in the general utility
category are 30 degrees pitch 60 degrees bank. Since it's used mainly
for XC, mostly under IFR, there's no reason to ever come close to
those limits. I wondered if the Sundowner certification was markedly
different.

On Aug 23, 7:52*am, a wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:41*pm, a wrote:





On Aug 22, 9:51*pm, " wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxkiT8gWIQo

Had never done an emergency descent with banking as a tool. *It was
suggested to me to try this with a 90 degree bank.

Very interesting experience as it really works and works quickly! *I
tried 2 without banking and 2 with banking of which the video contains
one of each.

Video contains both outside and instrumentation views but the
instrumentation view unfortunately wasn't as good as I hoped. *Camera
power saving feature shut the camera off and I lost my zoom setting.

Comments here or on the video most appreciated on helping me improve
the technique as this was my first time doing this

Question for you -- What are the Sundowner limits on pitch and bank?

Another speedy way down is a slip of course -- it also allows enough
throttle to keep the engine warm.

I don't have the documentation handy and my memory may be in error,
but I think the Mooney's limits when used in the general utility
category are 30 degrees pitch 60 degrees bank. *Since it's used mainly
for XC, mostly under IFR, there's no reason to ever come close to
those limits. I wondered if the Sundowner certification was markedly
different.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Ah, here it is, and it isn't just Mooneys.

a. FAR Section 91.71 defines "acrobatic flight" as "an
intentional maneuver involving an abrupt change in an aircraft's
attitude, an abnormal attitude, or abnormal acceleration, not
necessary for normal flight." In addition, Section 91.15(c)
indirectly refers to acrobatic flight in which it specifies that
"unless each occupant of the aircraft is wearing an approved
parachute, no pilot of a civil aircraft, carrying any person
(other than a crewmember) may execute any intentional maneuver
that exceeds:

(1) A bank of 60 degrees relative to the horizon; or

(2) A nose-up or nose-down attitude of 30 degrees
relative to the horizon."

On Aug 23, 6:57*am, a wrote:
* * * * * * * (1) *A bank of 60 degrees relative to the horizon; or

* * * * * * * (2) *A nose-up or nose-down attitude of 30 degrees
* * * relative to the horizon."

Check out the following references.

FARS 91.303 defines Acrobatic flight. http://www.risingup.com/fars/info/part91-303-FAR.shtml
This was only a bank exercise (NOT pitch), recovery was not an abrupt
attitude change as you can see in the video.

FARS 91.307 http://www.risingup.com/fars/info/part91-307-FAR.shtml
defines when a parachute is required. I was solo (I was NOT carrying
other people in this video)

This maneuver I was told is a maneuver for commercial jet jockeys and
they are not certified for aerobatics.

On Aug 23, 7:57*am, a wrote:
On Aug 23, 7:52*am, a wrote:





On Aug 22, 10:41*pm, a wrote:

On Aug 22, 9:51*pm, " wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxkiT8gWIQo

Had never done an emergency descent with banking as a tool. *It was
suggested to me to try this with a 90 degree bank.

Very interesting experience as it really works and works quickly! *I
tried 2 without banking and 2 with banking of which the video contains
one of each.

Video contains both outside and instrumentation views but the
instrumentation view unfortunately wasn't as good as I hoped. *Camera
power saving feature shut the camera off and I lost my zoom setting..

Comments here or on the video most appreciated on helping me improve
the technique as this was my first time doing this

Question for you -- What are the Sundowner limits on pitch and bank?

Another speedy way down is a slip of course -- it also allows enough
throttle to keep the engine warm.

I don't have the documentation handy and my memory may be in error,
but I think the Mooney's limits when used in the general utility
category are 30 degrees pitch 60 degrees bank. *Since it's used mainly
for XC, mostly under IFR, there's no reason to ever come close to
those limits. I wondered if the Sundowner certification was markedly
different.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Ah, here it is, and it isn't just Mooneys.

* * * * * a. *FAR Section 91.71 defines "acrobatic flight" as "an
* * * intentional maneuver involving an abrupt change in an aircraft's
* * * attitude, an abnormal attitude, or abnormal acceleration, not
* * * necessary for normal flight." *In addition, Section 91.15(c)
* * * indirectly refers to acrobatic flight in which it specifies that
* * * "unless each occupant of the aircraft is wearing an approved
* * * parachute, no pilot of a civil aircraft, carrying any person
* * * (other than a crewmember) may execute any intentional maneuver
* * * that exceeds:

* * * * * * * (1) *A bank of 60 degrees relative to the horizon; or

* * * * * * * (2) *A nose-up or nose-down attitude of 30 degrees
* * * relative to the horizon."- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Another minor issue -- if you are going to do steep descending turns
in a low winged airplane, you may be a little better off making the
turns to the left. Visibility into the space you are turning into
would be better.

Also, question for the readers -- does anyone flying left seat in a
low wing airplane do their slips with right wing low?

On Aug 23, 10:40*am, a wrote:

Another minor issue -- if you are going to do steep descending turns
in a low winged airplane, you may be a little better off making the
turns to the left. Visibility into the space you are turning into
would be better.

The reason I went right was to practice mid air collision avoidance.
For head on's, your suppose to turn right from what I understand.

Also, question for the readers -- does anyone flying left seat in a
low wing airplane do their slips with right wing low?

I find it more comfortable with my left wing low for the very reason
you say above, visibility is better rather then having to look across
the cabin and not seeing the ground as much.

In article
,
a wrote:

Another minor issue -- if you are going to do steep descending turns
in a low winged airplane, you may be a little better off making the
turns to the left. Visibility into the space you are turning into
would be better.

Also, question for the readers -- does anyone flying left seat in a
low wing airplane do their slips with right wing low?

I will if there's a crosswind from the right. That would be flying a
Tecnam Sierra, being the only low-wing aircraft I've flown in a long
time.