US Rules Committee to ban XC Soar in US soaring competitioneffective immediately? - Ahh the "genius!"

On Feb 24, 10:03*am, Sean Fidler wrote:
Smart phones are also illegal according to SSA rules...read butterfly vario thread (set aside some time...). *I have copied Tom Kelley's post on the subject at the bottom of this response.

There is an honor system supposedly but I have not seen anything official.. *It very well could not change from present. *AT PRESENT...if you are caught in a contest with a smart phone in the contest you have cheated and will be DSQ'd. *You are expected, at current, to go to walmart and by a disposable cell phone for use in the glider for land outs, etc at a contest..

Again, this rule is a nearly impossible to enforce. *Consider the pilot that "WANTS TO TRY AND CLOUD FLY..." *The rules committee is trying (at great cost) to do the impossible.

Pretty soon we will have to go thru a bomb detector before we get into the cockpit at a contest!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

On the Android platform: *https://market.android.com/details?i...ghtdeck.ahoriz...

On the iPhone platform: *http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/airpl...ude/id38549164...

----------------------------

By Tom Kelley on Smart Phones in contests...

Enforcement of the rule comes from Sportmanship. Its us, its that
simple. We act alone on this issue but stand together in the
definition of "Sportsmanship".

The cell phone issue is simple, Wal Mart, a $20 cell answers this
issue. Many do this as we also have Androids but don't carry them
during a SSA contest.

Going IMC, meaning into a cloud, flight below VFR minimums, IS
AVOIDABLE. Enough said their.

The rules do have an effect, as it is now expected of all entrants to
display Sportmanship while racing in SSA contests.

Noel, like no PDA to fly with?? No cell or Spot?? Just good old
charts, a wiz wheel and knowing the task area? Like real airmanship
and looking outside? Dang, bring it on, lets race, you made my day.

Yes, enforcement can happen and will. As during the 18 Meter Nationals
several years back. Several were carrying Android phones or
BlackBerrys. I, yes, I, stood up during the pilots meeting and spoke
of Sportmanship. After my brief talk, a senior old rules commititte
guy spoke. He made it very clear. Unsportsmanlike conduct can be as
sever as a ban from SSA contests for up to 5 years. Carrying these
devices can be considered unsportmanslike conduct. After the meeting,
those 2 folks went and got new cells to carry with them, from Wal
Mart. Ahhhhhh............they never once complained.

Again, we stand as one, meaning we are each responcible for our
actions, but together we bring under the definition of "Sportmanship"
a sport inwhich we race in. We also know that our peers have given
much thought to these topics.

Its been posted way before this on the "how to's" of rule changes. As
at shopping in Sears, its the "best" way.

Thomas Kelley #711.

Just go to the SSA web page for a CURRENT ANSWER as it has been
decided.

Best regards,

Thomas Kelley #711.

There seems to be a misconception around that gyros are required to implement a functional AH.
This is not true.

Gps derived attitude algorithms have been in the open literature for many years. Indeed, this is what is implemented in xcsoar.

A higher fidelity and faster AH is enabled by data fusion of gps, 3 axis accelerometers gyros and magnetometers. Emerging smartphones have these sensors.

To my knowledge, many of the apps available for smartphones do NOT implement the complete 9 degree of freedom data fusion - typically they assume unaccelerated dynamics (I.e not circling flight). This is just a warning should anyone decide to try those apps out.

Tom,

Thanks. If you know of an update or clarification to "smart phone" legality in contests please attach a link. I could not find it.

The only update I see seems to be the one focused on the butterfly vario: http://www.ssa.org/files/member/Rest...t%20Policy.pdf

Thanks,

Sean

On Feb 24, 10:29*am, Sean Fidler wrote:
Tom,

Thanks. *If you know of an update or clarification to "smart phone" legality in contests please attach a link. *I could not find it.

