FCC talking about relaxing cell phone rules

The news lately has mentioned that the FCC is meeting to discuss relaxing
the ban on using cell phones in airplanes. Most of the news coverage focuses
on the implications for airline passengers. They said that the FAA would
also
have to change rules before airline passengers could use cell phones.
The FCC is mainly concerned with interference with ground based use.
The FAA is mostly concerned about interference with aircraft electronics.
Does the FAA prohibit cell phone use in private aircraft, or is that just an
FCC rule? If it becomes legal to use a cell phone from the air, I may have
to look into one of those headset adapters for cell phones.

Does the FAA prohibit cell phone use in private aircraft, or is that just an
FCC rule?

It's an FCC rule, designed to avoid overloading the old style analog
cell sites. The rule is thought not to apply to the newer digital
cell service (but I don't think it's been tested in court).

The FAA rule for part 135 ops (135.144) essentially lets the operator
of the aircraft determine what they will allow and disallow. They
make a determination that a device will or will not interfere (but
then if they determine wrong, and an accident occurs, the "careless
and reckless" clause will certainly be trotted out). I don't think
there is an equivalent rule for part 91 ops; the pilot is responsible
for the safety of the flight, which by default includes portable
electronic devices.

Jose
--
Freedom. It seemed like a good idea at the time.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Jose wrote

I don't think there is an equivalent rule for part 91 ops;
the pilot is responsible for the safety of the flight,
which by default includes portable electronic devices.

Section 91.21: Portable electronic devices.
(a) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, no person may
operate, nor may any operator or pilot in command of an aircraft allow
the operation of, any portable electronic device on any of the following
U.S.-registered civil aircraft:

(1) Aircraft operated by a holder of an air carrier operating certificate
or an operating certificate; or

(2) Any other aircraft while it is operated under IFR.

(b) Paragraph (a) of this section does not apply to—

(1) Portable voice recorders;

(2) Hearing aids;

(3) Heart pacemakers;

(4) Electric shavers; or

(5) Any other portable electronic device that the operator of the
aircraft has determined will not cause interference with the navigation
or communication system of the aircraft on which it is to be used.

(c) In the case of an aircraft operated by a holder of an air carrier
operating certificate or an operating certificate, the determination
required by paragraph (b)(5) of this section shall be made by that
operator of the aircraft on which the particular device is to be used. In
the case of other aircraft, the determination may be made by the pilot in
command or other operator of the aircraft.

"Reid & Julie Baldwin" wrote in message
...
The news lately has mentioned that the FCC is meeting to discuss relaxing
the ban on using cell phones in airplanes. Most of the news coverage
focuses
on the implications for airline passengers. They said that the FAA would
also
have to change rules before airline passengers could use cell phones.
The FCC is mainly concerned with interference with ground based use.
The FAA is mostly concerned about interference with aircraft electronics.
Does the FAA prohibit cell phone use in private aircraft, or is that just
an
FCC rule? If it becomes legal to use a cell phone from the air, I may have
to look into one of those headset adapters for cell phones.


IIRC the FARs do not prohibit the use of cell phones in flight for part 91
ops in VFR. When operating on an IFR flight plan I believe there are
restrictions on operation of equipment that can be construed as a ban on the
use of cellphones. The operative regulation in either case though is with
the FCC who I do believe prohibits airborne use of cell phones, though it is
utterly unenforceable.

As a very frequent airline flyer, this sounds like an awful idea to me.
First, it's bad enough having to listen to the guys yelling into their
phones before they shut the door. Second, those 2-5 hours I'm in the
aluminum tube are the last hours of my life when my
boss/clients/girlfriend/etc do not expect me to be reachable by phone,
email, or text message. I'd much rather keep it that way.

-cwk.

"Reid & Julie Baldwin" wrote:
The news lately has mentioned that the FCC is meeting to
discuss relaxing the ban on using cell phones in airplanes.

Interference and electronics aside, just out of common COURTESY to
others, I hope the current rule is upheld.

How many calls CAN'T wait until the passenger is back on the ground? In
airliners, subjecting the person/people in seats around you to your
cellphone chatter when there's no choice about where you sit is both
inconsiderate and rude.

We have cellphones belonging to employees and customers ringing every
few minutes at work, 98% of which calls could have waited until a break,
lunch or after hours ... how do I know? because everyone in the entire
work area can hear the conversations whether they want to or not! Ditto
for restaurants, where being seated next to a table with an incessantly
ringing cellphone and the ensuing loud conversations is as much of an
intrusion as a toddler standing up in the booth behind you screaming in
your ear while you try to enjoy the quiet, relaxing dinner you waited
all week for.

