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#12
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"Bruce W.1" wrote in message newsqxhc.33883$fq4.8309@lakeread05... I would not want to have to use a Baretta 9mm for survival. But that seems to be what our AF is stuck with. Maybe the whole notion of having to survive in the wild is a thing of the past, what with GPS, satellite beacons and all. Times have changed. "Surviving" off the land isn't really emphasized all that much anymore. Its about evading and getting rescued. Any survival issues are generally assumed to be short term in nature. |
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"SteveM8597" wrote in message ... I have carried a firearm a time or two while backpacking in grizzly country but not in state and national parks where they are illegal. Yes, the bears and wild two-legged animals will no doubt respect the law as you do. |
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Harry Andreas wrote: In article , (SteveM8597) wrote: I have carried a firearm a time or two while backpacking in grizzly country but not in state and national parks where they are illegal. I hear the situation in some of the CA parks is pretty bad, though. Not what I would consider a survival situation, just common sense. Best bet for bear and cougar defense is actually pepper spray, although I've also carried a .357, especially when hiking with kids. So, pepper spray doesn't work well on kids? Bob McKellar |
#15
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In article , Bob McKellar
wrote: Harry Andreas wrote: In article , (SteveM8597) wrote: I have carried a firearm a time or two while backpacking in grizzly country but not in state and national parks where they are illegal. I hear the situation in some of the CA parks is pretty bad, though. Not what I would consider a survival situation, just common sense. Best bet for bear and cougar defense is actually pepper spray, although I've also carried a .357, especially when hiking with kids. So, pepper spray doesn't work well on kids? Bob McKellar LOL. But seriously, pepper spray has limited range and is OK for your own personal protection. But if a cat threatens or grabs a kid you need to be able to reach out and touch the cat. I wouldn't try a handgun on a bear though. Too dicey. -- Harry Andreas Engineering raconteur |
#16
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Harry Andreas wrote: In article , Bob McKellar wrote: Harry Andreas wrote: In article , (SteveM8597) wrote: I have carried a firearm a time or two while backpacking in grizzly country but not in state and national parks where they are illegal. I hear the situation in some of the CA parks is pretty bad, though. Not what I would consider a survival situation, just common sense. Best bet for bear and cougar defense is actually pepper spray, although I've also carried a .357, especially when hiking with kids. So, pepper spray doesn't work well on kids? Bob McKellar LOL. But seriously, pepper spray has limited range and is OK for your own personal protection. But if a cat threatens or grabs a kid you need to be able to reach out and touch the cat. I wouldn't try a handgun on a bear though. Too dicey. -- Harry Andreas Engineering raconteur I took a Navy correspondence course on "Arctic Operations". The advice for shooting a polar bear was to aim for the shoulder, since their skulls are too thick to be easily penetrated. It sorta reminded me of some of our regular posters around here. Bob McKellar |
#17
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"Harry Andreas" wrote in message ... In article , Bob McKellar wrote: Harry Andreas wrote: In article , (SteveM8597) wrote: I have carried a firearm a time or two while backpacking in grizzly country but not in state and national parks where they are illegal. I hear the situation in some of the CA parks is pretty bad, though. Not what I would consider a survival situation, just common sense. Best bet for bear and cougar defense is actually pepper spray, although I've also carried a .357, especially when hiking with kids. So, pepper spray doesn't work well on kids? Bob McKellar LOL. But seriously, pepper spray has limited range and is OK for your own personal protection. But if a cat threatens or grabs a kid you need to be able to reach out and touch the cat. I wouldn't try a handgun on a bear though. Too dicey. The ol' Black Bear actually accounts for many more attacks against humans in the US than does the Grizzly, which makes sense being as they are more widely distributed and have a larger population. I carried a 12 guage pump with a slug barrel when I went fishing by myself in Alaska (on the Kenai and close-by streams)--and of course the only bear I saw was