Self fly hire in the US

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
om...
"S Green" wrote in message
...
"Nigel" wrote in message
...
I am from the UK and I'm visiting the US for my summer vacation this
year
and plan to do some flying from a flying school in Naples Florida. I
have
a
UK and US license and all I want is a bi-annual/check ride and then
rent a
plane for a couple of trips around the general area, maybe even
venture
down
to Key West as I have done before..

Do I need to obtain a US visa for this?

Nigel

If you have a private pilots license and you merely wish to build up
flight
hours, you will require a B-2 visa. While you may be eligible to travel
visa free under the Visa Waiver Program, if otherwise qualified, since
the
introduction of the Applicability of Aviation and Transportation
Security
Act, we would recommend that you apply for a B-2 visa.
When applying for the B-2 visa and entry into the U.S. you will be
required
to furnish a letter from the flight school stating the type of aircraft
you
will be flying.

Detailed information on visa application procedures and advice on how to
schedule an interview at the Embassy is available from our website at
www.usembassy.org.uk



I am not an expert on this subject, but this sounds quite ridiculous.
His primary reason for visiting the U.S. is vacation, not flying.
Renting an airplane is incidental to his travel, just like renting a
car, or a bicycle. Why does that require a special visa? Does a
regular tourist visa prohibit one from renting or purchasing an
aircraft?

As the advice says you may be able to hour build ie rent on the Visa waiver
program but it recommends getting the B-2 (tourist visa) and a letter from
the plane company to give details of the planes you are likely to hire.

Anyone in doubt should read this link:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...threadid=65838

"Martin Hotze" wrote in message
...
"S Green" wrote:

Act, we would recommend that you apply for a B-2 visa.


who is "we"?

When applying for the B-2 visa and entry into the U.S. you will be
required
to furnish a letter from the flight school stating the type of aircraft
you
will be flying.

Detailed information on visa application procedures and advice on how to
schedule an interview at the Embassy is available from our website at

"our website"? so you're working at the US embassy in the UK?

www.usembassy.org.uk

Extract from a response by the US embassy to exactly this question.
I thought it appropriate to contact the embassy for an answer. with all due
respect to the immigration experts in this group I felt that the government
might be the ones to ask. They make the rules.
Who recommends - the embassy visa section recommend a B2 visa. It may be ok
to enter via the visa waiver but having a tourist B2 visa seems safer.

"Cub Driver" wrote in message
...

I am not an expert on this subject, but this sounds quite ridiculous.
His primary reason for visiting the U.S. is vacation, not flying.

Well, Mohammed Atta's primary visiting for visiting the U.S. was
suicide and mass destruction. The flight instruction was secondary.


The rules are there to protect American citizens. Not being American, if I
want to visit your country I will follow your rules until they become so
difficult that its not worth it. Then I will go and spend my cash elsewhere.

I am ****ed about the imposition it has on my flying but at the end of the
day the 911 terrorists learnt to fly at US flying schools.

Incidentally, the authorities are interested in the size of plane and when I
visited at Christmas to do some training (4hours) I had the visa, and a
letter saying that the plane was less than 12,500 pounds.

To do 4 hours training, (JAR to FAA conversion) the visa paperwork took
three hours, the visa cost $100 and I had to wait 4 hours for a 2 minute
interview at the embassy.

"Eclipsme" wrote in message
...

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
om...
"S Green" wrote in message
...
"Nigel" wrote in message
...
I am from the UK and I'm visiting the US for my summer vacation this
year
and plan to do some flying from a flying school in Naples Florida. I
have
a
UK and US license and all I want is a bi-annual/check ride and then
rent a
plane for a couple of trips around the general area, maybe even
venture
down
to Key West as I have done before..

Do I need to obtain a US visa for this?

Nigel

If you have a private pilots license and you merely wish to build up
flight
hours, you will require a B-2 visa. While you may be eligible to
travel
visa free under the Visa Waiver Program, if otherwise qualified, since
the
introduction of the Applicability of Aviation and Transportation
Security
Act, we would recommend that you apply for a B-2 visa.
When applying for the B-2 visa and entry into the U.S. you will be
required
to furnish a letter from the flight school stating the type of
aircraft
you
will be flying.

Detailed information on visa application procedures and advice on how
to
schedule an interview at the Embassy is available from our website at
www.usembassy.org.uk



I am not an expert on this subject, but this sounds quite ridiculous.
His primary reason for visiting the U.S. is vacation, not flying.
Renting an airplane is incidental to his travel, just like renting a
car, or a bicycle. Why does that require a special visa? Does a
regular tourist visa prohibit one from renting or purchasing an
aircraft?

