Make Sailplane Racing Great Again

I would agree that CGC is indeed a good example in many metrics, but it is an outlier and far from perfect. You guys have turned away 0 time pilots for years, and the equipment stays in the hangar on far too many days. I don't bash US clubs because it is "en vouge", Sean, I mean Wilber asked why sailplane racing is in decline. From my point of view the decline is largely due to a lack of viable path ways for the 0 time pilot. X/C is still seen as exotic by the wind sock warriors because they are led by the blind and forced to ride a lame horse.
Your comment suggesting I try to improve things instead of complaining is way off the mark. You know full well I am a contributor, and you've only seen the tip of the iceberg. This culture you don't know you're defending works AGAINST progress in the direction of high performance aircraft and soaring. I might have left SSI for a club like yours 20 years ago but I feel my club is worth saving.

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 10:02:54 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 11:22:20 PM UTC-6, wrote:
Q-"What are, in your opinion, the weakest links to sailplane racing?"
A- Poor instructor experience level nationally, and poor fleet nationally speaking.

Soaring is not fostered by the clubs in the US, gliding is. If you can't soar, you can't race. A newly minted pilot must choose between a 20-100k investment and teach themselves to fly X/C or earn an instructor certificate and spend the rest of their days in the back of a 2-33. (this is why membership is down.) The self starters who spend their money to buy a private ship care little about fostering a fledgling pilot unless they want to buy a glider and try to keep up. The whole system is out of wack. Clubs that won't invest in high performance equipment and advanced instruction miss the opportunity to sustain membership and improve the sport. The instructor group refuses to acknowledge the problem because it exposes their inexperience in x/c and time in high performance a/c. They have no desire to invest money out of pocket as club members in the higher performance a/c or the financial investment required of themselves to become x/c proficient.
Take a look at the JR. program in the UK. Do you think they expect those kids to buy their own gliders and figure it out themselves? No, they have real instructors and real sailplanes. If you have a large number of x/c proficient pilots with a bunch of high performance gliders laying around the racing part will take care of itself.

-Doug

Doug, beating up on US clubs maybe en vogue but doesn't come close to the truth. As a member of 2 clubs that own ASK-21's, a Duo, an ASW-24, LS6 and LS4's we promote x-country flying and beg members to use these assets. We also have competent competition pilots to show them the ropes. Maligning the US club culture is not helping, how about you working on improving it?
Herb

Being an armchair critic requires 15 seconds. Being a builder of the sport requires a lifetime of commitment.
Our club does primary in 2-33's (gasp), advanced in ASK-21. We teach XC in both.
We have 2 1-26's and a 1-34 for solo XC. Our Juniors have their own 1-26 and Std Libelle for XC. Three,possibly four of our juniors will fly in contests this year, with some others doing contest "riding" where they fly the task assisted by an experienced contest pilot.
Harris Hill does the same, except their juniors have a Discus.
FWIW
UH

Soaring is not fostered by the clubs in the US, gliding is. If you can't
soar, you can't race. A newly minted pilot must choose between a 20-100k
investment and teach themselves to fly X/C or earn an instructor
certificate and spend the rest of their days in the back of a 2-33. (this
is why membership is down.) The self starters who spend their money to
buy a private ship care little about fostering a fledgling pilot unless
they want to buy a glider and try to keep up. The whole system is out of
wack. Clubs that won't invest in high performance equipment and advanced
instruction miss the opportunity to sustain membership and improve the
sport. The instructor group refuses to acknowledge the problem because
it exposes their inexperience in x/c and time in high performance a/c.
They have no desire to invest money out of pocket as club members in the
higher performance a/c or the financial investment required of themselves
to become x/c proficient. Take a look at the JR. program in the UK. Do
you think they expect those kids to buy their own gliders and figure it
out themselves? No, they have real instructors and real sailplanes. If
you have a large number of x/c proficient pilots with a bunch of high
performance gliders laying around the racing part will take care of
itself.

Other than desiring soaring's future health to be (at the very least) no worse
than it is today, I have no skin in the soaring racing game...though I *do*
maintain a 'following interest' in soaring competitions.