the stuffed one standing in the airport building at Fairbanks when I flew in. Pepper spray is bettter than nothing, but I remember camping in the park in the Smoky's a few years back and a ranger stopping by our campsite to warn us of a rogue black bear that they were trying to catch (they had one of those neat galvanized pipe traps near the hike-in only campsite) in the area. He said that it had ransacked the campsite a few days earlier and one of the campers hit it with pepper spray in the face without seriously discouraging it, so the guaranteed-quality of capsiacin aginst a Grizzly is somewhat suspect. A good handgun, where it is allowed, would be my preference over the spray, and the caliber is sort of dependent upon the shooter's ability--the favored round for poachers going after black bears is still the .22 (albeit in rifle form), last I heard, and I know of one case where a camper killed a black that had attacked him with a .22 pistol. Though I'd rather have a .40 S&W or better in Grizzly country if I had to leave the shotgun behind (saying something about my confidence, or lack thereof, in my own short-iron shooting ability). Brooks -- Harry Andreas Engineering raconteur |
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"Bob McKellar" wrote in message ... Harry Andreas wrote: In article , Bob McKellar wrote: Harry Andreas wrote: In article , (SteveM8597) wrote: I have carried a firearm a time or two while backpacking in grizzly country but not in state and national parks where they are illegal. I hear the situation in some of the CA parks is pretty bad, though. Not what I would consider a survival situation, just common sense. Best bet for bear and cougar defense is actually pepper spray, although I've also carried a .357, especially when hiking with kids. So, pepper spray doesn't work well on kids? Bob McKellar LOL. But seriously, pepper spray has limited range and is OK for your own personal protection. But if a cat threatens or grabs a kid you need to be able to reach out and touch the cat. I wouldn't try a handgun on a bear though. Too dicey. -- Harry Andreas Engineering raconteur I took a Navy correspondence course on "Arctic Operations". The advice for shooting a polar bear was to aim for the shoulder, since their skulls are too thick to be easily penetrated. It sorta reminded me of some of our regular posters around here. Aiming for the shoulder with a handgun is more likely to just **** him off, and if he is close it is probably a wasted effort--a bear has a pretty slow cardio-pulmonary rate, so a shoulder-into-chest cavity shot (which requires a lot of penetration capability against a big bear) is likely to leave you still facing him up-close-and-personal, even if he is destined to die to few minutes later. A lot of critters have thick skulls--hogs among them, and my daddy used a .22 *short* to dispatch a few of them on the farm. I'd prefer to just avoid the critter, but if forced to, I think I'd have to go for the head shot if he is getting close enough to me to really have to change the britches. If you don't kill him, you can still KO his butt--dear ol' Dad once dropped a doe with a headshot using a .30-30 (with a 170 grain load, to boot) from no more than about seventy yards. Went down flatter than a pancake without twitching a muscle. It laid there a few seconds, then as he was getting ready to walk down to it it jumped back up, shook her head a couple of times, and bounded off like she was good as new, though a bit wobbly. Figured the round glanced off her skull. Brooks Bob McKellar |
#19
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#20
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Kevin Brooks wrote:
The ol' Black Bear actually accounts for many more attacks against humans in the US than does the Grizzly, which makes sense being as they are more widely distributed and have a larger population. I carried a 12 guage pump Are you certain of that? I've read quite consistently that the black bear is really very slow to attack a human, even when it has cubs. Attacks are extremely rare. I think the last I heard, a couple years ago a woman jogging around somewhere in Quebec was killed by a black bear. It was an exceptional event! I guess I should find out more. We've got *plenty* of black bears around here, and they're definitely done with their winter naps. Had my first encounter with one for this year just a few days ago. It growled at my dog, made a short charge towards the dog, and then took off. This would be my 5th encounter with local black bears in about 3 years, and usually, they just skeedadle as fast as possible when they see me. The critters are *everywhere* around here now days! SMH |
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