Airplanes and Brakes?

I'm deligthted to see I'm managing to get some arguments and
discussion going. And if you notice, No Profanity?
I challenge my students to learn to taxi without brakes. and I come
down hard if they beat up the airplane with unecessary braking instead
of staying ahead of the airplane. (sometimes even with profanity! Can
you imagine that?)
How about you? If you had to pay for the brakes, tires, and
maintenance, would YOU beat up the airplane?
Ol S&B

On Sep 15, 2:44*pm, "Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote:
I'm deligthted to see I'm managing to get some arguments and
discussion going. And if you notice, No Profanity?
I challenge my students to learn to taxi without brakes. and I come
down hard if they beat up the airplane with unecessary braking instead
of staying ahead of the airplane. (sometimes even with profanity! Can
you imagine that?)
How about you? If you had to pay for the brakes, tires, and
maintenance, would YOU beat up the airplane?
Ol S&B

Let's talk about the other part of flying. I consider a landing 'good'
if I make the planned turnoff without use of breaks or additional
throttle. The numbers on most runways for us GA types just identify
the runway, they should not be the touchdown target.

Ol Shy & Bashful wrote:
I'm deligthted to see I'm managing to get some arguments and
discussion going. And if you notice, No Profanity?
I challenge my students to learn to taxi without brakes. and I come
down hard if they beat up the airplane with unecessary braking instead
of staying ahead of the airplane. (sometimes even with profanity! Can
you imagine that?)
How about you? If you had to pay for the brakes, tires, and
maintenance, would YOU beat up the airplane?
Ol S&B

I fly a Tiger.

Got any suggestions on how to turn without brakes?

Back when I was flying 172's I never found it necessary to use the brakes
unless I had to make a REALLY tight turn, so I see your point.


--
Jim Pennino

Remove .spam.sux to reply.

wrote in message
news

I fly a Tiger.

Got any suggestions on how to turn without brakes?


I fly a Cherokee without toe brakes.

Got any suggestions on how to turn WITH brakes? g

a wrote:
I consider a landing 'good'
if I make the planned turnoff without use of breaks or additional
throttle.



"Breaks"? May be prevented by using the brakes. Sorry, couldn't resist :-)

"Steve Foley" wrote:
wrote in message
news

I fly a Tiger.

Got any suggestions on how to turn without brakes?


I fly a Cherokee without toe brakes.

Got any suggestions on how to turn WITH brakes? g

So far all I've ever flown is a Schweizer SGS 2-33. Not only can't I turn
it with the brake, I can't reach the brake during taxi anyway since I'm
outside the cockpit during those times. ;-)

On Sep 15, 2:44*pm, "Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote:
I'm deligthted to see I'm managing to get some arguments and
discussion going. And if you notice, No Profanity?
I challenge my students to learn to taxi without brakes. and I come
down hard if they beat up the airplane with unecessary braking instead
of staying ahead of the airplane. (sometimes even with profanity! Can
you imagine that?)
How about you? If you had to pay for the brakes, tires, and
maintenance, would YOU beat up the airplane?
Ol S&B

I agree completely, (and without cussing :-)

I see you are naturally getting replies from the Grumman and Cherokee
folks :-) But your point is well made. The way I would present this
issue is to simply say that brakes are put on the airplane to hold it
for the run up check and for use ONLY when your pre-planned use of
aerodynamic forces available to you, or your steering capabilities
won't make the necessary change in direction.
In other words, you shouldn't be using them on takeoff, landing, and
even while taxiing if your planning is adequate for the situation.
I like the general rule that dictates that brakes on an airplane
should be used as little as possible.

Dudley Henriques

I've been in a couple of planes where without the brakes the thing
accelerates too much. The F-16 comes to mind, where without intermittent
braking it picks up too much speed, and braking on landing is pretty much
SOP.

My Baron needs occasional braking on taxi, otherwise below around 1000rpm
the oil pressure drops too low. My friend's turbine Bonanza needs to use
beta during taxi or the brakes to keep from picking up too much speed.

