How long to keep VOR check records?

Well, since practically everybody uses GPS


Uh... no.


and radar coverage is
essentially nationwide now,


Uh... no.


making sure your VOR is accurate within a couple
of degrees every 30 days, and also keeping a detailed record of that, seems
a bit out of date.


Oh. I thought you meant just the recordkeeping part. If you have and use a
VOR IFR it better be accurate.

Jose



--
(for Email, make the obvious changes in my address)

"Dan Thompson" wrote in
. com:

Well, since practically everybody uses GPS, and radar coverage is
essentially nationwide now, making sure your VOR is accurate within a
couple of degrees every 30 days, and also keeping a detailed record of
that, seems a bit out of date. Kind of like making sure your buggy
whip is in good condition every 30 days.


Radar coverage does not extend nationwide at low altitudes. In fact I would
bet that 99% of the country does not have radar coverage below 1000' AGL.
This is where VOR accuracy really matters anyway.

Well for me, VOR is backup no. 2 behind radar vectors/ handheld GPS, if my
primary GPS goes out. I have been pretty good about logging VOR checks, but
it is starting to seem a little silly since I haven't used a VOR for IFR nav
in years.
"Teacherjh" wrote in message
...

Well, since practically everybody uses GPS


Uh... no.


and radar coverage is
essentially nationwide now,


Uh... no.


making sure your VOR is accurate within a couple
of degrees every 30 days, and also keeping a detailed record of that,
seems
a bit out of date.


Oh. I thought you meant just the recordkeeping part. If you have and use
a
VOR IFR it better be accurate.

Jose



--
(for Email, make the obvious changes in my address)

I bet you are right. Since it is not possible to fly under IFR below 1000
AGL, except taking off or on an approach, what difference does that make?

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
. 158...
"Dan Thompson" wrote in
. com:

Well, since practically everybody uses GPS, and radar coverage is
essentially nationwide now, making sure your VOR is accurate within a
couple of degrees every 30 days, and also keeping a detailed record of
that, seems a bit out of date. Kind of like making sure your buggy
whip is in good condition every 30 days.


Radar coverage does not extend nationwide at low altitudes. In fact I
would
bet that 99% of the country does not have radar coverage below 1000' AGL.
This is where VOR accuracy really matters anyway.

An approach is where a VOR accuracy really matters. If you are off by a
few degrees during enroute, the worst that can happen is an annoyed
controller. During approach the outcome may be a lot worse. Would you fly
a VOR approach to minimum if you are not sure if the VOR has not been
checked?




"Dan Thompson" wrote in
m:

I bet you are right. Since it is not possible to fly under IFR below
1000 AGL, except taking off or on an approach, what difference does
that make?

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
. 158...
"Dan Thompson" wrote in
. com:

Well, since practically everybody uses GPS, and radar coverage is
essentially nationwide now, making sure your VOR is accurate within
a couple of degrees every 30 days, and also keeping a detailed
record of that, seems a bit out of date. Kind of like making sure
your buggy whip is in good condition every 30 days.


Radar coverage does not extend nationwide at low altitudes. In fact I
would
bet that 99% of the country does not have radar coverage below 1000'
AGL. This is where VOR accuracy really matters anyway.

Yeah, but only in the case of the primary GPS being failed, and then I would
be backing it up off of the handheld GPS and the other VOR nav as well. In
case of a discrepancy between the VOR navs, the handheld GPS would be the
tie breaker. Also if I had time I might also break out my handheld COM
radio which also has a VOR function. Frankly, if I was down to relying on
my 2nd and 3rd layer of backups, I would probably conclude this was just a
really bad day and divert to an ILS airport.

I'm not planning to quit doing the 30 day checks, I'm just thinking this is
kind of old-fashioned and more rigorous than some other more likely failure
modes nowadays that we aren't required to be as careful about.

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
. 158...
An approach is where a VOR accuracy really matters. If you are off by a
few degrees during enroute, the worst that can happen is an annoyed
controller. During approach the outcome may be a lot worse. Would you fly
a VOR approach to minimum if you are not sure if the VOR has not been
checked?




"Dan Thompson" wrote in
m:

I bet you are right. Since it is not possible to fly under IFR below
1000 AGL, except taking off or on an approach, what difference does
that make?

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
. 158...
"Dan Thompson" wrote in
. com:

Well, since practically everybody uses GPS, and radar coverage is
essentially nationwide now, making sure your VOR is accurate within
a couple of degrees every 30 days, and also keeping a detailed
record of that, seems a bit out of date. Kind of like making sure
your buggy whip is in good condition every 30 days.


Radar coverage does not extend nationwide at low altitudes. In fact I
would
bet that 99% of the country does not have radar coverage below 1000'
AGL. This is where VOR accuracy really matters anyway.

On Fri, 09 Apr 2004 10:06:08 GMT, "Dan Thompson"
wrote:

Well for me, VOR is backup no. 2 behind radar vectors/ handheld GPS, if my
primary GPS goes out. I have been pretty good about logging VOR checks, but
it is starting to seem a little silly since I haven't used a VOR for IFR nav
in years.

Then you haven't had to do a VOR check in years either.

It only has to have a current check if you are using it.
Far as that goes, (as I understand) you can take off in VFR
conditions, do the check and file.


Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

snip

On Thu, 01 Apr 2004 02:58:11 GMT, "John R. Copeland"
wrote:


"Ross Oliver" wrote in message ...
John R. Copeland wrote:
FWIW, my Apollo CNX80 and its companion SL30 NavCom
both have internal storage for their most-recent VOR-check data.
I no longer need to fill out the pencil-and-paper records I used to keep
in my supplemental flight manual.


One of the elements required by the FARs is the signature of the person
who performed the check. How do you satisfy this requirement?


By entering my name in the "Name" data fields of the records.
Typing, or entering name is not the same as a signature.


FAR 91.171 requires the person making the operational check
to "sign the aircraft log or other record."

"Generally" when something says "Signature" it really means signature.
IE. Name, or printed name is not acceptable. Maybe they really don't
mean signature?

Many a form has a place for your name with a separate line for
signature directly underneath.

Evidently, the Apollo people feel that the data-entry of a name
is satisfactory in lieu of a longhand script signature.

I wonder what the FAA stance is on this? From my experience when a
government agency wants a signature they will not accept a printed or
typed name. Maybe this is one of those "don't ask" items:-))

If they really do accept the entry it kinda opens a whole new can of
worms. I'm not arguing against it as I think entering you name in
the database is a good idea, but then again any one who has access to
the unit can enter your name.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com
---JRC---