The Post Office now has signs that read: "Please turn off your
cellphone. This is a cellphone-free establishment." Bravo! ...
cellphones are terrific for true emergencies, but some people have them
permanently attached to their ear, calling to announce whenever they
break a nail or lose an eyelash.

How many questionable things do you see people on the road do while they
have their cellphone up to their ear. I shudder to think about pilots
talking on their cellphone about who's going to the Christmas party and
with whom while missing another aircraft announcing their position and
intentions.

Aren't there *enough* potential distractions without adding CELLPHONES
to that mix?

Jose wrote:

It's an FCC rule, designed to avoid overloading the old style analog
cell sites. The rule is thought not to apply to the newer digital
cell service (but I don't think it's been tested in court).

It's never going to be tested in court because the FCC regulations explicitly
state that you may legally use PCS phones in the air. One problem there is that
most PCS phones still fall back on the old AMPS frequencies when they can't
connect over the higher frequencies.

George Patterson
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.

the FCC regulations explicitly
state that you may legally use PCS phones in the air.

Didn't know that. Can you point to the exact wording?

Jose
--
Freedom. It seemed like a good idea at the time.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

wrote in message
...

Interference and electronics aside, just out of common COURTESY to
others, I hope the current rule is upheld.

Tell me about it. Just a few minutes ago, while a sales rep guy was talking
to a colleague whose desk is right next to mine, the rep's phone rang. And
rang like a bell, I might add. His ringtone was "Hells Bells" by AC/DC and
it was loud! Now I'm about the biggest AC/DC fan in the world, but
gimmeabreak, it was very annoying. What was even more annoying was how long
it took him to actually answer the dang thing. It was like he wanted
everyone to hear his precious ringtone. Jeez.

You think things are bad now, just look around at your run of the mill
teenager. They all have phones nowadays. I went out for lunch one day at a
Subway which is close to the local high school. Four kids sat down at one
table and commenced to text each other or have loud phone conversations the
whole time they were there. Not to mention the annoying ringtones. And if
you think that a business person's phone rings a lot, you haven't seen a
teenager in action. I'm afraid there is a whole generation of cell phone
morons coming down the pike!

-Trent
PP-ASEL

If it's legal to hold a conversation with somebody (say, in a restaurant or
on a plane), why should it be *illegal* to hold a phone conversation?

Inconsiderate behavior is simply inconsiderate behavior. Legislating or
regulating when you are allowed to speak loudly and otherwise behave
inconsiderate of others around you is doomed to failure - and is indicative
of a country I would not want to live in.

Just because you don't have the spine to ask a loud talker to speak lower
doesn't mean that loud talker should be barred from talking loudly.

Further, I think you do a great disservice to the professionalism of pilots
and crew to suggest that simply having the ability to use a cell phone means
they will be used - much less to the detriment of passenger safety.

--
John T
http://tknowlogy.com/TknoFlyer
http://www.pocketgear.com/products_s...veloperid=4415
____________________

C Kingsbury wrote:

As a very frequent airline flyer, this sounds like an awful idea to
me. First, it's bad enough having to listen to the guys yelling into
their phones before they shut the door.

Grow a spine and ask them to quiet down.

Second, those 2-5 hours I'm
in the aluminum tube are the last hours of my life when my
boss/clients/girlfriend/etc do not expect me to be reachable by phone,
email, or text message. I'd much rather keep it that way.

If you tell me what model phone you have, I'm sure I can help find the power
switch for you. At the very least, I can help remove the battery.

For whose convenience is the phone: Yours or the people who call you?

To demonstrate, this morning I was "disposing of waste water" (to paraphrase
Casey W.) when my cell phone began vibrating (I don't use an audible ringer
unless I'm home, away from the phone and expecting a call). There's not a
snowball's chance in Hades that I'll answer the phone while taking care of
that kind of business - yet I've seen many others do so. I try to flush
just a little more loudly when presented the opportunity.

Cell phones are not the cause of inconsiderate behavior. Would you rather
treat the symptoms or kill the cancer causing the symptoms?

--
John T
http://tknowlogy.com/TknoFlyer
http://www.pocketgear.com/products_s...veloperid=4415
____________________