A aviation & planes forum. AviationBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » AviationBanter forum » rec.aviation newsgroups » Soaring
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old October 6th 12, 02:43 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Mark
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 15
Default PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights

I had a chance to load a new config file and was able to fly today.

There was no "flarm range" in my original config file. With the file I used today the "flarm range" config was set to maximum with the statement below. I had several flarm detections that occured around 4 miles. This is between 2x and 3x what I experienced before so this is a noticable improvement. Still not 6 or 8 miles, but a nice improvement.

I re-set the PCAS ranges and the ADSB ranges and the PCAS function improved only a very small amount. I am still flying with my Zaon pcas and it reported many aircraft that the PowerFlarm did not show at all. A 172 that passed nearby was under 1 mile horizontal and if I remember the Flarm showed it around 1 mile. However it lost the contact only a few moments after it first reported the contact. I did see the towplane on PowerFlarm PCAS but a no more than 1 mile range.

After I put the glider back in the hanger I received one ADSB signal from an aircraft that was 8,000 feet higher and over 10 miles away. Since ADSB comes in on the same antenna that the PCAS receives on I think it's likely that the radio circuit and antenna are working fine and that there is real potential to improve the PCAS via the software.

I didn't see the message about the additional lines in the config file until tonight, but if I fly again this weekend I'll try to test those too.

The one pilot in our group who did not update his config file did not see the 4 mile Flarm performance so it appears that the "as shipped" settings in the brick may be limiting the performance.

The key elements in the config file that I used today are as follows:

# PCAS (transponder) range (meters)
$PFLAC,S,PCASRANGE,10000

# PCAS (transponder) vertical range (meters)
$PFLAC,S,PCASVRANGE,1000

# ADSB range (meters)
$PFLAC,S,ADSBRANGE,65535

# ADSB vertical range (meters)
$PFLAC,S,ADSBVRANGE,65535

# FLARM range (meters)
$PFLAC,S,RANGE,65535


I don't know what settings Flarm intended to have in the units as "as shipped" but I will encourage them to ship units with maximums. Far better to start off with more info and warnings and then pull back than fly around 1/2 blind.

More testing and reports as weather and opportunity present.

One side note, the data dump file that appeared on my USB stick after flying appears to be corrupted. When I got early dump files when I had just received the unit the files appeared neatly arranged with no extra characters. Currently there is tons of gibberish in the file. Not knowing how that file is created or appended, is there a way to reset or clear the file within the brick and hope for less gibberish? Might also just be my USB stick too.

Mark
  #2  
Old October 6th 12, 05:19 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
noel.wade
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 681
Default PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights

Mark and others -

Its been said many times in a few forums and websites (and I'm annoyed
they do not include it on a big red or yellow piece of paper in the
box):
YOU MUST NOT USE THE PowerFLARM UNITS (Brick or Portable) RIGHT "OUT
OF THE BOX". You *MUST* apply a configuration file, with your
aircraft's ID value in the config file. This is CRITICAL!!!

The reason is this: ADS-B (and thus FLARM) tracks your glider based on
your airplane's unique ICAO value. There are instructions on how to
find this and apply it to your config file. If you do not do this,
your FLARM will use a "default" (dummy) identifier. FLARM ignores
every signal with the same identifier as your own, to keep from
alerting you about your own position (for example, if you have a
transponder or install ADS-B out).

That means every other FLARM that is still set to the "default"
identifier will be ignored (because they all match) and you will never
see them on your FLARM display!! And the "other guy" will never see
you on his/her display!! Very, very bad.

[And yes, this is one area where I think the PowerFLARM folks could do
a better job with documentation and warning the purchaser. On the one
hand, its a complicated device that's doing a lot and its not a simple
install - so people should read instructions carefully. But on the
other hand you have to expect in this day and age that people are
going to assume something is "Plug and Play" unless you warn them off
- strongly.]

--Noel

  #3  
Old October 6th 12, 05:25 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
noel.wade
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 681
Default PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights

P.S. Should clarify that I was typing in all-caps to try to catch
people's eye; not to yell at you, Mark.
  #4  
Old October 6th 12, 06:14 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
Ramy
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 746
Default PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights

Noel, are you sure about that? If I recall correct, this parameter is optional for mode S users, and Flarm defaults to Flarm ID if you don't supply one, which is different for each unit. This is the first time I hear this explanation.
But I agree that one must configure the unit first. A friend flew without configuring his unit and we could only detect each other when circling together, I am not completely sure why. Also his display showed constant transponder alert from his own transponder.

Ramy
  #5  
Old October 6th 12, 06:41 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
noel.wade
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 681
Default PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights

On Oct 5, 10:14*pm, Ramy wrote:
Noel, are you sure about that? If I recall correct, this parameter is optional for mode S users, and Flarm defaults to Flarm ID if you don't supply one, which is different for each unit. This is the first time I hear this explanation.
But I agree that one must configure the unit first. A friend flew without configuring his unit and we could only detect each other when circling together, I am not completely sure why. Also his display showed constant transponder alert from his own transponder.

Ramy


Ramy - Maybe they fixed this in newer deliveries... I was warned
about this (along with many others) by a west-coast FLARM dealer; and
was able to confirm that two PFs in close proximity with default
settings didn't see each other; but that was back in June. I haven't
had to touch the config on my PF since Nationals so perhaps my info on
the defaults is out of date (would be a good thing if it is, I
suppose)!

--Noel

  #6  
Old October 6th 12, 09:10 AM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
pcool
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 69
Default PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights

If your PowerFlarm can use the Flarmnet database, then you are granted that
it is based on unique ID, embedded in each single delivered unit.
This is how it works in Europe, at least.