The (U.S.) club to which I belong has long-owned a DG-505 and a Discus at the
'performance top' of its fleet, has long-/actively-encouraged XC (in club
ships), and is currently contemplating exchanging the last of its G-103s for
'something else' (TBD, and presumably more modern, and of higher performance).

I've a hard time identifying with broad-brush bashing of 'U.S. club/instructor
culture' for several reasons:

1) I know for a fact my club isn't the only one of similar
philosophic/club/fleet structure in the States, therefore such '2-33 and
instructor-based bashing,' is demonstrably inaccurate (though I suppose it
does allow one comfort in simplistic, pre-conceived notions).

2) It also ignores a host of other, human-nature and economic-realities-based
issues impacting sailplane competition.

Analogies and comparisons are always imperfect, but - so far - no one has
drawn an aviation-based one, so I will: closed course speed racing. Arguably,
the proportion of GA pilots participating at Reno (continually going on since
the '60s, for the past few years viewable-with real-time commentary on the
web, and before then occasionally even on subscriptionless, over-the-air,
network-based TV) is no higher than soaring's competitive contingent, i.e.
'small.' Jets and hopped-up ex-WW-II airframes are at one end of the available
classes, highly-restricted 200-cubic-inch-engined Formula I and homebuilt
bipes another. And, some 'soaring nuts' also participate in power-plane racing
activities, to the point (even!) of owner-operated, seriously-recognized (and
presumably profitable), business-based concerns! And while there may be babes
hanging around the periphery of some of power-plane racing classes, somehow I
doubt they're the fundamental sustaining interest in participating. And
yet...very few 'mass market people' follow (are even aware of?) the activity,
and far fewer actively participate in it.

The point attempting to be made here, is that - in today's world - fans
semi-actively participating in 'attracts the masses' *racing* pretty much
isn't a reality in other than niche markets of automobile racing (NASCAR;
Formula I; CART; WEC; etc.), bicycle racing (arguably country-specific and
scandal-riddled), and America's Cup boat racing. I may have missed a sport or
two, but a little critical thought should lead a person toward the conclusion
that mass-spectator-engaged racing, and mass-participation-racing (with
associated spectators), simply isn't ever likely for soaring, given human
nature. And that's *without* considering any other factors at all, e.g. time,
money, etc.

That said, in no way do I wish to discourage anyone from indulging their
interest (or interests) in sailplane racing (I've attended several contests
just because I could, and twice as a crew), or even seeking to grow the
activity. More power to everyone so inclined! I'm merely hoping to keep stuff
like 'RAS commentary' and 'personal visions/hopes' more or less 'within
sensible boundaries.' Visionaries often help advance all manner of human
endeavor (and, arguably, just as often fail miserably...as the history of
aviation amply demonstrates). I simply am of the opinion that 'more or less
reality-based visions' are more likely to accomplish measurable positive
progress than those based upon wishful thinking or casual,
arguably-unsubstantial, denigration.

Respectfully,
Bob W.

Just to build on this... Our little slice of the world (eastern Region 2) generates contest participation disproportionate to our size and especially to our soaring conditions. Why? It's because 3 or 4 sites are committed to building/fostering an active XC community. Without an active XC community, you can't have racing.

At Aero Club Albatross for example, we push people out of the nest early on. Once they get a Silver distance (in a 1-26), they have access to a 1-34R. After the 1-34, they can move into an LS3 or an LS4. Oh, and we've refurbished 2 of the 3 glass birds from basket cases to like-new condition ourselves. It's not due to some top-down mandate but rather a culture that's been formed over decades.

Now, we have clubs at Randall (UH's group) and Brandywine (Philadelphia area) to compete against thanks to similarly driven and growing clubs.

Message: Think global. Act local. It's actually not that hard . It just takes a few people who will abandon the keyboard and actually go out and do stuff.

Erik Mann
Refinisher-in-Chief, ACA



On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 11:13:24 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 10:02:54 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 11:22:20 PM UTC-6, wrote:
Q-"What are, in your opinion, the weakest links to sailplane racing?"
A- Poor instructor experience level nationally, and poor fleet nationally speaking.

