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#11
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Winglets for SZD55
As an owner of a SZD 55 I am interested in the comments of Peter Masak about winglets on the 55, but couldnt find the above mentioned results when typing Peter Masak SZD55 into google - does anyone here have a link?
Anyway, I'd also like to see pictures of a 55 with winglets, just out of pure curiousity - simply cant imagine how winglets work and look like with the very special shape of the 55 wings. BTW - wasnt the 55 wing especially designed to work without winglets, turbulator tape etc.? Regards, Michail |
#13
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Winglets for SZD55
At 13:08 11 February 2016, wrote:
As an owner of a SZD 55 I am interested in the comments of Peter Masak about winglets on the 55, but couldnt find the above mentioned results when typing Peter Masak SZD55 into google - does anyone here have a link? Anyway, I'd also like to see pictures of a 55 with winglets, just out of pure curiousity - simply cant imagine how winglets work and look like with the very special shape of the 55 wings. BTW - wasnt the 55 wing especially designed to work without winglets, turbulator tape etc.? Regards, Michail http://wingsandwheels.com/class/uplo...0140614_122250. jpg |
#14
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Winglets for SZD55
On 2/11/2016 8:08 AM, wrote:
As an owner of a SZD 55 I am interested in the comments of Peter Masak about winglets on the 55, but couldnt find the above mentioned results when typing Peter Masak SZD55 into google - does anyone here have a link? Anyway, I'd also like to see pictures of a 55 with winglets, just out of pure curiousity - simply cant imagine how winglets work and look like with the very special shape of the 55 wings. BTW - wasnt the 55 wing especially designed to work without winglets, turbulator tape etc.? Regards, Michail Here is the Canadian 55 with winglets http://home.silentflight.ca/gallery/...c32020ba2c4bcd Legend has it that these were factory prototype winglets from before SZD went bankrupt in the 90's Luke |
#15
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Winglets for SZD55
On Monday, October 13, 2003 at 1:29:23 PM UTC-8, Tom and Jane Gilbert wrote:
Any 55 owners fitted winglets to their ships? Thoughts... comments?? Tom Gilbert I have SN 39, modified with Nelson winglets which look a lot like ASW 27 winglets, and I suspect are more effective than the LS-8 bent up tips. Compared to my recollections of another '55 that I owned (SN 29) low speed roll control is improved-- which helps with partial ballast take offs. On the subject of how much water to put in, Jerzy Szemplinski once told me about the '55: "Bill, you fill it. You always fill it!" |
#16
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Winglets for SZD55
Hi Bill. At that time (12 years ago!!) I was looking for ways to tame the
take off habits of my '55. Because of my weight (max cockpit) I had to fly with partial ballast only. Filling it would greatly exceed max all up weight. Because of the long skinny tanks the partial water load would move when the wing dropped on take off... something it almost always did unless I had a very athletic wing runner. So every take off was an adventure and very entertaining to the onlookers. Having said that I never actually lost it on take off. But wing down, everything in the opposite corner for an extended period was not comfortable. I sold my '55 a few years back. I loved it in the air and it was a rocket at max weight. It held the Australian 300k out and return for a while at 147kph. I sold it because I considered it to be not the best glider to grow old in. The new owner (much younger than me) loves it. I now fly a DG-400... much more in keeping with my aging abilities!! Best regards, Tom Gilbert wrote in message ... On Monday, October 13, 2003 at 1:29:23 PM UTC-8, Tom and Jane Gilbert wrote: Any 55 owners fitted winglets to their ships? Thoughts... comments?? Tom Gilbert I have SN 39, modified with Nelson winglets which look a lot like ASW 27 winglets, and I suspect are more effective than the LS-8 bent up tips. Compared to my recollections of another '55 that I owned (SN 29) low speed roll control is improved-- which helps with partial ballast take offs. On the subject of how much water to put in, Jerzy Szemplinski once told me about the '55: "Bill, you fill it. You always fill it!" |
#17
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Winglets for SZD55
Hi Tom and Bill
I am also flying 55, and I have some 600 hours in it. I am like Tom, at max cockpit weight. I seldom fly with water and if so only partially full. With or without water I tend not to drop wings though. I take off with partial airbrake, full forward trim and stick on the front stop. I do not finesse the ailerons, they go from stop to stop. On the occasion that I have dropped the wing, as Tom said, everything in the opposite corner brings it up. It has never happened to me with water, so I cannot comment. Interestingly I am keeping mine to get old, I can still lift the wing at the root with one hand, and I cannot do that with any other glider wing that I am familiar with. I find the comments about flying with max all up weight intriguing, as I think that I thermal quite poorly(read fast) with water on board (all up 440 kg). Not sure if it is me or the glider. I would appreciate any comments on the above. Thanks Paul On Monday, 15 February 2016 06:47:54 UTC+10, Tom & Jane Gilbert wrote: Hi Bill. At that time (12 years ago!!) I was looking for ways to tame the take off habits of my '55. Because of my weight (max cockpit) I had to fly with partial ballast only. Filling it would greatly exceed max all up weight. Because of the