The only update I see seems to be the one focused on the butterfly vario: *http://www.ssa.org/files/member/Rest...t%20Policy.pdf

Thanks,

Sean

3. Cell Phones
Rule 6.11.3 anticipates the presence of cell phones and reflects the
expected purpose of these and similar devices (“smart” phones) as not
being used in flight and turned off. The RC reaffirms its’ position in
this respect and recognizes that absolute enforcement of this is not
possible, certainly within the scope of what we expect volunteer
officials to do.
If such a device is used for the purposes of a flight display as
contemplated in (2) above, it is to be set in a mode that disables
communication with carrier networks (i.e. “airplane mode” or
equivalent). No other applications which could provide prohibited
functionality are to be available in flight.
It is otherwise expected that these devices will be stowed in a safe
place so as to be available for ground use and that they will be
turned off (see Rule 6.11.3 for permissible uses).
It is understood that many of these devices used for display may have
sensors or devices that could be used to support AH functions. This is
not interpreted by the RC as being out of compliance with the
provisions of the rules and associated policies. It is understood that
it is getting harder to find economical equipment that does not have
these sensors and devices. It will be the responsibility of the pilot
to ensure that programs and applications that could make these devices
functional as AH equipment are not installed. Presence of these
programs or applications will be assumed to be evidence of intent not
to comply with the provisions described herein.
Pilots please note that substituting an inexpensive “retrieve phone”
in the glider for a more capable phone used in daily life can be
expected to avoid any questions in this area.
4. Monitoring and compliance
Entrants shall comply with the provisions of the rules and associated
policies as a continuing display of good sportsmanship.


http://www.ssa.org/myhome.asp?mbr=67...w=blog&id=2759

It seems evident that unenforcable rules will vanish over time. There
was a time when rules in certain competitions prohibited the use of
any other frequency than the competition frequency, to guarantee
individual performance instead of team flying. Relatively easy to
control when crystal radios were the norm. Difficult to enforce once
small portable720 channel radios became available. Completely
impossible to enforce once cell phones became widespread. I don't
think there still is one single competition using this rule. And team
flying is now promoted in international competition. The same happened
with GPS. First banned, now mandatory.

In this case, I think it was most unwise to develop a AH-function in
the XCSoar program, if competition flying was envisioned at the start.
The AH and every other system permitting cloud flying, includung some
types of compasses (Bohli etc.), have been banned from soaring
competition for a long time. But given the numerous stand-alone AH
apps for every type of PDA/PNA/tablet/smartphone, I don't see how this
rule can still be enforced today.

By the way: if you favour an "honor" system to control compliance of
the AH rule, you could just as well believe a pilot when he tells you
he won't go / hasn't been going IMC. The same people (if any) will try
to cheat...

Thanks Tom.

On Friday, February 24, 2012 12:45:24 PM UTC-5, Tom Kelley wrote:
On Feb 24, 10:29*am, Sean Fidler wrote:
Tom,

Thanks. *If you know of an update or clarification to "smart phone" legality in contests please attach a link. *I could not find it.

The only update I see seems to be the one focused on the butterfly vario: *http://www.ssa.org/files/member/Rest...t%20Policy.pdf

Thanks,

Sean

3. Cell Phones
Rule 6.11.3 anticipates the presence of cell phones and reflects the
expected purpose of these and similar devices (“smart” phones) as not
being used in flight and turned off. The RC reaffirms its’ position in
this respect and recognizes that absolute enforcement of this is not
possible, certainly within the scope of what we expect volunteer
officials to do.
If such a device is used for the purposes of a flight display as
contemplated in (2) above, it is to be set in a mode that disables
communication with carrier networks (i.e. “airplane mode” or
equivalent). No other applications which could provide prohibited
functionality are to be available in flight.
It is otherwise expected that these devices will be stowed in a safe
place so as to be available for ground use and that they will be
turned off (see Rule 6.11.3 for permissible uses).
It is understood that many of these devices used for display may have
sensors or devices that could be used to support AH functions. This is
not interpreted by the RC as being out of compliance with the
provisions of the rules and associated policies. It is understood that
it is getting harder to find economical equipment that does not have
these sensors and devices. It will be the responsibility of the pilot
to ensure that programs and applications that could make these devices
functional as AH equipment are not installed. Presence of these
programs or applications will be assumed to be evidence of intent not
to comply with the provisions described herein.
Pilots please note that substituting an inexpensive “retrieve phone”
in the glider for a more capable phone used in daily life can be
expected to avoid any questions in this area.
4. Monitoring and compliance
Entrants shall comply with the provisions of the rules and associated
policies as a continuing display of good sportsmanship.