Soaring is not fostered by the clubs in the US, gliding is. If you can't soar, you can't race. A newly minted pilot must choose between a 20-100k investment and teach themselves to fly X/C or earn an instructor certificate and spend the rest of their days in the back of a 2-33. (this is why membership is down.) The self starters who spend their money to buy a private ship care little about fostering a fledgling pilot unless they want to buy a glider and try to keep up. The whole system is out of wack. Clubs that won't invest in high performance equipment and advanced instruction miss the opportunity to sustain membership and improve the sport. The instructor group refuses to acknowledge the problem because it exposes their inexperience in x/c and time in high performance a/c. They have no desire to invest money out of pocket as club members in the higher performance a/c or the financial investment required of themselves to become x/c proficient.
Take a look at the JR. program in the UK. Do you think they expect those kids to buy their own gliders and figure it out themselves? No, they have real instructors and real sailplanes. If you have a large number of x/c proficient pilots with a bunch of high performance gliders laying around the racing part will take care of itself.

-Doug

Doug, beating up on US clubs maybe en vogue but doesn't come close to the truth. As a member of 2 clubs that own ASK-21's, a Duo, an ASW-24, LS6 and LS4's we promote x-country flying and beg members to use these assets. We also have competent competition pilots to show them the ropes. Maligning the US club culture is not helping, how about you working on improving it?
Herb

Being an armchair critic requires 15 seconds. Being a builder of the sport requires a lifetime of commitment.
Our club does primary in 2-33's (gasp), advanced in ASK-21. We teach XC in both.
We have 2 1-26's and a 1-34 for solo XC. Our Juniors have their own 1-26 and Std Libelle for XC. Three,possibly four of our juniors will fly in contests this year, with some others doing contest "riding" where they fly the task assisted by an experienced contest pilot.
Harris Hill does the same, except their juniors have a Discus.
FWIW
UH

I transitioned from power to glider, am in my 30's, and would like to compete. That might put me into the "sweet spot" of folks who are good candidates to bolster contest participation. Here are my thoughts.

You can change the rules to try to increase participation. But I don't think it'll help. Public exposure to soaring is just plain low. Few people know about it, few people dream of it, and few people understand it. The wide end of the funnel isn't catching enough people.

I think the sport needs to think hard about how to engage young, adventurous engineers, who are a great demographic in many ways. Soaring should be the place you go after you get tired of kite-boarding and your career achievements mean you can afford more than a mountain bike.

(First post, be nice.)

You're right!

On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 9:16:08 AM UTC-8, Papa3 wrote:
Just to build on this... Our little slice of the world (eastern Region 2) generates contest participation disproportionate to our size and especially to our soaring conditions. Why? It's because 3 or 4 sites are committed to building/fostering an active XC community. Without an active XC community, you can't have racing.

At Aero Club Albatross for example, we push people out of the nest early on. Once they get a Silver distance (in a 1-26), they have access to a 1-34R. After the 1-34, they can move into an LS3 or an LS4. Oh, and we've refurbished 2 of the 3 glass birds from basket cases to like-new condition ourselves. It's not due to some top-down mandate but rather a culture that's been formed over decades.

Now, we have clubs at Randall (UH's group) and Brandywine (Philadelphia area) to compete against thanks to similarly driven and growing clubs.

Message: Think global. Act local. It's actually not that hard . It just takes a few people who will abandon the keyboard and actually go out and do stuff.

Erik Mann
Refinisher-in-Chief, ACA



On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 11:13:24 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thursday, March 9, 2017 at 10:02:54 AM UTC-5, wrote:
On Wednesday, March 8, 2017 at 11:22:20 PM UTC-6, wrote:
Q-"What are, in your opinion, the weakest links to sailplane racing?"
A- Poor instructor experience level nationally, and poor fleet nationally speaking.

