First IFR flight after checkride

john smith wrote:


You already have an IFR CLEARANCE, you just do not have an IFR RELEASE.
They are not the same thing.
Hence you can request a VFR DEPARTURE with an IFR CLEARANCE.

You are still a little hazy on this. If you depart VFR you are not in
the system, period. You get absolutely no separation of any kind
whatsoever. You may as well have taken off VFR and requested your
clearance enroute.

Newps wrote:


john smith wrote:


You already have an IFR CLEARANCE, you just do not have an IFR RELEASE.
They are not the same thing.
Hence you can request a VFR DEPARTURE with an IFR CLEARANCE.


You are still a little hazy on this. If you depart VFR you are not in
the system, period. You get absolutely no separation of any kind
whatsoever. You may as well have taken off VFR and requested your
clearance enroute.

You already have your clearance (Puddle Jumper 12345 is cleared as
filed, hold for release.)
You just have to get active in the system. That is where the previous
posting comes in. You will be told the who, when, where to contact to
get activated.
Think of it as an amended departure clearance to a point in space (Point
X). Once you reach Point X and contact the facility they will again
amend your clearance to your destination (from Point X). You do not have
to refile, they already have the flight plan on file, they are just
sequencing you into the flow with the required separation.
Yes, you are VFR on an IFR flight plan that has been filed and a
clearance issued, but ATC is not responsible for your separation from
other aircraft. If it VFR, it is a tool to expedite your departure.
Do you want to wait 15 minutes for that 152 that is practicing the VOR
Approach inbound on the hold with a headwind? Or, do you want to depart?

Here is the test to know that I am really VFR and not IFR with a VFR
Departure...

ATC: "Puddle Jumper 12345, squawk VFR."

While waiting for my release, ATC says "I have an aircaft on approach.
Can't release you until he cancels. Can you depart VFR?" I say fine. I
keep the same squawk code, depart under VFR, and then get my release in
the air. Why is this such a big deal?



Dave Butler wrote in
:


If another airplane is flying an approach into the airport, you
cannot depart IFR. In those cases ATC may assign a VFR departure. You
see an avoid the other airplane until you reach your cruising
altitude.

Oh, my.

It's not up to me to decide whether I can depart IFR because "another
airplane is flying an approach into the airport". I either get a
clearance, or I don't.

AFAIK ATC can't "assign a VFR departure". Please show me where it says
they can do that.

*I* can decide to depart VFR rather than wait for a clearance. That is
not an IFR operation. In that case I am VFR, until I obtain a
clearance, whether that's at my cruising altitude or some other
altitude.

*I* can request a VFR climb while on an instrument clearance. "VFR
climb" is defined terminology. "VFR departure" is not.

Others say a VFR climb can be requested right from the airport
surface, with the issuance of an instrument clearance for departure.
I've never seen/heard this done, but I don't see any regulatory reason
why it should not be possible, and I defer to those who say they have
done it.

Dave

Newps wrote:


Others say a VFR climb can be requested right from the airport surface,
with the issuance of an instrument clearance for departure. I've never
seen/heard this done, but I don't see any regulatory reason why it
should not be possible, and I defer to those who say they have done it.

A VFR climb comes in handy in the mountains. Busy places like Salt Lake
see a lot of VFR climbs by the airlines so they don't have to get
vectored to hell and gone for their climb.



I heard this at FLG just this past Saturday. A dash 8 was departing, and
they got "VFR climb approved" or some such wording, direct from clearance
delivery.

Mike