Renting an airplane? Need Expert FARS Advice??

Ok, Fellow Pilots Here Is The Situation:

"A Private Pilot wants to rent an airplane and this person wants to fly it
from the west coast to the east coast but not back. This person would like
you to come along for the trip and dose not want to be reimbursed for any
part of the rental for time I act as PIC during the trip. This person also
is willing to pay for the aircraft rental for how ever many hours it takes
to get the airplane back home. This person would not be paying anyone for
acting as PIC just for the airplane rental! Would this be legal for a
private pilot to do? or would one have to pay your equal share on the way
there and all expenses on the way back home? or just pass on the trip"

This is the proposal that I have been offered from a good friend that lives
in Northern California that is moving even further away because of a Job on
the east coast. She thought since we hardly see each other anymore as it is
and she is moving even further away that this would be a trip that we both
would remember for lifetime. She has already discussed rental arrangements
of an aircraft with the FBO they said as long as they get a deposit for
estimated flight hours and I get a check out in the aircraft and listed as a
renter it would not be a problem. She even offered to pay for my check out
with the FBO and my renters insurance to meet fbo requirements. I will have
to pay for fuel on the way home but the FBO will reimburse me upon return.
Expense to her is not really no factor this would be a really fun trip see
spec's below.

Spec's:

Female
24 Years Old
5' 6"
115 to 120 lb's
Brown/Red Hair
A Strong 34 C
She is not current and taking her BFR next week

My little head is telling me to go for it, but my big head is saying stop
wait (must be my old age) get some advice from the people that know more
than the FBO on the FARS and legal aspects before making a decision. I
really would like to go the hotel stays would even be fun. What would you
do?


Ohhh.
No need for anyone to tell me that I have bad spelling and punctuation I
know I do!

"NW_PILOT" wrote in message
...
Ok, Fellow Pilots Here Is The Situation:

"A Private Pilot wants to rent an airplane and this person wants to fly it

How about insuring her in your plane?

Paul

Recently, NW_PILOT posted:

Ok, Fellow Pilots Here Is The Situation:

"A Private Pilot wants to rent an airplane and this person wants to
fly it from the west coast to the east coast but not back."

Sounds to me that you're missing your best opportunity by not marrying the
girl! ;-)

It also doesn't sound like a violation of the FARs, unless you consider
the cost of the return trip as being paid to ferry the plane. But, that's
a stretch, IMO, because there isn't any rule saying that you *must* pay to
fly; just that you can't _get paid_ to fly as a private pilot. I wouldn't
expect that you'd hear a peep from the FSDO.

Neil

"NW_PILOT" wrote in message
...
Ok, Fellow Pilots Here Is The Situation:

"A Private Pilot wants to rent an airplane and this person wants to fly it
from the west coast to the east coast but not back. This person would like
you to come along for the trip and dose not want to be reimbursed for any
part of the rental for time I act as PIC during the trip. This person also
is willing to pay for the aircraft rental for how ever many hours it takes
to get the airplane back home. This person would not be paying anyone for
acting as PIC just for the airplane rental! Would this be legal for a
private pilot to do? or would one have to pay your equal share on the way
there and all expenses on the way back home? or just pass on the trip"

Couldn't you pay your share for the way back and come to some
other arrangement on how she pays you back?

Paul

NW_PILOT wrote:
[snip the details]

My little head is telling me to go for it, but my big head is saying stop
wait (must be my old age) get some advice from the people that know more
than the FBO on the FARS and legal aspects before making a decision.

Then don't ask here. Call AOPA legal services.

I really would like to go the hotel stays would even be fun. What would you

And for my second recommendation, call Dr. Ruth.

troll or a misogynist, not sure which.

NW_PILOT wrote:

"A Private Pilot wants to rent an airplane and this person wants to fly it
from the west coast to the east coast but not back. This person would like
you to come along for the trip and dose not want to be reimbursed for any
part of the rental for time I act as PIC during the trip. This person also
is willing to pay for the aircraft rental for how ever many hours it takes
to get the airplane back home. This person would not be paying anyone for
acting as PIC just for the airplane rental! Would this be legal for a
private pilot to do? or would one have to pay your equal share on the way
there and all expenses on the way back home? or just pass on the trip"

Well, she's going to be flying out, so the Feds can't really expect you to have to
pay your way for that part -- you're a passenger. As for the trip back, the FAA has
been known to violate people for flying other people's aircraft for free, but only in
cases in which the pilot's were in competition with professionals (glider towplanes,
for example).

