Leaving Usnet Groups, Bye

On Thu, 05 May 2005 02:19:24 GMT, "Dudley Henriques"
dhenriques@noware .net wrote:


"Rich Lemert" wrote in message
...
Dudley Henriques wrote:
.......or what has come to be for me at least; the ultimate mystery of
Usenet......that being the existence of people out here who actually will
wait patiently for a particular poster they don't like to post
something....ANYTHING......and then check every word...every
statement......every meaning....in the twisted hope that the poster they
don't particularly like very well will make a mistake.....no matter how
tiny a mistake or error...that THEY can jump on immediately to use as
"absolute proof" that the object of their "exposure" is flawed!

Consider yourself lucky if they're actually waiting for you to post
something so they can try to embarass you with it. I've been a regular
in sci.research.careers, and they've got a guy over there who doesn't
even bother waiting for me to post something in order to mis-represent
my views.

Rich Lemert

It's become more or less expected on these groups by many who post on them.
It's no big deal really, but it takes a lot of the fun out of posting and
eventually runs a lot of fairly well qualified and experienced people off

We've lost a lot of very knowledgeable posters over the years and some
was due to actual harassment at the work place and home by posters who
couldn't win on here.

I've received unsolicited pointers and suggestions on both building
and flying from some of the top people, if not the top people, in
their fields on here. People I'm proud to say were willing to take
the time to help. Unfortunately they are people I seldom see on these
groups (this is cross posted) any more.

the groups, or as it has done in my case, turns them into totally hostile
posters.

You mean you've changed? :-))

My Usenet persona has come 180 degrees from when I first arrived on Usenet 6
years ago, especially on this group right here. I used to assume a neutral
or even friendly atmosphere from posters until shown otherwise. I now assume
a totally hostile environment unless I know the poster I'm dealing with (and
there are indeed some very fine people here) or the people posting with me
demonstrate to me that they are not hostile.

I only get hostile after having to redo the same part for the 5th or
6th time and it's 4:00 AM.

I have a habit of including personal experience when explaining
something and as I learned some things differently than others and
tend to be a stickler for *really* learning an airplane right out to
the edges of the envelope it does tend to grate on a few. OTOH it's
about the only way I really know how to explain things IRW.
(Oops...too much sim group time) IRW = In the real world for the non
simmers.
Those are not attempts to prove how good or poor I am, it's just me.
Those who know me, know that, others... :-)) When you challenge what
some take to be gospel in aviation a few can get down right
hostileLOL

And... I still use my real name although the e-mail address is
"munged' (but can be fixed to work)

The thing on the newsgroups is you can be any one. Only after
developing a posting history do any of us gain or lose credibility.


Dudley Henriques


73

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

"Roger" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 05 May 2005 02:08:25 GMT, "Dudley Henriques"
dhenriques@noware .net wrote:


wrote in message
news
On Thu, 05 May 2005 01:13:06 GMT, "John R. Copeland"
wrote:

"Dudley Henriques" dhenriques@noware .net wrote in message
rthlink.net...


Kind of makes you wonder what it must have been like for Alan Shepard
sitting on top of that Redstone just before they lit it....put
together
by
government workers after being assigned the job of building it as the
lowest
bidder for the contract.
:-))
Dudley Henriques


I thought Wally Schirra said that.

and I thought it was the private sector that bid on government
contracts, not "government workers".

Remind me in the future if I happen to state pi to extend it to it's
maximum

It's 22/7 You can't get closer than that. :-))

just for this newsgroup's more intellectual readers.

We have intellectuals on here?


Sometimes I wonder, but there actually ARE some really intelligent people on
this group. One thing I've noticed though....most who fit the description
have real names. :-)
Dudley

"Roger" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 02 May 2005 16:08:12 GMT, "Dudley Henriques"
dhenriques@noware .net wrote:

Actually, being retired, I really never give it a thought either way since
I
won't be flying again. It's apparently only a big deal for a few specific
morons on Usenet. My family, my friends, my professional associates past
and
present, and indeed even my country's government at the highest level seem
to be quite happy with things just the way they are.
Only on Usenet will one find the idiots an issue like this one will
attract.

Oh, they exist IRL as well, but they can't hide behind anonymous
signatures so they are less prone to expressing themselves. It's far
more hazardous there. :-)) So they tend to talk among themselves
where they might find some one who will listen.

Yep, true enough, but believe it or not, (maybe I'm some kind of exception),
but most of the people I've known professionally were straight shooters.
Of course a lot of the people I've known in aviation worked daily in it's
most dangerous environment. When you work in this arena, you have a tendency
to learn early on what's important and what isn't important in life. The
back stabbing and nit picking found at almost every level of the outside
professional work place for the most part doesn't exist with these people.
For the most part, it's a no nonsense, performance based world, and bull
**** walks there faster than any place else I've been to in my life.
Sort of the opposite of Usenet I guess :-))
Dudley

Don't sweat the idiots to much Dudley, I'd fly with ya anywhere!

