Passed Instrument Checkride!

On Mar 21, 10:57 am, "Barry" wrote:
Nitpicking here, 91.175(c)(3) does not mention the "rabbit" aka RAIL
or Sequenced Flashers as an acceptable visual reference. You can
descend to 100' using the *approach lights* as a reference...
91.175(c) was changed to make "the runway environment" explicit.
RAILs or SFs are not on the list.

I disagree, 91.175 (c)(3)(i) says "the approach light system" which certainly
includes the sequenced flashers - see the AIM 2-1-1 which states "Some systems
include sequenced flashing lights".

So you don't have the "system" in sight if you only have the RAIL/
SF, but not the approach lights themselves, and the next clause refers
to descending with the approach lights in sight.

If "approach light system" is to be parsed as lights plus RAIL, you
need both. If you parse it as the lights, you need the lights. It
doesn't say "any part of the approach light system".

From a practical point of view, in my experience, having *only* the
RAIL as a visual reference is more of a distraction than a help.


One important point that people often miss is that in addition to seeing the
lights, the pilot must have the required flight visibility in order to
continue the descent below DH. Since 100 feet above TDZE on glideslope is
only about 1000 feet from the threshold, if you can't see the runway well
before then, you probably don't have landing minimums, and are not authorized
to go below DH.

When you get to a 200' DH, you are 4000' from the fixed distance
marker, 3500' from the beginning of the TDZ and 3000' feet from the
threshold. So with a minimum 2400/1800 foot visibility, you won't be
able to see the threshold yet. That's why you are allowed to descend
to 100AGL with only the approach lights as a reference - you should be
able to see *them* if you have the required visibility.
(Parenthetically, if you can't, and can only see the RAIL, I find it
not credible that you do have the required visibility) At 200AGL (DH),
you get to decide whether to continue the approach on the basis of the
visibility at that instant and the presence of at least one the visual
references listed in 91.175. If at some time thereafter, eg at 100AGL
you still can't see the threshold, or for that matter the beginning of
the TDZ which is now 1500 feet away (the fixed distance marker is
still 2000 feet away, so with a 1800RVR minimum, you maybe can't see
it yet) *then* you have to miss the approach.

So you haven't thought through the logic here. It's true you'll need
to be able to see the runway before 100AGL, but you won't necessarily
be able to see it before DH. So you can't say you shouldn't have gone
below DH on the basis of not being able to see the runway at DH! You
also can't say retroactively that you shouldn't have gone below DH on
the basis of what you didn't see later. The required visibility is a
requirement that applies continuously below DH. In addition, there
are *specific* required visual references that apply at DH and
100AGL.

Congratulations on your checkride! Now when you have your head in the
clouds, you can bring the airplane too!

He asked what was the major problem with ice?
I said the accumulation of the added weight.

He was happy with this? Weight is an issue, but the bigger one is the
change in shape of the airfoil, leading to loss of lift and/or tail
effectiveness. Ice also tends to stay with you even after you exit
icing conditions (unless it gets warm enough for long enough).

Jose
--
Humans are pack animals. Above all things, they have a deep need to
follow something, be it a leader, a creed, or a mob. Whosoever fully
understands this holds the world in his hands.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

If it is really low weather, all you'll see is the RAIL/SF
at 200 feet. But you're more correct about what words
exactly are used.

and "should" should have been show.



wrote in message
oups.com...
On Mar 20, 3:57 pm, "Jim Macklin"
wrote:
DH, you make a decision AT DH while in a descent on GS, so
if you decide to go-around you will be below DH before the
airplane starts back up. It isn't 50 feet, you just have
to
decide and either continue or discontinue the approach.
You can use the approach light rabbit to continue below
DH,
but only to 100 feet unless you get more of the required
visual cues.

Nitpicking here, 91.175(c)(3) does not mention the "rabbit"
aka RAIL
or Sequenced Flashers as an acceptable visual reference. You
can
descend to 100' using the *approach lights* as a reference.
Below 100'
you need either the red side or terminating bars of the
approach
lights (if the approach lights have them!) or one of the
other
acceptable references, to continue your descent.

91.175(c) was changed to make "the runway environment"
explicit.
RAILs or SFs are not on the list.

Ice is aerodynamic spoiler, not weight.

VOR check, to check properly, swing the OBS and make sure
you get the proper deflection, 10 ° should be full scale
80° and the TO/FROM flag should be switching, if it
doesn't
your VOR has low sensitivity and may not should course
deviation at 25-50 miles, the needle will just center
while
you drift off course...