Yes, I hesitate commenting, but I have never been asked for my passport
when
renting a plane - just my medical, license and logbook. Why would a visa
be
required and why would an FBO ask for one? Of course, if you do not have
an
FAA license I would understand, but this person has one.

Harvey

You need the visa to get into the country not to rent a plane. To rent you
need to produce your medical, licence and logbook. Being foreign, I keep my
passport on me because the FARs require photo ID when exercising the
privileges of the licence / certificate.

"S Green" wrote in message
...

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
om...
"S Green" wrote in message
...
"Nigel" wrote in message
...
I am from the UK and I'm visiting the US for my summer vacation this
year
and plan to do some flying from a flying school in Naples Florida. I
have
a
UK and US license and all I want is a bi-annual/check ride and then
rent a
plane for a couple of trips around the general area, maybe even
venture
down
to Key West as I have done before..

Do I need to obtain a US visa for this?

Nigel

If you have a private pilots license and you merely wish to build up
flight
hours, you will require a B-2 visa. While you may be eligible to
travel
visa free under the Visa Waiver Program, if otherwise qualified, since
the
introduction of the Applicability of Aviation and Transportation
Security
Act, we would recommend that you apply for a B-2 visa.
When applying for the B-2 visa and entry into the U.S. you will be
required
to furnish a letter from the flight school stating the type of
aircraft
you
will be flying.

Detailed information on visa application procedures and advice on how
to
schedule an interview at the Embassy is available from our website at
www.usembassy.org.uk



I am not an expert on this subject, but this sounds quite ridiculous.
His primary reason for visiting the U.S. is vacation, not flying.
Renting an airplane is incidental to his travel, just like renting a
car, or a bicycle. Why does that require a special visa? Does a
regular tourist visa prohibit one from renting or purchasing an
aircraft?

As the advice says you may be able to hour build ie rent on the Visa
waiver
program but it recommends getting the B-2 (tourist visa) and a letter from
the plane company to give details of the planes you are likely to hire.

Anyone in doubt should read this link:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...threadid=65838

I've read the link. It says that if he has a FAA license he can come on the
visa waver program and fly as long has he meets the usual BFR/Medical
standards.

Where do you get the bit about recommending getting a B-2? You
realize what a complete pain in the neck this is these days, don't you?
Why make it more complicated?

"Tony Cox" wrote in message
hlink.net...
"S Green" wrote in message
...

"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message
om...
"S Green" wrote in message
...
"Nigel" wrote in message
...
I am from the UK and I'm visiting the US for my summer vacation
this
year
and plan to do some flying from a flying school in Naples Florida.
I
have
a
UK and US license and all I want is a bi-annual/check ride and
then
rent a
plane for a couple of trips around the general area, maybe even
venture
down
to Key West as I have done before..

Do I need to obtain a US visa for this?

Nigel

If you have a private pilots license and you merely wish to build up
flight
hours, you will require a B-2 visa. While you may be eligible to
travel
visa free under the Visa Waiver Program, if otherwise qualified,
since
the
introduction of the Applicability of Aviation and Transportation
Security
Act, we would recommend that you apply for a B-2 visa.
When applying for the B-2 visa and entry into the U.S. you will be
required
to furnish a letter from the flight school stating the type of
aircraft
you
will be flying.

Detailed information on visa application procedures and advice on
how
to
schedule an interview at the Embassy is available from our website
at
www.usembassy.org.uk



I am not an expert on this subject, but this sounds quite ridiculous.
His primary reason for visiting the U.S. is vacation, not flying.
Renting an airplane is incidental to his travel, just like renting a
car, or a bicycle. Why does that require a special visa? Does a
regular tourist visa prohibit one from renting or purchasing an
aircraft?

As the advice says you may be able to hour build ie rent on the Visa
waiver
program but it recommends getting the B-2 (tourist visa) and a letter
from
the plane company to give details of the planes you are likely to hire.

Anyone in doubt should read this link:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...threadid=65838

I've read the link. It says that if he has a FAA license he can come on
the
visa waver program and fly as long has he meets the usual BFR/Medical
standards.

Where do you get the bit about recommending getting a B-2? You
realize what a complete pain in the neck this is these days, don't you?
Why make it more complicated?

Read further up this post, the info came from the US embassy. As I say if in
doubt write to them yourself. The advice in the link was posted in Feb 2003,
the advice from the US embassy was January 2004



When I queried the bit about the recommendation they came up with this:

Some travellers are eligible to travel under the Visa Waiver Program in lieu
of a B-2 visa. While you may meet the requirements for visa free travel, we
recommend that you apply for a visa, which will ease your entry into the
United States. Please bear in mind, however, that the information above is
only appropriate if you are only building up flight hours.