Patrick
student SPL
aircraft structural mech

"Roger" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 05 May 2005 02:19:24 GMT, "Dudley Henriques"
dhenriques@noware .net wrote:

The thing on the newsgroups is you can be any one. Only after
developing a posting history do any of us gain or lose credibility.

This is both true and false in my experience with Usenet. A posting history
involving qualified and obviously experienced posters produces credibility
only with those on the group who know and appreciate sound knowledge and
information. With these people over time, posting is executed in an arena of
mutual respect for both sides of an issue.

Unfortunately, there exists on Usenet, an element that never actually enters
into the credibility equation because credibility isn't their main interest
when it comes to a specific poster. This element exists in an emotional
world where feelings govern actions.
You can have all the credibility in the world with the knowledgeable posters
on a group and you will simply never have credibility with this second
element.
So in the end, a typical Usenet experience for a credible poster will be a
mixture of intelligent discourse with the folks who know....and a constantly
deteriorating experience with the second element.
Every poster will react differently to this Usenet experience. The bottom
line on how long a credible poster will hang in on Usenet won't be found in
that poster's experience with other credible posters. Invariably, it will
depend entirely on just how much effect the poster absorbs from that second
undesirable element. Everyone has a different tolerance level. Some quit
early. Some don't mind it at all. Some like me just lose respect slowly for
the Usenet concept and drift in and out as the mood hits them. For me, it's
simply gone from useful and mutually respectful communication to what it is
now......not much of anything really....just a sparring match every now and
then with faceless people I don't know, and who surely don't know me!
Dudley

On Thu, 05 May 2005 02:08:25 GMT, "Dudley Henriques"
dhenriques@noware .net wrote:


wrote in message
news
On Thu, 05 May 2005 01:13:06 GMT, "John R. Copeland"
wrote:

"Dudley Henriques" dhenriques@noware .net wrote in message
thlink.net...


Kind of makes you wonder what it must have been like for Alan Shepard
sitting on top of that Redstone just before they lit it....put together
by
government workers after being assigned the job of building it as the
lowest
bidder for the contract.
:-))
Dudley Henriques


I thought Wally Schirra said that.

and I thought it was the private sector that bid on government
contracts, not "government workers".

Remind me in the future if I happen to state pi to extend it to it's maximum
just for this newsgroup's more intellectual readers.
Dudley Henriques



Well, then you would indeed have something to boast about, since it's
never been done.

Dudley Henriques wrote:

"Rich Lemert" wrote in message
...

Dudley Henriques wrote:

.......or what has come to be for me at least; the ultimate mystery of
Usenet......that being the existence of people out here who actually will
wait patiently for a particular poster they don't like to post
something....ANYTHING......and then check every word...every
statement......every meaning....in the twisted hope that the poster they
don't particularly like very well will make a mistake.....no matter how
tiny a mistake or error...that THEY can jump on immediately to use as
"absolute proof" that the object of their "exposure" is flawed!

Consider yourself lucky if they're actually waiting for you to post
something so they can try to embarass you with it. I've been a regular
in sci.research.careers, and they've got a guy over there who doesn't
even bother waiting for me to post something in order to mis-represent
my views.

Rich Lemert


It's become more or less expected on these groups by many who post on them.
It's no big deal really, but it takes a lot of the fun out of posting and
eventually runs a lot of fairly well qualified and experienced people off
the groups, or as it has done in my case, turns them into totally hostile
posters.
My Usenet persona has come 180 degrees from when I first arrived on Usenet 6
years ago, especially on this group right here. I used to assume a neutral
or even friendly atmosphere from posters until shown otherwise. I now assume
a totally hostile environment unless I know the poster I'm dealing with (and
there are indeed some very fine people here) or the people posting with me
demonstrate to me that they are not hostile.
Dudley Henriques

I've been using usenet for 10+ years and have found that people tend to
come across as more hostile in writing than they really are in person.
This happens in email as well. You don't have the inflection and other
nonverbal cues that you get in mano-y-mano conversation and it is easy
for things to escalate well beyond what anyone intended.

Sure, some folks are that way naturally, but I think fairly few in
reality. I think much more is inadvertant than intentional.

MAtt

"Dudley Henriques" dhenriques@noware .net wrote in message
ink.net...
Of course a lot of the people I've known in aviation worked daily in it's
most dangerous environment. When you work in this arena, you have a
tendency to learn early on what's important and what isn't important in
life. The back stabbing and nit picking found at almost every level of the
outside professional work place for the most part doesn't exist with these
people.