Other than that, congratulations.

--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--

That's why the lengths of lights, TDZ markings and such are
given, so you have a known standard with which to compare.


"Barry" wrote in message
. ..
| Nitpicking here, 91.175(c)(3) does not mention the
"rabbit" aka RAIL
| or Sequenced Flashers as an acceptable visual reference.
You can
| descend to 100' using the *approach lights* as a
reference...
| 91.175(c) was changed to make "the runway environment"
explicit.
| RAILs or SFs are not on the list.
|
| I disagree, 91.175 (c)(3)(i) says "the approach light
system" which certainly
| includes the sequenced flashers - see the AIM 2-1-1 which
states "Some systems
| include sequenced flashing lights".
|
| One important point that people often miss is that in
addition to seeing the
| lights, the pilot must have the required flight visibility
in order to
| continue the descent below DH. Since 100 feet above TDZE
on glideslope is
| only about 1000 feet from the threshold, if you can't see
the runway well
| before then, you probably don't have landing minimums, and
are not authorized
| to go below DH.
|
|

I think so, he sort of does the oral exam in a conversational way, and
I think I threw that out there while we were talking about it. One of
us might've mentioned the changing of the airfoil's shape, but it's
getting sketchy now...


On Mar 21, 12:27 pm, Jose wrote:
He asked what was the major problem with ice?
I said the accumulation of the added weight.

He was happy with this? Weight is an issue, but the bigger one is the
change in shape of the airfoil, leading to loss of lift and/or tail
effectiveness. Ice also tends to stay with you even after you exit
icing conditions (unless it gets warm enough for long enough).

Jose

I think so, he sort of does the oral exam in a conversational way, and
I think I threw that out there while we were talking about it. One of
us might've mentioned the changing of the airfoil's shape, but it's
getting sketchy now...

Hmmm. Then maybe he wasn't really listening? Or he really =does= think
that the weight of ice is the main factor?

I had a flight instructor (from Florida) giving me instrument lessons
(in the Northeast); after I had spent an hour unsuccessfully removing
ice from the wings, I decided I didn't want to fly in that aircraft. He
acted as if he was ready to go flying in it and was put out that we had
to get another one. This wasn't too long after the airline crash in DC
with a Florida pilot who didn't respect ice.

Jose
--
Humans are pack animals. Above all things, they have a deep need to
follow something, be it a leader, a creed, or a mob. Whosoever fully
understands this holds the world in his hands.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

Jose wrote:
Congratulations on your checkride! Now when you have your head in the
clouds, you can bring the airplane too!

He asked what was the major problem with ice?
I said the accumulation of the added weight.


He was happy with this? Weight is an issue, but the bigger one is the
change in shape of the airfoil, leading to loss of lift and/or tail
effectiveness. Ice also tends to stay with you even after you exit
icing conditions (unless it gets warm enough for long enough).

Jose


He obviously didn;t really care about doing a real test - no partial
panel? WTF? I think I read that in the original post.

No wonder people plow into mountains all the time - anyone can pass the
practical. Instructors send their students to the "easiest" DE and the
rest is history (or statistics)

No offense to the OP - I am sure you were prepared and can fly well, but
the local examiner(s) here scare the **** out of me.

The examiner here does all the radio work and the flight is probably
about 40 minutes max. No way you can do three approaches, holds,
partial panel, attitude recovery, takeoff and landing in that amount of
time.

Then there are the DEs who won't do the test in actual. That is just
nuts.

I was surprised also on having no partial panel during the test. I'm
guessing he thinks that the instructor has signed me off, so therefore
I must know it, and he doesn't need to test on all tasks. For talking
on the radio, my examiner didn't want to contact approach for the
cross country portion because he wanted to control where we went.
After the cross country portion, he had me do the talking for the
approaches.

On Mar 21, 8:00 pm, Tim wrote:
He obviously didn;t really care about doing a real test - no partial
panel? WTF? I think I read that in the original post.

No wonder people plow into mountains all the time - anyone can pass the
practical. Instructors send their students to the "easiest" DE and the
rest is history (or statistics)

No offense to the OP - I am sure you were prepared and can fly well, but
the local examiner(s) here scare the **** out of me.

The examiner here does all the radio work and the flight is probably
about 40 minutes max. No way you can do three approaches, holds,
partial panel, attitude recovery, takeoff and landing in that amount of
time.

Then there are the DEs who won't do the test in actual. That is just
nuts.