TRSA and /X

"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
...

So then is it correct, that if the TRSA controller issues an
instruction to you as a participatory flight, you are only obliged to
follow that instruction if you choose?


You chose to follow it when you elected to participate.

"Andrew Gideon" wrote in message
online.com...

So here's a followup question: We know the TRSA space coexists with the
class E airspace. Does it also coexist with the class D airspace "in" the
TRSA airspace?


Yes.



Or are TRSA and class D mutually exclusive?


No.



Does the answer to this question make any practical difference?


Difference with what?

"Ron Natalie" wrote in message
...
But they are not controlled airspace in themselves.

I never said they were. You are correcting a statement that was never made.

[...]
It provides different service. A TRSA provides radar service when
class D does not (generally, although there's almost always a class D
tower in the middle of a TRSA).

So I said.

However some class D's provide
radar services without being TRSA's.

So I said. My statement "It provides a higher level of service than that
offered by most towers in Class D airspace" implies just that, and was
intended to.

TRSA's have the side effect of
not necessarily having all the aircraft within it participate, which
makes it inferior to class D and C.

"Inferior" is in the eye of the beholder. Class D airspace without radar
provides NO separation services. A TRSA provides better separation services
than any non-radar Class D.

It's not always class E.

It's always within controlled airspace, and the only exception to the Class
E is when it intersects with Class D. None of that contradicts what I wrote
earlier.

It's NOT controlled airspace.

Again (since you seem to be having a hard time comprehending this): I never
said it was.

Pete

"Ron Natalie" wrote in message
...

It provides different service. A TRSA provides radar service when
class D does not (generally, although there's almost always a class D
tower in the middle of a TRSA).


Do you know of a TRSA which does not have Class D airspace in the middle?



However some class D's provide
radar services without being TRSA's. TRSA's have the side effect of
not necessarily having all the aircraft within it participate, which
makes it inferior to class D and C.


But all of the aircraft in the Class D portion of the TRSA are
participating, just as they are in Class C and other Class D airspace.

"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...
"Ron Natalie" wrote in message

However some class D's provide
radar services without being TRSA's.


So I said. My statement "It provides a higher level of service than that
offered by most towers in Class D airspace" implies just that, and was
intended to.


That statement does not imply that some Class D's provide radar services
without being TRSA's.



"Inferior" is in the eye of the beholder. Class D airspace without radar
provides NO separation services.


That's not correct, separation is provided between IFR aircraft in Class D
airspace.



It's always within controlled airspace, and the only exception to the
Class E is when it intersects with Class D. None of that contradicts what
I wrote earlier.


Earlier you said it was only Class E.

Do you know of a TRSA which does not have Class D airspace in the middle?

Do you know that such a beast is impossible, even if it doesn't exist now?

Jose
--
The price of freedom is... well... freedom.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Jose" wrote in message
m...

Do you know that such a beast is impossible, even if it doesn't exist now?


No. Why do you ask?

No. Why do you ask?

I ask because your question:

Do you know of a TRSA which does not have
Class D airspace in the middle?

in response to Ron's parenthetical comment

...although there's almost always a class D
tower in the middle of a TRSA

implies that
1: there isn't any TRSA without a D, and more to the point
2: Ron should know this, Stephen does, nyah nyah nyah.

You phrase it as a snipe, which comes off as if you are being smug and
superior. Even if you were asking a neutral question because you were
curious, your posting history makes it easy to interpret as a snipe, and
snipes get tiresome, especially when the fine point they are based on
is incorrect or misleading.

Ron's remark ("almost always") remains true even if there are =no= cases
of Dless TRSAs. It implies that there =might= be, but not that there
=are=. So as a snipe at Ron, it misses.

But now I am curious as to your implication that they are impossible.
(Were they actually impossible, Ron's "almost" would be unnecessary,
though not incorrect). Your snipe implies that you know so and want to
belittle him who doesn't, by not telling and instead asking
rhetorically. (If you didn't know, a more pleasant neutral question
would definately be in order.)

Given the earlier discussion about the independence between towers and
class D airspace, I'm curious as to whether these things are in fact
independent, or (as you appeared to imply) not.

And yes, I phrased it as a snipe myself. Sauce for the goose and all.

Jose
--
The price of freedom is... well... freedom.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:

Do you know of a TRSA which does not have Class D airspace in the middle?

Yes, I do. The Utica TRSA in central NY, home of Griffiss Approach, at one
time had Griffiss Air Force B-52 airbase as its main airport in the middle
of the airspace. When the Air Force closed the airbase several years ago,
the airport became an uncontrolled airport (with a single 11,800 foot
runway).

However, the TRSA remains, presumably, for Oneida Cty airport. If you look
at the sectional you will note that this class D airport is south of the
"middle" of the TRSA, properly satisfying the criteria of your question.

--
Peter


















----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:
"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...

I don't understand your statement. I've never heard of a TRSA existing in
Class G airspace. All of the ones I've seen have been in Class E
airspace, which certainly is controlled airspace.



TRSAs exist in Class D and Class E airspace, but are not a type of
controlled airspace.

TRSAs also exist in Class G airspace as well.