"Dudley Henriques" wrote in message
...
On Sep 15, 2:44 pm, "Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote:
I'm deligthted to see I'm managing to get some arguments and
discussion going. And if you notice, No Profanity?
I challenge my students to learn to taxi without brakes. and I come
down hard if they beat up the airplane with unecessary braking instead
of staying ahead of the airplane. (sometimes even with profanity! Can
you imagine that?)
How about you? If you had to pay for the brakes, tires, and
maintenance, would YOU beat up the airplane?
Ol S&B

I agree completely, (and without cussing :-)

I see you are naturally getting replies from the Grumman and Cherokee
folks :-) But your point is well made. The way I would present this
issue is to simply say that brakes are put on the airplane to hold it
for the run up check and for use ONLY when your pre-planned use of
aerodynamic forces available to you, or your steering capabilities
won't make the necessary change in direction.
In other words, you shouldn't be using them on takeoff, landing, and
even while taxiing if your planning is adequate for the situation.
I like the general rule that dictates that brakes on an airplane
should be used as little as possible.

Dudley Henriques

On Sep 15, 2:44*pm, "Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote:
How about you? If you had to pay for the brakes, tires, and
maintenance, would YOU beat up the airplane?

Haha - I have to admit that I didn't give it much consideration when I
was a renter. Coupled with the fact the flight school was near the
approach end of the usual runway I likely abused them to make the
early turnoff.

Funny how buying a plane and having to pay for them yourself changes
your perspective on things - now I try not to use them at all if I can
help it. Although, I would challenge you to taxi to my hangar without
using brakes - taxiway E at AGC goes down a pretty substantial hill so
I don't see that I have much choice.

Also, once when flying with an instructor and landing somewhere with a
shorter runway, I rolled down to the end with the yoke full back but
still had to brake a bit to make the last turnoff. The instructor
pointed out it's probably a good idea to find out if your brakes work
sometime before you roll down the embankment at the end... So now I
make it a point to at least give them a tap while I still have time to
do something about it if they don't work.

On Sep 15, 4:47*pm, "Viperdoc" wrote:
I've been in a couple of planes where without the brakes the thing
accelerates too much. The F-16 comes to mind, where without intermittent
braking it picks up too much speed, and braking on landing is pretty much
SOP.

My Baron needs occasional braking on taxi, otherwise below around 1000rpm
the oil pressure drops too low. My friend's turbine Bonanza *needs to use
beta during taxi or the brakes to keep from picking up too much speed.

"Dudley Henriques" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 2:44 pm, "Ol Shy & Bashful" wrote:

I'm deligthted to see I'm managing to get some arguments and
discussion going. And if you notice, No Profanity?
I challenge my students to learn to taxi without brakes. and I come
down hard if they beat up the airplane with unecessary braking instead
of staying ahead of the airplane. (sometimes even with profanity! Can
you imagine that?)
How about you? If you had to pay for the brakes, tires, and
maintenance, would YOU beat up the airplane?
Ol S&B

I agree completely, (and without cussing :-)

I see you are naturally getting replies from the Grumman and Cherokee
folks :-) But your point is well made. The way I would present this
issue is to simply say that brakes are put on the airplane to hold it
for the run up check and for use ONLY when your pre-planned use of
aerodynamic forces available to you, or your steering capabilities
won't make the necessary change in direction.
In other words, you shouldn't be using them on takeoff, landing, and
even while taxiing if your planning is adequate for the situation.
I like the general rule that dictates that brakes on an airplane
should be used as little as possible.

Dudley Henriques

Had the chance to fly the Viper a few times. Didn't notice any
excessive increase in taxi speed that very light braking couldn't
handle. Did use them a bit being late with throttle reduction after a
start from a standing position until I got used to the response :-)
Landing the Viper for me anyway was a conglomeration of a lot of
things happening at once. Assuming no drag chute deployment, keeping
the nose up to 13 degrees AOA gave good aerodynamic braking down to
about 80kts. At 80 kts you could fly the nosewheel down to the runway
with good control. If I remember right, the speedbrake was restricted
to around 43 degrees with the airplane dirty and this was in play
through touchdown and until the nose was on the runway, then hitting
the SB slider again extended the boards out to full at 60 degrees.

I didn't notice anything that required excessive brake use through
roll out. In fact, I never flew the Viper with heavy externals but the
word was that landing hot and using the brakes could get you sent over
to the hot brake area to sit and sweat your butt off over there in the
sun :-))
DH