"noel.wade" wrote in message
...

On Oct 5, 10:14 pm, Ramy wrote:
Noel, are you sure about that? If I recall correct, this parameter is
optional for mode S users, and Flarm defaults to Flarm ID if you don't
supply one, which is different for each unit. This is the first time I
hear this explanation.
But I agree that one must configure the unit first. A friend flew without
configuring his unit and we could only detect each other when circling
together, I am not completely sure why. Also his display showed constant
transponder alert from his own transponder.

Ramy


Ramy - Maybe they fixed this in newer deliveries... I was warned
about this (along with many others) by a west-coast FLARM dealer; and
was able to confirm that two PFs in close proximity with default
settings didn't see each other; but that was back in June. I haven't
had to touch the config on my PF since Nationals so perhaps my info on
the defaults is out of date (would be a good thing if it is, I
suppose)!

--Noel

  #7  
Old October 6th 12, 01:15 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 94
Default PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights

Noel,

We did read and follow the instructions and DID load the config file. The point is that in the config file they include with the instructions they do NOT include all the available parameters which can be set. So if you don't know that the "secret" parameters can be set then my point is the manufacturer should set those to a maximum number and not to some smaller number.

This very issue led to us following their "instuctions" and getting 25% of the range we could have gotten. Might have saved a lot of hassle.

Mark
  #8  
Old October 6th 12, 01:51 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
FLARM
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 34
Default PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights

You do NOT need to set the ICAO ID, unless you carry a Mode S transponder (where it helps to suppress your own transponder signal).
So yes, PowerFLARM WILL work 'straight out of the box'.
Do not set the *wrong* ICAO ID.... for obvious reasons.
Setting aircraft type ('Glider' for you guys and gals) correctly will ensure that the alarm algorithms treat you properly. If you configure as 'helicopter' and circle in a gaggle of gliders you and all others will get many annoying warnings.
It's a feature, not a bug... ;-)
PowerFLARM.us has sample configuration files which are easy to adapt for your taste.

As for setting the range to maximum as factory default:
We have many users who fly in very dense airspace. The default ranges ensure that they are only warned about aircraft that may become dangerous and there is no unnecessary distraction.

  #9  
Old October 6th 12, 05:11 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
bumper[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 434
Default PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights

For those of us who don't relish the "opportunity" to dive in and experiment with config files and such . . . Butterfly has a free config file builder that does it for you using a multiple choice format that even I can figure out.

http://www.butterfly-avionics.com/in...core-config-en

bumper
  #10  
Old October 6th 12, 06:00 PM posted to rec.aviation.soaring
[email protected]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 44
Default PowerFLARM Range Issues - Part Two with info from todays flights

Mark and everybody,

The range defaults in PowerFLARM 2.40 are as follows:

FLARM: unlimited horizontal/1000ft vertical (*)
PCAS: 4NM horizontal/2000ft vertical
ADS-B: unlimited

(*) The vertical FLARM range cannot be changed.

Additional sensitivity restrictions for both FLARM and PCAS/ADS-B apply.

All values can be reset to the defaults using

$pflac,defaults

There was no "flarm range" in my original config file. With the file I used today the "flarm range" config was set to maximum with the statement below. I had several flarm detections that occured around 4 miles. This is between 2x and 3x what I experienced before so this is a noticable improvement. Still not 6 or 8 miles, but a nice improvement.


That's a strong hint that there was something wrong with your configuration.. Glad that
it works better now.

After I put the glider back in the hanger I received one ADSB signal from an aircraft that was 8,000 feet higher and over 10 miles away. Since ADSB comes in on the same antenna that the PCAS receives on I think it's likely that the radio circuit and antenna are working fine and that there is real potential to improve the PCAS via the software.


Yes, that indicates that your installation is otherwise OK.

The one pilot in our group who did not update his config file did not see the 4 mile Flarm performance so it appears that the "as shipped" settings in the brick may be limiting the performance.


See above for defaults.

$PFLAC,S,PCASRANGE,10000


This is above 5NM and will be ignored (note to myself: it should be set to the maximum
instead, will fix that).

$PFLAC,S,PCASVRANGE,1000


OK
$PFLAC,S,ADSBRANGE,65535


OK

$PFLAC,S,ADSBVRANGE,65535


OK, but I'd recommend to reduce it to values useful for traffic awareness
in order to reduce clutter.

$PFLAC,S,RANGE,65535


OK

More testing and reports as weather and opportunity present.


Thanks in advance!

One side note, the data dump file that appeared on my USB stick after flying appears to be corrupted. When I got early dump files when I had just received the unit the files appeared neatly arranged with no extra characters. Currently there is tons of gibberish in the file. Not knowing how that file is created or appended, is there a way to reset or clear the file within the brick and hope for less gibberish? Might also just be my USB stick too.


Can you send my your original flarmcfg.txt and the dump file by personal mail?

Best
--Gerhard
--
Dr. Gerhard Wesp
Development Manager, Avionics
FLARM Technology GmbH
Switzerland
CH-020.4.033.059-8

 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
PowerFlarm BRICK range issues - are we alone???? Mark Soaring 79 October 17th 12 12:17 PM
PowerFLarm expected range [email protected] Soaring 6 August 30th 12 03:43 PM
PowerFLARM deployment issues SoaringXCellence Soaring 6 December 6th 10 12:23 AM
Places for good info on US-Canada flights? Colin W Kingsbury Piloting 9 January 27th 05 12:03 AM
FAA to End part 91 Sightseeing flights? Vaughn Rotorcraft 7 November 2nd 03 01:20 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:21 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 AviationBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.