CFI in IMC with Student

On 12 Dec 2005 06:45:26 -0800, wrote:

Nice video. Was that the stall horn I heard chirping on your
base-to-final turn? (2:05 and 2:11 in the video). Does that typically
happen?

Yes, it was the stall horn. Got caught off guard on the winds aloft
blowing me through final. Also, getting thump around in the turbulence
didn't help matters which help triggered the stall horn :-)

You will notice that I took immediate corrective action by reducing my bank
and "accepting" the fact I would have to button hook back to final. Winds
at that level were 40 knots (quartering tail wind on base).

My mistake on that approach was squaring off base in my pattern when I
really should have just kept my turn going on base to final.

Stall horn in my plane starts chirping about 10 knots before stall, which
is fine with me :-)

One of my best landings can be seen at
http://www.archive.org/details/ALieb...rgMSfromMBOavi
I have sized the file down t 13 meg.

For a night touch and go, if you go to
http://www.archive.org/details/ALieb...n34LfromMBOavi
Centerline lighting shows up real nice in this video.
This file I have sized it down to 10 meg.

For a night landing at my home airport MBO go to
http://www.archive.org/details/ALieb...htLanding17MBO VASI and runway
lighting shows up nicely.
7 meg is this file size.

As you can see, I like to give that stall horn a good workout with my low
and slow landings.

If you have high bandwidth, if you go to
http://www.archive.org/details/ALieb...CeilingfromMBO
this was an ILS where I broke out at 1000 feet AGL. This video is high
resolution so that the instrument panel looks real nice in full screen.
Since I was asked to keep my speed up, stall horn barely chirps on touch
down. File size weighs in at 65 meg after downloading. Not sure why the
web page reports 100 meg.

I like it when someone is with me to video my landings, so I can self
critique my own landings. I am harder on myself for quality of my landings
then passengers are :-)

While, not videos,
http://www.archive.org/details/ALieb...htfromOhiotoMS has pictures of
my last flight from Ohio to MS. I call them the many faces of flight.
File sizes are less then 50kb per picture (5 pics) If experiencing these
pics doesn't give one incentive for getting their instrument rating, I
don't know what would!

Allen

On 2005-12-13, Dave S wrote:
Ben Jackson wrote:
On 2005-12-12, Jay Somerset wrote:

Even if the CFI was a CFII, the primary student's instrument experience
would not apply to the instrument rating requirements.

Flight experience doesnt expire. If the time is dual given by a CFII,
then that time is loggable towards the eventual completion of an
instrument rating.

61.109(a)(3) 3 hours of flight training in a single-engine airplane
on the control and maneuvering of an airplane solely by reference to
instruments...

You can find numerous DE opinions (google groups) saying that is not
equivalent to:

61.65(d)(2) A total of 40 hours of actual or simulated instrument time
on the areas of operation of this section...

--
Ben Jackson

http://www.ben.com/

A Lieberman wrote:
On 12 Dec 2005 06:45:26 -0800, wrote:

Nice video. Was that the stall horn I heard chirping on your
base-to-final turn? (2:05 and 2:11 in the video). Does that typically
happen?

Yes, it was the stall horn. Got caught off guard on the winds aloft
blowing me through final. Also, getting thump around in the turbulence
didn't help matters which help triggered the stall horn :-)

Thanks, I wasn't being critical -- I'm relatively new at instrument
flying and I wondered how people generally flew circling approaches.

You will notice that I took immediate corrective action by reducing my bank
and "accepting" the fact I would have to button hook back to final. Winds
at that level were 40 knots (quartering tail wind on base).

It did seem that you went from downwind to overshot awfully fast! the
winds would explain it. I can seldom fly a square pattern when I do
circle to land -- I usually have to button hook it.

Stall horn in my plane starts chirping about 10 knots before stall, which
is fine with me :-)

That is quite a margin. I did notice in the video that your airspeed
needle didn't appear to be in the region were I would expect the stall
horn to be triggered.

As you can see, I like to give that stall horn a good workout with my low
and slow landings.

Is that because you are flying a Sundowner? I've never flown one but
I've read that if you're even the slightest bit fast you'll float in
the flare. Of course a 10 kt margin is also unusually wide for a stall
horn.

thanks for all the videos!

wrote:

Of course a 10 kt margin is also unusually wide for a stall
horn.

My understanding is that the newer model Cessna 172R's and S's have a 10 kt
margin with their stall warning horns.

--
Peter

On 13 Dec 2005 07:07:26 -0800, wrote:

Thanks, I wasn't being critical -- I'm relatively new at instrument
flying and I wondered how people generally flew circling approaches.

On the contrary, I appreciate you taking the time to notice :-) It's small
details like that can make me a better pilot with the input from others.

Is that because you are flying a Sundowner? I've never flown one but
I've read that if you're even the slightest bit fast you'll float in
the flare. Of course a 10 kt margin is also unusually wide for a stall
horn.

Yes, I am in a 1976 Sundowner. It's designed to fly :-) and excess speed
is your enemy for short field landings. If you fly a Sundowner by the
numbers, the trailing link gear will make you look like a pro!

thanks for all the videos!

My pleasure. If you see anything to help me improve my landings, please
post! We learn by listening!

Allen

61.109(a)(3) 3 hours of flight training in a single-engine airplane
on the control and maneuvering of an airplane solely by reference to
instruments...


61.65(d)(2) A total of 40 hours of actual or simulated instrument time
on the areas of operation of this section...


They may not be equivalent to each other, BUT the key here is they are
NOT mutually exclusive. A given experience CAN meet both requirements at
the same time. It wouldnt be the first time a DE has been wrong.

On a side note, I went to look up the part 61 FAQ section for guidance
and have discovered that the FAA has removed it from their website in
favor of issuing personalized opinions to individual questions.

Dave

Peter R. wrote:
wrote:

Of course a 10 kt margin is also unusually wide for a stall
horn.

My understanding is that the newer model Cessna 172R's and S's have a 10 kt
margin with their stall warning horns.

There's a lot of variance in 172 stall horns anyhow. It's adjustable.