Soaring is not fostered by the clubs in the US, gliding is. If you can't soar, you can't race. A newly minted pilot must choose between a 20-100k investment and teach themselves to fly X/C or earn an instructor certificate and spend the rest of their days in the back of a 2-33. (this is why membership is down.) The self starters who spend their money to buy a private ship care little about fostering a fledgling pilot unless they want to buy a glider and try to keep up. The whole system is out of wack. Clubs that won't invest in high performance equipment and advanced instruction miss the opportunity to sustain membership and improve the sport. The instructor group refuses to acknowledge the problem because it exposes their inexperience in x/c and time in high performance a/c. They have no desire to invest money out of pocket as club members in the higher performance a/c or the financial investment required of themselves to become x/c proficient.
Take a look at the JR. program in the UK. Do you think they expect those kids to buy their own gliders and figure it out themselves? No, they have real instructors and real sailplanes. If you have a large number of x/c proficient pilots with a bunch of high performance gliders laying around the racing part will take care of itself.

-Doug

Doug, beating up on US clubs maybe en vogue but doesn't come close to the truth. As a member of 2 clubs that own ASK-21's, a Duo, an ASW-24, LS6 and LS4's we promote x-country flying and beg members to use these assets. We also have competent competition pilots to show them the ropes. Maligning the US club culture is not helping, how about you working on improving it?
Herb

Being an armchair critic requires 15 seconds. Being a builder of the sport requires a lifetime of commitment.
Our club does primary in 2-33's (gasp), advanced in ASK-21. We teach XC in both.
We have 2 1-26's and a 1-34 for solo XC. Our Juniors have their own 1-26 and Std Libelle for XC. Three,possibly four of our juniors will fly in contests this year, with some others doing contest "riding" where they fly the task assisted by an experienced contest pilot.
Harris Hill does the same, except their juniors have a Discus.
FWIW
UH

Erik (and Hank and others) make important points. I'd offer a couple of thoughts.

Glider racing is basically s subscription business in that you need to attract "customers" (Glider Pilots -- XC Pilots -- Racing Pilots) at some considerable upfront cost and effort and attempt to retain them. The basic health of the business is therefore dictated by "installed base churn" - that is, you need more people coming in than going out.

Generally retention is cheaper and easier than running more volume through the customer acquisition pipeline, but it has limits (at minimum people retire ultimately). Keeping racing engaging and fun (in terms of the the competition itself and socially) helps retain pilots. People in my part of the world call this good UX design (user experience). We should ask ourselves why Seniors, Perry, Nephi and a few other places draw so well. For some the adventure of a new environment and the promise of exceptional flying conditions are alluring, but good UX for participants (and those who support these events) is more than that.

No matter what you do with retention, you still have to attract new blood through some or all of the Glider Pilot -- XC Pilot -- Racing Pilot customer acquisition chain. That process basically requires that the impetus and motivation to move forward exceed the obstacles. I think Erik and Hank have it basically right. There are obstacles related available time, distance and suitable equipment for XC that need to be knocked down (some - like distance - are harder to solve for), but are also relatively straightforward approaches to increasing the motivation to move forward. It is partly intrinsic (the person needs to have the flying/racing "gene"), but much of it is human relationships and social. This is where training, mentoring, encouragement, and making the process socially attractive matter. For instance, getting into this sport requires a high ratio of non-flying to flying time - what's that time look like in terms of UX? Dealing with those things takes more time than money and that can be easy or hard, depending on whether there are people willing to invest and stick with it.

Those who do put in the time are precious resources and I thank them. I've been watching Erik's glider refurbishment projects from a distance - that's a big commitment. I know how much energy Hank (and many others that I don't know so well) puts into keeping a flock of younger pilots engaged, excited and making progress. I think that's a lot of what needs to be developed and emulated.

As Hank would say - FWIW.

