cost of ownership

"The Weiss Family" wrote in message
...

"Jeff" wrote in message
...
and if you do not want any costs, lease it back to a flight school,
chances
are it will rent enough that it covers all your costs.


If you do a lease-back, what type of insurance must you carry?

Forget it. You will never make a leaseback work. Plus it is the same as
renting a plane. You now have to schedule your own damn plane. You would
need commercial insurance. It is at least three times regular insurance.

making it work depends on what you want to work.
If you just want it to pay the bills then its a good thing, if your trying to
make money, probably will not do it.

as for the same as renting, thats depends on the FBO, I never scheduled my
plane, if no one had it, I took it.

Newps wrote:

"The Weiss Family" wrote in message
...

"Jeff" wrote in message
...
and if you do not want any costs, lease it back to a flight school,
chances
are it will rent enough that it covers all your costs.


If you do a lease-back, what type of insurance must you carry?

Forget it. You will never make a leaseback work. Plus it is the same as
renting a plane. You now have to schedule your own damn plane. You would
need commercial insurance. It is at least three times regular insurance.

Forget it, never listen to someone who has absolutely no business posting
this....



Forget it. You will never make a leaseback work. Plus it is the same as
renting a plane. You now have to schedule your own damn plane. You would
need commercial insurance. It is at least three times regular insurance.



Seriously, there are a thousand stores of bad leaseback situations. You
will not here the happy owners screaming at the top of their lungs. My
leaseback works okay. The key is to have a plane that can get the hours you
need it to. If yo uneed 40 plus hours/month, the plane needs to be a
primary trainer (or the only plane that fills the complex trainer role), and
needs to be something that fits in with the fleet (you don't necessarily
want to be the only low wing or high wing in a fleet).

You have to evaluate the fleet hours they are getting, who owns the other
planes, what will likley happen to the hours on the fleet from your adding a
plane (will it just spread the same renters thinner, or will it fill a need,
or what). Also, you need a rainy day fund.

You will likely be placed on the FBO's fleet insurance.

The Weiss Family wrote:

and if you do not want any costs, lease it back to a flight school, chances
are it will rent enough that it covers all your costs.

If you do a lease-back, what type of insurance must you carry?

Just a quick warning -- I think I've read one, maybe two postings from
people who had good or neutral experiences with lease-backs. All of the
others have described it as a trip to hell and back.

If you have to book the plane whenever you want to use it, and might find
that it's already booked by someone else, where are the benefits of owning?


All the best,


David

On Sun, 23 May 2004 16:16:12 -0700, "The Weiss Family"
wrote:


"Jeff" wrote in message
...
and if you do not want any costs, lease it back to a flight school,
chances
are it will rent enough that it covers all your costs.


If you do a lease-back, what type of insurance must you carry?

Commercial. Your rates will go up significantly, plus you will have
to get 100hr inspections, and fix all the stuff the renters break.

Before you get involved in one, do some searches on
http://www.dejanews.com about leasebacks. The topic has been
discussed at length in the rec.aviation.* newsgroups.

-Nathan

Jeff wrote:

and if you do not want any costs, lease it back to a flight school, chances
are it will rent enough that it covers all your costs.

Leasing the aircraft is a business venture, and you should treat it as one.
Typically, you will be treated as a renter, even if you own the aircraft. If you want
to fly it, this may be no problem if you take the plane during the week, but you may
have the same problems taking the plane for a weekend that you have today renting
other people's aircraft.

I have known people who made a decent amount of money leasing aircraft to flight
schools. I have also heard of people losing their shirts (or at least, their planes).
Much depends on the terms of the lease contracts. For what little it's worth, from
what I've seen, lessors on the West Coast tend to lose money on the deal.

George Patterson
I childproofed my house, but they *still* get in.

Based on what you have informed me, I can show her some estimated monthly
numbers, and see what happens...

Here's what my Fairchild costs me to fly per hour...
Hourly cost to Operate Fairchild.


Gas 13 gal@ $3.26/gal= $ 42.38
Oil 1 qt/hr@ $ 3.25/qt= $ 3.25
Insurance $1,500 year÷50 hours/yr= $ 30.00
Hangar $135x12 months ÷50= $ 32.40
Engine Resv. $5000 (600 hours)÷50 hours/yr(12)= $ 8.33
Other $5/hr $ 5.00
Total cost to Operate Fairchild 24 per hour… $121.36

The Weiss Family wrote:

I'm trying to figure out how much renting I have to do before it becomes
plausible to own.

If you can't afford to spend $5,000 a year on aviation, keep renting.

George Patterson
I childproofed my house, but they *still* get in.

My low estimates were about $7000.
Boy, I'm really borderline. I might be able to get my wife on board for
this.
I'm taking her flying next Saturday. If she catches the bug like I have it,
it might be an easier sell ;-)

"G.R. Patterson III" wrote in message
...


The Weiss Family wrote:

I'm trying to figure out how much renting I have to do before it becomes
plausible to own.

If you can't afford to spend $5,000 a year on aviation, keep renting.

George Patterson
I childproofed my house, but they *still* get in.

The Weiss Family wrote:

My low estimates were about $7000.

Well, my costs break down to about that.

Tiedown - $85.00/month. (was $75.00/month until recently).
Insurance - $1,200/year.
Annual - ~$900.
Maintenance - ~$500/year.
Fuel - ~$20.00/hour.
Engine bank - $7.00/hour.

So, we're over $3,500 a year without flying at all. After that, it depends on how
much you fly. Your figure is about right for about 100 hours of air time per year.

George Patterson
I childproofed my house, but they *still* get in.