If you intend to receive flight training in the US, you will require an F, J
or M visa.

At the end of the day you can choose to take the advice or not it is up to
you.

If you decide it is too much trouble then fine, go and spend your money
somewhere else, but if you really want to fly in the US follow the rules.
And remember this bit of information from the US embassy website

A visa is issued by a U.S. Embassy or Consulate. A visa entitles the holder
to travel to the United States and apply for admission; it does not
guarantee entry. An immigration inspector at the port of entry determines
the visa holder's eligibility for admission into the United States.

You may not have a US certificate anymore, you'll need to check.

A friend of mine had a US certificate based (PP-ASEL) on a UK PPL. He made
an appointment for an IFR checkride and was told that all certs based on
foreign licenses had been revoked. He had to take the PP and IR checkride
the same day.


"Nigel" wrote in message
...
I am from the UK and I'm visiting the US for my summer vacation this year
and plan to do some flying from a flying school in Naples Florida. I have
a
UK and US license and all I want is a bi-annual/check ride and then rent a
plane for a couple of trips around the general area, maybe even venture
down
to Key West as I have done before..

Do I need to obtain a US visa for this?

Nigel

"S Green" wrote in message
...

"Tony Cox" wrote in message
hlink.net...

Where do you get the bit about recommending getting a B-2? You
realize what a complete pain in the neck this is these days, don't you?
Why make it more complicated?

Read further up this post, the info came from the US embassy. As I say if
in
doubt write to them yourself. The advice in the link was posted in Feb
2003,
the advice from the US embassy was January 2004

Well, that information is completely different from the info
in the link you told people to read if in doubt. There it
says "If you are coming to hour build or a flying
holiday and have a FAA Licence or an FAA licence
issued on the basis of your Foreign Licence, you
can enter the country on a Visa Waiver and fly as
long as you meet the F.A.R.s. (BFR, Medical, etc.)"

Since Nigel has an FAA license, plans to do a little
flying, and will meet the BFR/Medical requirements,
he doesn't need a visa, according to that advice.

He doesn't plan any flight training, so he doesn't need
a student visa. Still, having been myself at the wrong
end of the INS idiots from time to time, when entering
he'd be best to just say he's coming on holiday. I very
much doubt that the immigration officer would specifically
demand to know if he was planning a _flying_ holiday.
Why should they, unless he tries to clear customs with
David Clarks on his head?

Security wise, the man's got an FAA license, which means he
is 'known' to the authorities here. If he was a terrorist, he'd
have had his license suspended. Of course, the subtleties
of this are no doubt lost on the INS or whatever they are
called these days.


At the end of the day you can choose to take the advice or not it is up to
you.

It's not clear what your advice is, since the link you provided and the
answer from the embassy disagree.

"Steve Foley" wrote in message
You may not have a US certificate anymore, you'll need to check.

A friend of mine had a US certificate based (PP-ASEL) on a UK PPL. He made
an appointment for an IFR checkride and was told that all certs based on
foreign licenses had been revoked. He had to take the PP and IR checkride
the same day.

someone was pulling your friend's leg.

I happen to have both, i.e., a private certificate established on the
basis of a foreign licence (under 14 CFR 61.75), and a commercial
certificate I later earned here (in California) -- having both is possible
because I obtained the FAA commercial certificate *after* getting the
private certificate under 61.75 and it contains a glider rating that I do
not have on my commercial certificate (yet! :-); the specifics are
spelled out in 14 CFR 61.75(b)(3) (check out how it is worded!), as well
as the "Pilot Examiner's Handbook", Order 8710.3C, paragraph 53.H.2, pp.5-16);

anyway, certificates issued under 61.75 have not, to my knowledge,
been revoked (unless your friend benefits from special considerations
so to speak);

--Sylvain

"Steve Foley" wrote in message ...
You may not have a US certificate anymore, you'll need to check.

A friend of mine had a US certificate based (PP-ASEL) on a UK PPL. He made
an appointment for an IFR checkride and was told that all certs based on
foreign licenses had been revoked. He had to take the PP and IR checkride
the same day.


I think something got lost in the translation. I believe there may
have also been a temporary prohibitation on issuing US private
certificates on the bases of foreign tickets. That's probably what
happened to your friend. He probably showed up to get a US ticket on
the bases of his UK and then take the checkride but the FSDO was
temporarily unable to do the issuance. BTW: What good is the IFR
rating in the U.K.? Is it true you need to have an ATP to fly real IFR
in the U.K. in a U.K. registered aircraft?

-Robert