Andy Blackburn
9B

I am so amused. Please keep going. #popcorn

Been in clubs that had crap equipment and actively discouraged getting better. Same clubs had leadership that did all they could to discourage cross country soaring. Been in clubs that had great equipment and encouraged racing and cross country. Guess which of those two types are the more successful? Unfortunately, club sports of all kinds tend to get taken over by bureaucratic types who love nothing better than to rule. They love to forbid, restrict, deny. Usually in the name of "safety". Oh, and they love love love to trot out the "Oh, we can't do that, it exposes us to LIABILITY!. These people throw roadblocks in the way of anything that is not their idea. God forbid someone suggest we allow a junior to take the club glass single place (obtained by tramping over the dead bodies of those who said we'd buy a club glass ship "over their dead bodies"). We have a particularly talented junior in our club. Superb stick, smart, and absolutely dying to fly cross country. Club leadership pitches the expected hissy and throws obstacles in the kid's way. So, the kid just decides he'll abide and fly as best he can. Of course, one day I ranged out to one our regular turnpoints about 35 miles away. Guess who was there already? Of course, the kid, and he's comfortably centered in a great thermal going up. We flew together for a while until I got embarrassed about being outclimbed. He knew where he was, knew what he needed to get to a landing field, and what he needed to get home. The point is, there was no reason to discourage this young man's progress in soaring other than pure bloody mindedness and the bureaucratic urge to say no (and, I think no small part of jealousy). So, even in clubs that bill themselves as encouraging cross country and racing, the faithful have to constantly fight to actually provide that encouragement and opportunities to the membership. It's fatiguing and stressful to have to fight with people you love and otherwise respect, but sometimes that's what we have to do.

Soaring in general doesn't appeal to many people. And, sorry, it never will.. It's expensive, takes a lot of time, is relatively difficult to learn (you can't teach yourself by bashing down the ski slope or across the waves falling all over the place and then getting back up to try again), more frustrating than most sports (one minor mistake can put you on the ground, not for a few minutes but for the rest of the day), and retrieves are a real pain. Yeah, we can probably increase the number of people coming into the funnel but the yield will always be very low.

A tiny fraction of those who do "stick" will gravitate to competition. To them, it's the best part of soaring, for a variety of reasons: wanting to win, the challenge of competing against the best, the adventure, the social aspects, etc. Just point them in the right direction and help as needed, then get out of the way.

Then there are those in between, pilots who made it to the solo stage but aren't convinced they can or wish to fly cross country, much less to compete.. Some may be intrigued but think they can't. Some try it and decide it's not for them. Some wish to but aren't willing to put soaring at the top of their priority list. Everyone is different. There are a lot of other demands on our time these days and plenty of alternatives for it. But this is the group that I think the Hank Nixons and Erik Manns of the world do such a great job with, that and helping train the incoming pilots who might end up in this group. You can't make someone fall in love with soaring any more than you can make them fall in love with another person. What you can do is help make it possible for them to pursue that love.

I got into competition almost 50 years ago because my father--my instructor and also a contest pilot--not only made it possible, he was my coach and support system. Later, thanks to some early gratification in the sport and a career that took off and made it possible financially, competition went to the top of my list of priorities and stayed there for many years. These days, it's still very important but I find it's easier to get sidetracked and/or discouraged by all the "stuff" facing us in life. As it happens, both Erik and Hank have played key roles in getting me back into soaring on three occasions after enforced layoffs. If not for the two of them, I probably wouldn't be flying today, looking forward to another competition season. Thanks, both of you; I haven't said that often enough but I owe you a lot.

I'm not sure why they do it. And I have no idea of the number of people these two guys are personally responsible for introducing to competition and/or keeping them going in it. I know there are others like them at other clubs and locations but we can use more.

I like Erik's message: "Think global. Act local." We can expose soaring to more people and increase the number who decide to take lessons. But helping that small number (and it will always be a small number) who are receptive to competition and just need help is probably the most fruitful endeavor. And that's a very hands-on process.

Access to better gliders certainly helps, especially those who are in school or just starting out. And, again, these two guys have done a huge amount to make it possible. But it's no guarantee. I know of many juniors who get excited about soaring for a while and then walk away when university life, jobs, the opposite sex, cars, or whatever become more intriguing or just easier to enjoy.

How many high-performance club gliders sit on the ground much of the time for want of seriously interested pilots? Is that anyone's "fault"...or is just the nature of soaring?

Chip Bearden