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Ventus rigging advice, please?



 
 
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  #51  
Old August 10th 19, 03:56 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
danlj
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Posts: 106
Default Ventus rigging advice, please?

On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 4:08:34 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Tuesday, June 25, 2019 at 5:00:05 AM UTC-4, John McLaughlin wrote:

Having read the entire string of postings I am surprised to see that nowhere is lubrication mentioned. All the tips are great, but a little grease goes a long way in taking a little of the hassle out of rigging S-H sailplanes.


DO NOT put any aromatics on the carbon fiber parts!! the resin will absorb it slowly and eventually the sockets get smaller and the tubes larger. At first this helps snug the fit, but later it's hard to remove. The only safe lube in this regard is high-temperature graphite, which doesn't have the absorbable aromatics and does decrease friction to the cost of slightly dark fingers.

How I know? -- when I bought my Ventus 19 years ago, the owner said, "lubricate everything!" So I followed his lead, to my regret. Two years later, some 900-grit emery paper repaired the problem. Schempp-Hirth said, after hearing my story, "Lubricate nothing!!"

One reason to lube the metal fittings is to prevent fretting corrosion. Over-lubrication just captures dust.
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  #52  
Old August 10th 19, 04:08 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
danlj
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Posts: 106
Default Ventus rigging advice, please?

On Wednesday, August 7, 2019 at 8:02:20 PM UTC-5, 2G wrote:
On Wednesday, August 7, 2019 at 9:09:19 AM UTC-7, wrote:
On Saturday, August 3, 2019 at 9:47:38 PM UTC-6, Charlie M. (UH & 002 owner/pilot) wrote:
A clean set of pins and some lube goes a long way in rigging......period......


+1 for my Ventus B. I spent a year or two trying to figure out why, with all things to the best of my knowledge the same, sometimes the wings would protest and sometimes not. Fresh lube each rigging has provided the answer.


...and you simultaneously figured out how to align the wings to the fuse. Don't believe me? Misalign the wings and see if they still go on. Alignment is the key (I have had no problem assembling gliders w/o ANY lube)...


Agreed: "Alignment is the key"
BUT, in solo rigging the second wing tends to push the first back out.
There are TWO serviceable ways to handle this.
1: Align the first wing very carefully, so that the gap between fuselage and root is even and small, fore and aft, top and bottom. This takes a extra couple of minutes.
Then TAPE the gap. The tape holds the first wing in very nicely.
2: After aligning the first wing, insert the main spar pin less than halfway. Then fold a 3 x 5 card or similar stiff, thick paper several times and jam it into the gap between the pin and the "hat shelf".
This works very well until the pressure on the bolts that hold the "hat shelf" in place erodes the fiberglass. You can prep for this by reinforcing the bolt holes on the front surface of the "hat shelf" with aluminum or wood (glue holds wood better), and the edge the pressed against the main spar pin likewise.
I did this many years ago, and it greatly helped to hold the first wing in place.
3: I strongly recommend folding the seatback forward and NOT folding it back until the main spar pin is in place and saftied, to ensure against failing to insert it fully. (Wing gap tape *will* hold the wings on for at least an hour, but is not recommended...)
  #53  
Old August 10th 19, 08:47 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
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Posts: 307
Default Ventus rigging advice, please?

On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 3:56:44 PM UTC+1, danlj wrote:


DO NOT put any aromatics on the carbon fiber parts!! the resin will absorb it slowly and eventually the sockets get smaller and the tubes larger. At first this helps snug the fit, but later it's hard to remove. The only safe lube in this regard is high-temperature graphite, which doesn't have the absorbable aromatics and does decrease friction to the cost of slightly dark fingers.

How I know? -- when I bought my Ventus 19 years ago, the owner said, "lubricate everything!" So I followed his lead, to my regret. Two years later, some 900-grit emery paper repaired the problem. Schempp-Hirth said, after hearing my story, "Lubricate nothing!!"

One reason to lube the metal fittings is to prevent fretting corrosion. Over-lubrication just captures dust.