long skinny tanks the partial water load would move when the wing dropped on take off... something it almost always did unless I had a very athletic wing runner. So every take off was an adventure and very entertaining to the onlookers. Having said that I never actually lost it on take off. But wing down, everything in the opposite corner for an extended period was not comfortable. I sold my '55 a few years back. I loved it in the air and it was a rocket at max weight. It held the Australian 300k out and return for a while at 147kph. I sold it because I considered it to be not the best glider to grow old in. The new owner (much younger than me) loves it. I now fly a DG-400... much more in keeping with my aging abilities!! Best regards, Tom Gilbert wrote in message ... On Monday, October 13, 2003 at 1:29:23 PM UTC-8, Tom and Jane Gilbert wrote: Any 55 owners fitted winglets to their ships? Thoughts... comments?? Tom Gilbert I have SN 39, modified with Nelson winglets which look a lot like ASW 27 winglets, and I suspect are more effective than the LS-8 bent up tips. Compared to my recollections of another '55 that I owned (SN 29) low speed roll control is improved-- which helps with partial ballast take offs. On the subject of how much water to put in, Jerzy Szemplinski once told me about the '55: "Bill, you fill it. You always fill it!" |
#18
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Winglets for SZD55
Your take off technique sounds pretty standard Paul. At max weight (135
liters of water in my case) a wing drop can be an issue. The '55 sits tail down with a large angle of attack. The ailerons are not very effective until you get the tail up and reduce that angle. If you have a cross wind or quartering tail wind (the worst!!) you need to keep the tail wheel on the ground for the early ground roll. So it's a fine balance. I have never been able to fly it with full tanks so I can't comment on it's behaviour in this case. I take your point about the wing weight. A friend of mine bought a '55 for that reason so he and his wife (small lady) could rig and de-rig without assistance. I had a 201b Libelle for many years and describe the '55 as a Libelle on steroids! All gliders need to be flown faster in thermals when carrying water ballast. From memory the '55 liked another 5 to 8 knots or so. But it handled the weight well and never caused me a problem in that regard. Tom "Paul B" wrote in message ... Hi Tom and Bill I am also flying 55, and I have some 600 hours in it. I am like Tom, at max cockpit weight. I seldom fly with water and if so only partially full. With or without water I tend not to drop wings though. I take off with partial airbrake, full forward trim and stick on the front stop. I do not finesse the ailerons, they go from stop to stop. On the occasion that I have dropped the wing, as Tom said, everything in the opposite corner brings it up. It has never happened to me with water, so I cannot comment. Interestingly I am keeping mine to get old, I can still lift the wing at the root with one hand, and I cannot do that with any other glider wing that I am familiar with. I find the comments about flying with max all up weight intriguing, as I think that I thermal quite poorly(read fast) with water on board (all up 440 kg). Not sure if it is me or the glider. I would appreciate any comments on the above. Thanks Paul On Monday, 15 February 2016 06:47:54 UTC+10, Tom & Jane Gilbert wrote: Hi Bill. At that time (12 years ago!!) I was looking for ways to tame the take off habits of my '55. Because of my weight (max cockpit) I had to fly with partial ballast only. Filling it would greatly exceed max all up weight. Because of the long skinny tanks the partial water load would move when the wing dropped on take off... something it almost always did unless I had a very athletic wing runner. So every take off was an adventure and very entertaining to the onlookers. Having said that I never actually lost it on take off. But wing down, everything in the opposite corner for an extended period was not comfortable. I sold my '55 a few years back. I loved it in the air and it was a rocket at max weight. It held the Australian 300k out and return for a while at 147kph. I sold it because I considered it to be not the best glider to grow old in. The new owner (much younger than me) loves it. I now fly a DG-400... much more in keeping with my aging abilities!! Best regards, Tom Gilbert wrote in message ... On Monday, October 13, 2003 at 1:29:23 PM UTC-8, Tom and Jane Gilbert wrote: Any 55 owners fitted winglets to their ships? Thoughts... comments?? Tom Gilbert I have SN 39, modified with Nelson winglets which look a lot like ASW 27 winglets, and I suspect are more effective than the LS-8 bent up tips. Compared to my recollections of another '55 that I owned (SN 29) low speed roll control is improved-- which helps with partial ballast take offs. On the subject of how much water to put in, Jerzy Szemplinski once told me about the '55: "Bill, you fill it. You always fill it!" |
#19
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Winglets for SZD55
Thanks Tom
Where did you put your CofG, mine is at 75%. Also what thermalling speed you used when empty(if ever ). Cheers Paul |
#20
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Winglets for SZD55
Probably about the same but I don't remember actually calculating that. I
installed a brass tail wheel (great mod) and always put an extra litre in the tail tank when ballasted. Empty thermalling 48 to 50 knots... down to 45 in very smooth thermals. Tom "Paul B" wrote in message ... Thanks Tom Where did you put your CofG, mine is at 75%. Also what thermalling speed you used when empty(if ever ). Cheers Paul |
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