2 aircraft cleared onto the same runway at the same time

This was a new one for me.

I was IFR this afternoon out of HPN for short practice flight. I was in
sequence number two at the runway waiting for departure. As the tower
controller cleared the Cessna in front of me to position and hold, he
asked him his direction of flight. The Cessna pilot responded
"Northbound". The controller then instructed the Cessna to position 50
feet north on Rwy 34, and then he cleared me to position and hold
behind the Cessna. The Cessna was VFR. I questioned the clearance,
reminding him that there was an airplane on the runway in front of me.
He told me to position and hold behind the traffic. As I taxiied into
position, he cleared the Cessna for takeoff and as soon as the Cessna
broke ground he cleared me for takeoff. I was using a DP which includes
a turn to the left. The Cessna was instructed to turn out to the right.

I've been flying out of HPN since 1992 and I have never seen or heard
of anything like this being done there before, ever.

Did I miss something??

"Tom Fleischman" k wrote in
message
news:250320051938408267%bodhijunkoneeightyeightjun ...
This was a new one for me.

I was IFR this afternoon out of HPN for short practice flight. I was in
sequence number two at the runway waiting for departure. As the tower
controller cleared the Cessna in front of me to position and hold, he
asked him his direction of flight. The Cessna pilot responded
"Northbound". The controller then instructed the Cessna to position 50
feet north on Rwy 34, and then he cleared me to position and hold
behind the Cessna. The Cessna was VFR. I questioned the clearance,
reminding him that there was an airplane on the runway in front of me.
He told me to position and hold behind the traffic. As I taxiied into
position, he cleared the Cessna for takeoff and as soon as the Cessna
broke ground he cleared me for takeoff. I was using a DP which includes
a turn to the left. The Cessna was instructed to turn out to the right.

I've been flying out of HPN since 1992 and I have never seen or heard
of anything like this being done there before, ever.

Did I miss something??

Never been to OSH eh? You get lined up six at a time.

In article
250320051938408267%bodhijunkoneeightyeightjunkatm ,
Tom Fleischman k wrote:

This was a new one for me.

I was IFR this afternoon out of HPN for short practice flight. I was in
sequence number two at the runway waiting for departure. As the tower
controller cleared the Cessna in front of me to position and hold, he
asked him his direction of flight. The Cessna pilot responded
"Northbound". The controller then instructed the Cessna to position 50
feet north on Rwy 34, and then he cleared me to position and hold
behind the Cessna. The Cessna was VFR. I questioned the clearance,
reminding him that there was an airplane on the runway in front of me.
He told me to position and hold behind the traffic. As I taxiied into
position, he cleared the Cessna for takeoff and as soon as the Cessna
broke ground he cleared me for takeoff. I was using a DP which includes
a turn to the left. The Cessna was instructed to turn out to the right.

I've been flying out of HPN since 1992 and I have never seen or heard
of anything like this being done there before, ever.

Did I miss something??

Hi Tom. That's a common trick the tower uses at HPN to get multiple
departures out quicker. I get it every once in a while. I can't say for
sure, but I suspect it's only possible when one of the flights is VFR.

Pretty sure it will only work for VFR VFR or VFR IFR. You need a
release from NY approach for the IFR departure and until the first one
is gone the second one would be tying up the runway which is something
they wouldn't like.

Another trick that can be employed where the runways and wind conditions
allow (like Bridgeport on a calm or light wind day). You are number 3
for departure on runway 24 and they have 3 people on final. Basically
you sit there and watch the hobbs tick over. The tower won't suggest it
but if you're comfortable with the wind for 29 you ask for a departure
on that runway. It does 2 nice things, 1 it gets you on your way sooner
and 2, there's one less departure for him to sequence along with the
incomings.

It helps to have intersections for both runways in more or less the same
place though.

Roy Smith wrote:

In article
250320051938408267%bodhijunkoneeightyeightjunkatm ,
Tom Fleischman k wrote:


This was a new one for me.

I was IFR this afternoon out of HPN for short practice flight. I was in
sequence number two at the runway waiting for departure. As the tower
controller cleared the Cessna in front of me to position and hold, he
asked him his direction of flight. The Cessna pilot responded
"Northbound". The controller then instructed the Cessna to position 50
feet north on Rwy 34, and then he cleared me to position and hold
behind the Cessna. The Cessna was VFR. I questioned the clearance,
reminding him that there was an airplane on the runway in front of me.
He told me to position and hold behind the traffic. As I taxiied into
position, he cleared the Cessna for takeoff and as soon as the Cessna
broke ground he cleared me for takeoff. I was using a DP which includes
a turn to the left. The Cessna was instructed to turn out to the right.

I've been flying out of HPN since 1992 and I have never seen or heard
of anything like this being done there before, ever.

Did I miss something??