As someone who has owned 5 (soon 6) Schempp-Hirth gliders I am struggling to come up with any carbon fibre (or GRP) parts I would ever think of greasing for ease of rigging.
  #54  
Old August 11th 19, 04:17 AM
Ventus_a Ventus_a is offline
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Posts: 155
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by View Post
On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 3:56:44 PM UTC+1, danlj wrote:


DO NOT put any aromatics on the carbon fiber parts!! the resin will absorb it slowly and eventually the sockets get smaller and the tubes larger. At first this helps snug the fit, but later it's hard to remove. The only safe lube in this regard is high-temperature graphite, which doesn't have the absorbable aromatics and does decrease friction to the cost of slightly dark fingers.

How I know? -- when I bought my Ventus 19 years ago, the owner said, "lubricate everything!" So I followed his lead, to my regret. Two years later, some 900-grit emery paper repaired the problem. Schempp-Hirth said, after hearing my story, "Lubricate nothing!!"

One reason to lube the metal fittings is to prevent fretting corrosion. Over-lubrication just captures dust.



As someone who has owned 5 (soon 6) Schempp-Hirth gliders I am struggling to come up with any carbon fibre (or GRP) parts I would ever think of greasing for ease of rigging.
Some may think the spar stub on the 16.6 or 17.6 tips and it's corresponding socket in the wing for mounting them is ripe for some grease but it's not a good idea

:-) Colin

p.s. my 16.6 tips on my Va were a little loose and a wrap with Teflon tape on the spar sub tightened up the fit without making it hard to fit or remove them

Last edited by Ventus_a : August 11th 19 at 09:06 AM.
  #55  
Old August 11th 19, 09:05 AM
Ventus_a Ventus_a is offline
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First recorded activity by AviationBanter: May 2010
Posts: 155
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Quote:
Originally Posted by View Post
On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 3:56:44 PM UTC+1, danlj wrote:


DO NOT put any aromatics on the carbon fiber parts!! the resin will absorb it slowly and eventually the sockets get smaller and the tubes larger. At first this helps snug the fit, but later it's hard to remove. The only safe lube in this regard is high-temperature graphite, which doesn't have the absorbable aromatics and does decrease friction to the cost of slightly dark fingers.

How I know? -- when I bought my Ventus 19 years ago, the owner said, "lubricate everything!" So I followed his lead, to my regret. Two years later, some 900-grit emery paper repaired the problem. Schempp-Hirth said, after hearing my story, "Lubricate nothing!!"

One reason to lube the metal fittings is to prevent fretting corrosion. Over-lubrication just captures dust.



As someone who has owned 5 (soon 6) Schempp-Hirth gliders I am struggling to come up with any carbon fibre (or GRP) parts I would ever think of greasing for ease of rigging.
I agree. I've never considered lubricating any composite part on any of gliders I've owned/operated. Metal fittings yes but otherwise just keep everything clean

:-) Colin
  #56  
Old August 11th 19, 02:58 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Dan Marotta
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Posts: 3,645
Default Ventus rigging advice, please?

Who would even think that advice to lubricate "everything" would include
FRP materials?

On 8/11/2019 2:05 AM, Ventus_a wrote:
;997573 Wrote:
On Saturday, August 10, 2019 at 3:56:44 PM UTC+1, danlj wrote:
-

DO NOT put any aromatics on the carbon fiber parts!! the resin will
absorb it slowly and eventually the sockets get smaller and the tubes
larger. At first this helps snug the fit, but later it's hard to remove.
The only safe lube in this regard is high-temperature graphite, which
doesn't have the absorbable aromatics and does decrease friction to the
cost of slightly dark fingers.

How I know? -- when I bought my Ventus 19 years ago, the owner said,
"lubricate everything!" So I followed his lead, to my regret. Two years
later, some 900-grit emery paper repaired the problem. Schempp-Hirth
said, after hearing my story, "Lubricate nothing!!"

One reason to lube the metal fittings is to prevent fretting corrosion.
Over-lubrication just captures dust.-


As someone who has owned 5 (soon 6) Schempp-Hirth gliders I am
struggling to come up with any carbon fibre (or GRP) parts I would ever
think of greasing for ease of rigging.

I agree. I've never considered lubricating any composite part on any of
gliders I've owned/operated. Metal fittings yes but otherwise just keep
everything clean

:-) Colin





--
Dan, 5J
 




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