USA - All students must show "papers"

On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 02:38:34 GMT, Jack wrote:

Lennie wrote:

This TSA thing will be made more rational before long, and I hope you'll
hold on to your hope of soaring. Your day will come.

I think my day came and went, but I napped through it.

It's been 35 years of the same thing, I can see an end to it, but that
doesn't mean I like it now, or the end. We're not supposed to bury
our children. Might be another year, might be ten, but I still don't
like looking at it.

Lennie

Some instructors, some clubs, and some FBO may well cease to operate
because of this rule.

Why? How great is the burden of photocopying documents provided by students?

From an outsiders point of view it looks like the terrorists have won a
significant victory if the US reaction is to clamp down so hard and make life
more difficult for the everyday citizen. The difficulty is that politicians
have to be seen to be doing something. It wont affect the terrorists one iota
but it appears to be taking a tough line.

Preserve us from our lords and Masters

"Roger Worden" wrote in message .com...
Some instructors, some clubs, and some FBO may well cease to operate
because of this rule.


Why? How great is the burden of photocopying documents provided by
students?



I agree Roger, how great indeed. We CFI's are currently required to
keep records of all instruction we give to each named individual.

LL

...We CFI's are currently required to
keep records of all instruction we give to each named individual.

In the U.S. instructors only need to maintain a record of test
recommendations, solo endorsements, and pre-solo written tests. During
my initial instructor exam the inspector asked me "are you required to
log each lesson given in your log book"? My answer was "No, but I think
it's a pretty good idea". The inspector responded with a vigorous nod of
the head.

See FAR 61.189

Tony V.

Roger Worden wrote:
Some instructors, some clubs, and some FBO may well cease to operate
because of this rule.

Why? How great is the burden of photocopying documents provided by students?

It's a bit deeper than that. About 10% of my students are (were)
resident aliens. Already one stopped training with me, decided
against buying an airplane because apparently he couldn't
be on the registration as a foriegn national, and now he has
returned to New Zealand.

Beyond that, I used to give away logbooks with a dual
entry to everyone I took on a "first ride." I had about 20-30%
success recruiting "walk-in" students this way. I don;t recall
any of these walk-ins having the ID the changes require on their
first "ride."

There's also a simple lack of confidence inspired. If I were
a resident alien, I would be very suspicious of the possibility
of future "improvements" to security, which may effectively
revoke my $5,000+ pilot's license.

Any freshman economics textbook dicusses the "velocity of money."
Essentially, it means that a 10% reduction in sales has an
amplified effect greater than 10%. This is the part about
the FBOs going out of business...

As if the proposed MOA and ATCAA near my own home gliderport weren't
enough to shut us down on it's own...
--

------------+
Mark J. Boyd

Bernie Lewis wrote:

I agree Roger, how great indeed. We CFI's are currently required to
keep records of all instruction we give to each named individual.

In all of these requirements, I've never before read of one
that required copying anything before this. All of my recordkeeping
requirements before this involved only a pen and paper.

And all of my students could begin flight training immediately, and
in the buff if they so desired.

Woulda been a great scene in "Team America," eh?
F**k Yeah!

Just my $1.05
--

------------+
Mark J. Boyd

SSA position to date

http://www.ssa.org/society/ListGovNe...?Action=&id=39

Suppose I (A Canadian) visited a commercial operation in the USA and
required a checkflight to rent their Ventus. Could the new regs interpret
a checkflight as "training"?

--
Tony Burton

Tony Verhulst wrote:

In the U.S. instructors only need to maintain a record of test
recommendations, solo endorsements, and pre-solo written tests. During
my initial instructor exam the inspector asked me "are you required to
log each lesson given in your log book"? My answer was "No, but I think
it's a pretty good idea". The inspector responded with a vigorous nod of
the head.

See FAR 61.189

The CFI isn't required to log it in the CFI logbook,
but the CFI is required to log it in the student's logbook.

(a) A flight instructor must sign the logbook of each person to whom
that instructor has given flight training or ground training.

I have a bunch of white labels (stickers) that I use, and
write out the entry with the pilot's name, and give it to them
to put in their logbook (if they didn't bring a logbook with
them). For brand new pilots, I give them a new logbook
(about $3 each as I get them in bulk).
--

------------+
Mark J. Boyd