Hi Tom. That's a common trick the tower uses at HPN to get multiple
departures out quicker. I get it every once in a while. I can't say for
sure, but I suspect it's only possible when one of the flights is VFR.

"Tom Fleischman" k wrote in
message
news:250320051938408267%bodhijunkoneeightyeightjun ...
This was a new one for me.

I was IFR this afternoon out of HPN for short practice flight. I was in
sequence number two at the runway waiting for departure. As the tower
controller cleared the Cessna in front of me to position and hold, he
asked him his direction of flight. The Cessna pilot responded
"Northbound". The controller then instructed the Cessna to position 50
feet north on Rwy 34, and then he cleared me to position and hold
behind the Cessna. The Cessna was VFR. I questioned the clearance,
reminding him that there was an airplane on the runway in front of me.
He told me to position and hold behind the traffic. As I taxiied into
position, he cleared the Cessna for takeoff and as soon as the Cessna
broke ground he cleared me for takeoff. I was using a DP which includes
a turn to the left. The Cessna was instructed to turn out to the right.

I've been flying out of HPN since 1992 and I have never seen or heard
of anything like this being done there before, ever.

Did I miss something??

I had the same thing at HPN two weeks ago. I was #2 at 34 behind another
single engine, both VFR and was cleared position & hold behind the other
aircraft. The only other time I've seen this was during my training. My
instructor & I flew to POU, where they cleared us onto the runway with
another plane. I remember my instructor asking me, "Do you know what the
tower is doing?" I replied, "I assume the plane in front is going to be
cleared for takeoff first because it wouldn't work the other way 'round." I
then heard him mutter "smart ass" under his breath.

In article 250320051938408267%bodhijunkoneeightyeightjunkatm , Tom Fleischman wrote:
This was a new one for me.

I was IFR this afternoon out of HPN for short practice flight. I was in

"Northbound". The controller then instructed the Cessna to position 50
feet north on Rwy 34, and then he cleared me to position and hold
behind the Cessna. The Cessna was VFR. I questioned the clearance,

I've been flying out of HPN since 1992 and I have never seen or heard
of anything like this being done there before, ever.

Did I miss something??

Nope. I've never seen that happen at HPN, but it's not uncommon at
other airports I've flown out of.


Morris

Dave Stadt wrote:
Never been to OSH eh? You get lined up six at a time.

My thought exactly. Perhaps the tower controller was getting prepped
for this year :-)



--
Jack Allison
PP-ASEL-IA Student-Arrow Buying Student

"When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the Earth
with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there
you will always long to return"
- Leonardo Da Vinci

(Remove the obvious from address to reply via e-mail)

Dave Stadt wrote:
"Tom Fleischman" k wrote in
message
news:250320051938408267%bodhijunkoneeightyeightjun ...

This was a new one for me.

I was IFR this afternoon out of HPN for short practice flight. I was in
sequence number two at the runway waiting for departure. As the tower
controller cleared the Cessna in front of me to position and hold, he
asked him his direction of flight. The Cessna pilot responded
"Northbound". The controller then instructed the Cessna to position 50
feet north on Rwy 34, and then he cleared me to position and hold
behind the Cessna. The Cessna was VFR. I questioned the clearance,
reminding him that there was an airplane on the runway in front of me.
He told me to position and hold behind the traffic. As I taxiied into
position, he cleared the Cessna for takeoff and as soon as the Cessna
broke ground he cleared me for takeoff. I was using a DP which includes
a turn to the left. The Cessna was instructed to turn out to the right.

I've been flying out of HPN since 1992 and I have never seen or heard
of anything like this being done there before, ever.

Did I miss something??


Never been to OSH eh? You get lined up six at a time.



True, and you get nearly a formation take-off.

Matt

Tom Fleischman wrote:
This was a new one for me.

I was IFR this afternoon out of HPN for short practice flight. I was in
sequence number two at the runway waiting for departure. As the tower
controller cleared the Cessna in front of me to position and hold, he
asked him his direction of flight. The Cessna pilot responded
"Northbound". The controller then instructed the Cessna to position 50
feet north on Rwy 34, and then he cleared me to position and hold
behind the Cessna. The Cessna was VFR. I questioned the clearance,
reminding him that there was an airplane on the runway in front of me.
He told me to position and hold behind the traffic. As I taxiied into
position, he cleared the Cessna for takeoff and as soon as the Cessna
broke ground he cleared me for takeoff. I was using a DP which includes
a turn to the left. The Cessna was instructed to turn out to the right.

I've been flying out of HPN since 1992 and I have never seen or heard
of anything like this being done there before, ever.

Do it all the time here at BIL.

Roy Smith wrote:




Hi Tom. That's a common trick the tower uses at HPN to get multiple
departures out quicker. I get it every once in a while. I can't say for
sure, but I suspect it's only possible when one of the flights is VFR.

IFR or VFR is not relavant.