Class B bust my fault or the controllers ?

Today I flew into KBFI (Boeing field) which is class D and has
extentions that underlie the Class B that require close attention to
altitudes and headings so as to stay clear. Today the winds were
favoring 31L (and 31R) and I came in from the west on the Vashon
approach--the most common approach from the west.

I was on a left downwind for 31L and the tower told me I was number
three following an Arrow on about a 2 mile straight in final (Valley
approach?). I acknowledged the traffic, and was waiting for it to come
up on my 9 o'clock before turning base so as to allow enough spacing.

The controller suddenly told me that I was too far south and said
either that I had busted into surface B or was about to. (I never did
clearly hear which).
Unless one turns a fairly close in base here--within about a half mile
or less--you end up in class B surface.

My questions:

1.Assuming I busted B; who is reponsible if the controller asks me to
follow an aircraft that is too far out on a straight in? I mean, I can
reduce speed, s-turn, and the like but I can't turn base until the
aircraft on final is a safe distance away, right?

2.Is the controller supposed to arrange things so that I *can* turn
base and not be in conflict with other aircraft?

3.How would you resolve the problem if it were happening to you ?

Any thoughts would be appreciated...

Antonio

Antoñio wrote:

Today I flew into KBFI (Boeing field) which is class D and has
extentions that underlie the Class B that require close attention to
altitudes and headings so as to stay clear. Today the winds were
favoring 31L (and 31R) and I came in from the west on the Vashon
approach--the most common approach from the west.

I was on a left downwind for 31L and the tower told me I was number
three following an Arrow on about a 2 mile straight in final (Valley
approach?). I acknowledged the traffic, and was waiting for it to come
up on my 9 o'clock before turning base so as to allow enough spacing.

The controller suddenly told me that I was too far south and said
either that I had busted into surface B or was about to. (I never did
clearly hear which).
Unless one turns a fairly close in base here--within about a half mile
or less--you end up in class B surface.

My questions:

1.Assuming I busted B; who is reponsible if the controller asks me to
follow an aircraft that is too far out on a straight in? I mean, I can
reduce speed, s-turn, and the like but I can't turn base until the
aircraft on final is a safe distance away, right?

2.Is the controller supposed to arrange things so that I *can* turn
base and not be in conflict with other aircraft?

3.How would you resolve the problem if it were happening to you ?

Any thoughts would be appreciated...

Antonio

You are always responsible for remaining clear of Class B airspace unless
you receive a clearance to enter Class B airspace. You should be well
aware of the boundaries at a secondary airport like BFI.

Uh, If you are on an IFR flight plan, you don't need to hear "cleared
for Class B". At least that is always the way it has worked for me.

"Doug" wrote in message
oups.com...
Uh, If you are on an IFR flight plan, you don't need to hear "cleared
for Class B". At least that is always the way it has worked for me.

You always need a clearance to be in Class B. But if your IFR clearance
takes you through Class B, then that *is* a clearance to be in Class B, even
if the words "Class B" are not mentioned in the clearance.

--Gary

Doug wrote:

Uh, If you are on an IFR flight plan, you don't need to hear "cleared
for Class B". At least that is always the way it has worked for me.

That's correct. But, it doesn't seem this guy was on an IFR flight
plan. I don't find any "Vashon Approach" in my IFR charts for KBFI.

"Doug" wrote:
Uh, If you are on an IFR flight plan, you don't need to hear "cleared
for Class B". At least that is always the way it has worked for me.

The applicable reg is 91.131(a)(1): "No person may operate an aircraft
within a Class B airspace area except [...] The operator must receive an
ATC clearance from the ATC facility having jurisdiction for that area
before operating an aircraft in that area"

If you are IFR, you have "a clearance". You don't have to specifically be
cleared into the class bravo, you just have to have "a clearance".

"Doug" wrote in message
oups.com...
Uh, If you are on an IFR flight plan, you don't need to hear "cleared
for Class B". At least that is always the way it has worked for me.


If you are in IFR clearance you only got to distinguinsh two classes of
airspace: controlled and uncontrolled. You don't need to worry about the
classes of controlled airspace.

Guillermo wrote:

"Doug" wrote in message
oups.com...
Uh, If you are on an IFR flight plan, you don't need to hear "cleared
for Class B". At least that is always the way it has worked for me.


If you are in IFR clearance you only got to distinguinsh two classes of
airspace: controlled and uncontrolled. You don't need to worry about the
classes of controlled airspace.

Well, you do have to worry about equipage to go above FL 240 (DME) and above
290 (RVSM).

wrote in message ...


Guillermo wrote:

"Doug" wrote in message
oups.com...
Uh, If you are on an IFR flight plan, you don't need to hear "cleared
for Class B". At least that is always the way it has worked for me.


If you are in IFR clearance you only got to distinguinsh two classes of
airspace: controlled and uncontrolled. You don't need to worry about
the
classes of controlled airspace.

Well, you do have to worry about equipage to go above FL 240 (DME) and
above
290 (RVSM).

I'm not planning on going above FL240 in the C172RG that I fly.
I wish I were flying something that could go that high up

What is RVSM?

"Antoñio" wrote in message
oups.com...
Today I flew into KBFI (Boeing field) which is class D and has
extentions that underlie the Class B that require close attention to
altitudes and headings so as to stay clear. Today the winds were
favoring 31L (and 31R) and I came in from the west on the Vashon
approach--the most common approach from the west.

I was on a left downwind for 31L and the tower told me I was number
three following an Arrow on about a 2 mile straight in final (Valley
approach?). I acknowledged the traffic, and was waiting for it to come
up on my 9 o'clock before turning base so as to allow enough spacing.

The controller suddenly told me that I was too far south and said
either that I had busted into surface B or was about to. (I never did
clearly hear which).
Unless one turns a fairly close in base here--within about a half mile
or less--you end up in class B surface.

My questions:

1.Assuming I busted B; who is reponsible if the controller asks me to
follow an aircraft that is too far out on a straight in? I mean, I can
reduce speed, s-turn, and the like but I can't turn base until the
aircraft on final is a safe distance away, right?

2.Is the controller supposed to arrange things so that I *can* turn
base and not be in conflict with other aircraft?

3.How would you resolve the problem if it were happening to you ?
Any thoughts would be appreciated...


1. Ask the controller to call my base turn.
2. Invest in a Garmin 196 at a minimum
3. File IFR when going into KBFI
4. Not get that close (and boxed in) to class B without permission to enter.
My thoughts in order of preference

Howard

Antonio