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#51
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Yes, when you are incapable of achieving criticality duterium
is really not needed. By the way, there was no "land route" from Norway to Germany available at the time. Or when you use graphite for Moderation,The "Land route" in Deibners account refers to the alternative route to the much publicized lake crossing with ferry,not an open sea route. |
#52
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#53
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But the Germans were no where
near building a reactor, much less a bomb. Thus the choice of moderator was inconsequential. Germans had not one but two graphite moderated reactors and one of them was in Thuringer Forest,if Germans had no working reactor Hirosima and Nagazaki could not be bombed anytime in 1945. Did you ever wonder why the entries made to log book of 89.th Infantry div.between 4;8. 45 1,35 PM and 4.11.45 7,35 PM are also among document that were classified for 75 years?. |
#54
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"Denyav" wrote in message ... But the Germans were no where near building a reactor, much less a bomb. Thus the choice of moderator was inconsequential. Germans had not one but two graphite moderated reactors and one of them was in Thuringer Forest,if Germans had no working reactor Hirosima and Nagazaki could not be bombed anytime in 1945. And your basis for the latter claim is what exactly? tim gueguen 101867 |
#55
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#56
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"Denyav" wrote in message ... But the Germans were no where near building a reactor, much less a bomb. Thus the choice of moderator was inconsequential. Germans had not one but two graphite moderated reactors and one of them was in Thuringer Forest,if Germans had no working reactor Hirosima and Nagazaki could not be bombed anytime in 1945. Cite please There are no references in the literature to any German reactor ever reaching criticallity so please provide the evidence for ths claim. Keith |
#58
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"robert arndt" wrote in message om... (B2431) wrote in message ... Captured German uranium was used in the construction of the US atomic bombs, seized from the Belgian Congo stocks Germany possessed. Certainly that uranium was sent to the USA and likely was incorporated into the stocks from which later weapons were built BUT its highly unlikley that any of that material found its way into the weapons dropped on Japan. The uranium used in the Hiroshima bomb had been undergoing enrichment since 1944 and the plutonium in the Nagasaki bombs had been produced in Hanford before the Belgian material even arrived in the USA Germany also had seperate atomic research facilities, Haigerloch being only one. Another was working on a spherical reactor for power project as well as the two radiological weapons found under construction at the end of the war. Although Germany did not build a bomb itself it did technology transfer uranium to Japan's program in occupied Korea (Japan's Genzai Bakudan bomb)... which we still have little information about (classified). All they got was a little uranium. The Japanese had made little progress towards building of a weapon but their theory was rather better and they had managed to make a number of cyclotrons for enrichment and built a thermal diffusion separation plant. The bottom line though is that neither Japan nor Germany had anything like the industrial resources committed to bring such a program to fruition and given the fragility of their wartime economies. The reason that Britain chose to throw in its lot with the USA was that it was recognised that the industrial resources required to build the reactors , produce the plutonium, extract it and turn it into working weapons was such that a timely development was impossible. Even with the knowledged of how it was done it took the USSR several years to duplicate these efforts even with the absolute priority on Soviet resources it had and with Beria wielding the whip with a will. Further still, Germany also knew about the possibilities of a thermonuclear weapon in 1944 and nuclear power for submarines. One can only wonder what would have happened if Hitler had not persecuted the Jews nor regarded the German atomic research project as "Jewish Physics" with little funding and no Fuhrer directive to build such a weapon (Hitler was preoccupied with the wasteful V-weapons programs). Had the SS Scientific Branch harnassed the mindpower and manpower of Europe for an official German bomb project there is little doubt the Germans would have had the bomb first and used it, probably in 1944. If Hitler hadnt held the views he did there would likely have been no war to start with. Say what you want, but both Germany's and Japan's wartime atomic projects are still not complete as "sensitve material" is still classified for both. What we are being fed is the same old stale stories of "they were way behind and we succeded because of our fears of a Nazi bomb" when all they really had was a small unorganized research program and impure graphite. That is just not accurate enough...but makes good official US history. No its what the German physicists themselves and German records say. Who else should we listen to if not men like Diebner, Heisenberg etc. David Irving is scarcely noted for his critical views with regard to the 3rd Reich , and certainly doesnt produce history that fits the official line. I suggest you read his book on the subject. http://www.fpp.co.uk/books/VirusHouse/ Keith |
#59
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#60
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On 19 Jan 2004 05:04:50 -0800, (robert arndt) wrote:
(B2431) wrote in message ... From: (Denyav) Date: 1/18/2004 10:31 PM Central Standard Time Message-id: But the Germans were no where near building a reactor, much less a bomb. Thus the choice of moderator was inconsequential. Germans had not one but two graphite moderated reactors and one of them was in Thuringer Forest,if Germans had no working reactor Hirosima and Nagazaki could not be bombed anytime in 1945. Did you ever wonder why the entries made to log book of 89.th Infantry div.between 4;8. 45 1,35 PM and 4.11.45 7,35 PM are also among document that were classified for 75 years?. Where did you get that idea? Are you suggesting the U.S. had not developed uranium and plutonium enrichment facilities prior to May 1945? Are you suggesting the U.S. had not built any form of reactor or pile prior to May 1945? The Little Boy bomb and Trinity were just waiting for uranium and plutonium respectively. Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired Captured German uranium was used in the construction of the US atomic bombs, seized from the Belgian Congo stocks Germany possessed. Germany also had seperate atomic research facilities, Haigerloch being only one. Another was working on a spherical reactor for power project as well as the two radiological weapons found under construction at the end of the war. Although Germany did not build a bomb itself it did technology transfer uranium to Japan's program in occupied Korea (Japan's Genzai Bakudan bomb)... which we still have little information about (classified). Further still, Germany also knew about the possibilities of a thermonuclear weapon in 1944 and nuclear power for submarines. One can only wonder what would have happened if Hitler had not persecuted the Jews nor regarded the German atomic research project as "Jewish Physics" with little funding and no Fuhrer directive to build such a weapon (Hitler was preoccupied with the wasteful V-weapons programs). Had the SS Scientific Branch harnassed the mindpower and manpower of Europe for an official German bomb project there is little doubt the Germans would have had the bomb first and used it, probably in 1944. Say what you want, but both Germany's and Japan's wartime atomic projects are still not complete as "sensitve material" is still classified for both. What we are being fed is the same old stale stories of "they were way behind and we succeded because of our fears of a Nazi bomb" when all they really had was a small unorganized research program and impure graphite. That is just not accurate enough...but makes good official US history. None, rpt none, of the yellow cake captured from Germany was used in the US nuclear program. As for "radiological weapons" that is a complete lie. Without an operating reactor you are not going to build "radiological" weapons. Germany was nowhere near building a reactor, much less a bomb. Japan was no closer. Der Fuhrer is dead, get over it. Al Minyard |
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