Forgive me if this comes out wrong, bit this reminds me of a few things I
discussed with my wife. She had problems with a few acquaintances that
imposed themselves as friends. They would set lunch dates with her and give
her grief if she did not accept or would cancel. Each meeting she would
find draining because these "friends" would complain about their lives
endlessly.

So I had to tell her a little thing I learned years ago that helped change
things, "Just because the phone rings doesn't mean you have to answer it."
This helped me when I was an Auxiliary police officer here in New York. An
unarmed volunteer in a very real police uniform walking the beat in Queens.
There you learn early on that just because a person is yelling profanity
doesn't mean you have to yell back.
You learn that flashing a badge doesn't mean squat to a person that is just
plain ****ed off, and also that no amount of reasoning will stop a person
that wants to rant. Working in this capacity one would think "well, real
cops have it easier because they have guns and people respect that." Well,
that isn't true. They have it worse.
You would think you could tell a person while in a police uniform that
"there is a power line down ahead, you can't drive down this road," that
they would not yell at you " I HAVE to get down that road. Nope.
You know what works best there? You say, "well you can't" and you direct
your attention elsewhere. They mutter and drive off. Arguing just prolongs
the incident.
So,

This brings me to my way if dealing with Usenet and it has a lot to do with
what you say here;
"you have a tendency to learn early on what's important and what isn't
important in life"

ignoring the knuckleheads "phone calls" is the first step to getting
something from usenet besides a headache.


--
Dave A
Aging Student Pilot




"Roger" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 02 May 2005 16:08:12 GMT, "Dudley Henriques"
dhenriques@noware .net wrote:

Actually, being retired, I really never give it a thought either way
since I
won't be flying again. It's apparently only a big deal for a few
specific
morons on Usenet. My family, my friends, my professional associates past
and
present, and indeed even my country's government at the highest level
seem
to be quite happy with things just the way they are.
Only on Usenet will one find the idiots an issue like this one will
attract.

Oh, they exist IRL as well, but they can't hide behind anonymous
signatures so they are less prone to expressing themselves. It's far
more hazardous there. :-)) So they tend to talk among themselves
where they might find some one who will listen.

Yep, true enough, but believe it or not, (maybe I'm some kind of
exception), but most of the people I've known professionally were straight
shooters.
For the most part, it's a no nonsense, performance based world, and bull
**** walks there faster than any place else I've been to in my life.
Sort of the opposite of Usenet I guess :-))
Dudley

Well, then you would indeed have something to boast about, since it's
never been done.

Sure it has. I did it last week. The last digit of pi is eleven.

Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Dave A." wrote in message
news:bqoee.15830$c86.1122@trndny09...
"Dudley Henriques" dhenriques@noware .net wrote in message
ink.net...
Of course a lot of the people I've known in aviation worked daily in it's
most dangerous environment. When you work in this arena, you have a
tendency to learn early on what's important and what isn't important in
life. The back stabbing and nit picking found at almost every level of
the outside professional work place for the most part doesn't exist with
these people.

Forgive me if this comes out wrong, bit this reminds me of a few things I
discussed with my wife. She had problems with a few acquaintances that
imposed themselves as friends. They would set lunch dates with her and
give her grief if she did not accept or would cancel. Each meeting she
would find draining because these "friends" would complain about their
lives endlessly.

So I had to tell her a little thing I learned years ago that helped change
things, "Just because the phone rings doesn't mean you have to answer it."
This helped me when I was an Auxiliary police officer here in New York.
An unarmed volunteer in a very real police uniform walking the beat in
Queens. There you learn early on that just because a person is yelling
profanity doesn't mean you have to yell back.
You learn that flashing a badge doesn't mean squat to a person that is
just plain ****ed off, and also that no amount of reasoning will stop a
person that wants to rant. Working in this capacity one would think
"well, real cops have it easier because they have guns and people respect
that." Well, that isn't true. They have it worse.
You would think you could tell a person while in a police uniform that
"there is a power line down ahead, you can't drive down this road," that
they would not yell at you " I HAVE to get down that road. Nope.
You know what works best there? You say, "well you can't" and you direct
your attention elsewhere. They mutter and drive off. Arguing just
prolongs the incident.
So,

This brings me to my way if dealing with Usenet and it has a lot to do
with what you say here;
"you have a tendency to learn early on what's important and what isn't
important in life"

ignoring the knuckleheads "phone calls" is the first step to getting
something from usenet besides a headache.


--
Dave A
Aging Student Pilot

The first thing you learn in flying is NEVER to put much faith in general
analogies. They don't work for various reasons.
On Usenet, the old "ignore them" analogy usually ends up right back out here
on Usenet, being laid out by someone for someone else, as nothing more than
absolute proof that the analogy doesn't work in the first place.
:-)
No my friend....unfortunately it's man's basic flaws and individual
personalities that will determine how communication is carried out on
Usenet, not the old "ignore um" analogy.
But it sounds good anyway :-)))))

Dudley Henriques