Me, I would let her pay the bills. I also wouldn't talk about it very much, just in
case.

George Patterson
If a man gets into a fight 3,000 miles away from home, he *had* to have
been looking for it.

On Wed, 22 Sep 2004 03:14:44 -0700, "NW_PILOT"
wrote:


Listen to your little head! Listen to your little head! Don't worry
about the FARs. Losing your license for 30 days would be a small
price to pay if its really gonna be that good a trip! g Besides if
you explain this to any male inspector, I'll bet he turns green with
envy, pats you on the back, and keeps it for back room discussions
only.

Seriously, it wouldn't seem to me that you are agreegiously breaking
the law. What if you bought a hotel room, or food, or something? All
of this should be counted toward expenses. As someone else stated,
call AOPA for the best response.

Good Luck!
z

Hmmm... one would wonder what the FAA's definition of "or other
compensation" might include.

Spec's:
Female
24 Years Old
5' 6"
115 to 120 lb's
Brown/Red Hair
A Strong 34 C
She is not current and taking her BFR next week

My little head is telling me to go for it, but my big head is saying stop
wait (must be my old age) get some advice from the people that know more
than the FBO on the FARS and legal aspects before making a decision. I
really would like to go the hotel stays would even be fun. What would you
do?

I assume you would be the one renting the plane, otherwise...
1) How is she going to get an FBO to rent an airplane to her without a
current BFR?
2) The FBO likely had her sign something stating that only a
"authorized pilot" can fly the plane (she can't lone it to friends).

The FAA has violated people on several occasions for being able to fly
for free as a private pilot. The classic examples are tow pilots
(although an exemption is now available through the glider pilot's
association), jump pilots, etc. The FAA has said, in these situations,
that your ability to fly for free is compensation. The best bet may be
to call the Sac FSDO, ask their opinion, write down the name of the
person you talked to and then don't fly outside their district. You
are in a grey area here.

-Robert, CFI



"NW_PILOT" wrote in message ...
Ok, Fellow Pilots Here Is The Situation:

"A Private Pilot wants to rent an airplane and this person wants to fly it
from the west coast to the east coast but not back. This person would like
you to come along for the trip and dose not want to be reimbursed for any
part of the rental for time I act as PIC during the trip. This person also
is willing to pay for the aircraft rental for how ever many hours it takes
to get the airplane back home. This person would not be paying anyone for
acting as PIC just for the airplane rental! Would this be legal for a
private pilot to do? or would one have to pay your equal share on the way
there and all expenses on the way back home? or just pass on the trip"

This is the proposal that I have been offered from a good friend that lives
in Northern California that is moving even further away because of a Job on
the east coast. She thought since we hardly see each other anymore as it is
and she is moving even further away that this would be a trip that we both
would remember for lifetime. She has already discussed rental arrangements
of an aircraft with the FBO they said as long as they get a deposit for
estimated flight hours and I get a check out in the aircraft and listed as a
renter it would not be a problem. She even offered to pay for my check out
with the FBO and my renters insurance to meet fbo requirements. I will have
to pay for fuel on the way home but the FBO will reimburse me upon return.
Expense to her is not really no factor this would be a really fun trip see
spec's below.

Spec's:

Female
24 Years Old
5' 6"
115 to 120 lb's
Brown/Red Hair
A Strong 34 C
She is not current and taking her BFR next week

My little head is telling me to go for it, but my big head is saying stop
wait (must be my old age) get some advice from the people that know more
than the FBO on the FARS and legal aspects before making a decision. I
really would like to go the hotel stays would even be fun. What would you
do?


Ohhh.
No need for anyone to tell me that I have bad spelling and punctuation I
know I do!

"Neil Gould" wrote in message
ink.net...
Recently, NW_PILOT posted:

Ok, Fellow Pilots Here Is The Situation:

"A Private Pilot wants to rent an airplane and this person wants to
fly it from the west coast to the east coast but not back."

Sounds to me that you're missing your best opportunity by not marrying the
girl! ;-)


Sorry I cannot do that I am already married,