http://www.ssa.org/myhome.asp?mbr=67...w=blog&id=2759

On Feb 24, 9:18*am, wrote:
There seems to be a misconception around that gyros are required to implement a functional AH.
This is not true.

Gps derived attitude algorithms have been in the open literature for many years. Indeed, this is what is implemented in xcsoar.

A higher fidelity and faster AH is enabled by data fusion of gps, 3 axis accelerometers gyros and magnetometers. Emerging smartphones have these sensors.

To my knowledge, many of the apps available for smartphones do NOT implement the complete 9 degree of freedom data fusion - typically they assume unaccelerated dynamics (I.e not circling flight). This is just a warning should anyone decide to try those apps out.

Given the proliferation of open source sensor fusion software and
knowledge from the hobbyist UAV community, it's a very simple
programming project to implement a full 9 DF artificial horizon app.
Such apps already exist, just not for $5, yet...

Marc

On Feb 24, 12:18*pm, wrote:
There seems to be a misconception around that gyros are required to implement a functional AH.
This is not true.

Best info I have is that displays w/o gyro input are unlikely to be of
any practical use for maneuvering flight in high performance
sailplanes. Do you know differently?

-Evan Ludeman / T8

As someone who works on such a project, I have to disagree that it's "very simple". But I do agree with your general point, absolutely.

The fact many of the cheapy AH apps don't apparently implement true AHRS is probably laziness.

The funny thing about all this fuss is that gps derived attitude has been feasible for decades.

Ok EVERYBODY JUST TAKE A DEEP BREATH AND RELAX!

This is getting blown way out of proportion, IMO.

Fact: Cloud flying is prohibited in contests. Period. Anybody caught
intentionally doing it should be immediately kicked out of the
contest.

Fact: While it is easy to prohibit old school gyro AH and T&Bs from
cockpits, it is becoming practically impossible to ban newer devices
and/or software that would have some capability to allow cloud flying,
such as PNAs/droid phones, etc.

Fact: Many glider pilots like having some sort of attitude indicator
available - especially if they have personally experienced the need
for one and not had it available. BTDT, for example on a late evening
final glide in Illinois, heading West into the sun - there was
ABSOLUTELY NO HORIZON VISIBLE, even though it was technically still
VMC. I basically used the position of the sun on the canopy to stay
shiny side up while cruising, and while thermalling, when the sun was
out of sight behind, had literally no way to maintain pitch attitude.
That was scary...and I sure would have liked to have had a simple AH
display!

Fact: PowerFlarm is pretty soon going to be "required" at contests.

So - I suggest we change the enforcement of the cloud flying ban from
the prohibition of any device that would allow it, to the use of
"sportmanship", coupled with the ability of PowerFLARM to show what
other gliders around you are doing. If I'm circling 500' below
cloudbase, and see a PF track 2000' above me and climbing, and I look
up and see nothing but cloud - then I'm going to report that glider,
and it should be pretty easy to find out who it is via the turned in
logger traces.

Then stop worrying about it and race!

Kirk
66
No gyros - yet...

PS - I don't understand all this drivel about smartphones. Unless you
are down in the weeds, good luck getting any signal from a carrier,
and if you are dicking around with your phone trying to get the AH app
to work as you are getting sucked into a clout, I doubt you will be
much of a racing threat! Give it a rest.