MoGas Long Term Test: 5000 gallons and counting...

BTIZ wrote:

Actually I think it was available up into the mid to late 70s...

80/88, and it was colored Red...


Red gas was available in some places until fairly recently
(historically speaking). My airport was selling it right up until
2002.

Oddly enough, I saw some red gas the other day. My tiedown
neighbor owns a 150 that never flies. Every few years, he spends
several thousand on an annual and maintenance, then ends up not flying.
The cycle repeats every other year.

Just the other day he had a team of A&Ps and IA surrounding the plane
on the ramp, getting it ready to fly again. He's finally selling it.
When he sampled the fuel and it came out red colored, everyone on the
ramp just busted out laughing. We figured he had the last surviving
example of 80/87 aviation gas in the country. Too bad such rarity
doesn't make his ramp queen worth any more :-(

John Galban=====N4BQ (PA28-180)


John Galban=====N4BQ (PA28-180)

Dave Stadt wrote:


The only down side to mogas I have noticed is the smell.



I had a friend who liked to sniff gasoline, once.

God rest his soul.

--
This is by far the hardest lesson about freedom. It goes against
instinct, and morality, to just sit back and watch people make
mistakes. We want to help them, which means control them and their
decisions, but in doing so we actually hurt them (and ourselves)."

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message news:_eAfe.67985$WI3.223@attbi_s71...

The Grape itself cost $1800, and the tank/pump installation (and a couple of other things) make up the other $700 or
so.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"


Any more details about The Grape?

I got my last tankful of 80/87 at RBL about November of last year,
awhile after the last refiner stopped producing it. It had become a
rarity over the last ten years or so - you had to know where to go to
get it.

David Johnson

"Corky Scott" wrote in message
...
On 9 May 2005 10:21:51 -0700, "Jay Honeck" wrote:

I *can* lean a lot more, push my EGTs over 1500 degrees, push my CHTs
to 350+ degrees, save some gas -- and risk my new engine.

Now, of course, there are many theories on leaning (I've read 'em all),
but with my normally aspirated engine having such (relatively)
unbalanced fuel flow to each cylinder, I don't feel comfortable
aggressively leaning.

John Deakin has written that if you lean to the lean side of peak and
the engine runs rough, pulling on full carb heat will distribute the
fuel into the air mixture better and give you the ability to lean to
the lean side of peak.

Actually, he says "just a touch" of carb heat.


You might just try it, if only for a little bit if you are too
uncomfortable with the process.

wrote in message
oups.com...

Corky Scott wrote:

John Deakin has written that if you lean to the lean side of peak and
the engine runs rough, pulling on full carb heat will distribute the
fuel into the air mixture better and give you the ability to lean to
the lean side of peak.

You might just try it, if only for a little bit if you are too
uncomfortable with the process.


Doesn't always work. I tried it on the O-360 in my Cherokee and the
carb heat made no difference. It still stumbled right after peaking.
Induction systems are different from plane to plane and even from year
to year on the same model. The carb heat trick does work on certain
planes that I fly, so I think it's worth a try. Just don't get your
hopes up.

Deakin was talking about the engine in the Skylane with the whatsitsname
carburator.

http://www.avweb.com/news/columns/182084-1.html

"Here's another tip for carbureted engines, if you're operating high enough
to use full throttle, or nearly so. From the full-throttle position, pull
the throttle back until you observe the slightest drop in MP - perhaps a
quarter-inch or less. Leave it there. That will cock the throttle plate a
little, just enough to set up a vortex that will cause better atomization
and mixing of the fuel and air. (This is counterproductive in fuel injected
engines.)"

In a previous post, I'd said he recommended adding a "touch of carb heat" --
sorry.

The Grape itself cost $1800, and the tank/pump installation (and a couple
of other things) make up the other $700 or so.

Any more details about The Grape?

See: http://alexisparkinn.com/fuel_truck.htm

If you have any other questions, please feel free to ask.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

("Blueskies" wrote)
Any more details about The Grape?


Jay might finally be willing to allow a "Purple Pride" bumper sticker on The
Mighty Grape ...now that Randy Moss has been sent to Oakland. g

Probably not though.


Montblack
45 years of Purple

On Mon, 9 May 2005 18:44:11 -0700, "Matt Barrow"
wrote:

John Deakin has written that if you lean to the lean side of peak and
the engine runs rough, pulling on full carb heat will distribute the
fuel into the air mixture better and give you the ability to lean to
the lean side of peak.

Actually, he says "just a touch" of carb heat.

That was his initial suggestion. In his next column he posted this as
a news flash. I've posted nearly the entire portion of the column
because he has some caveats that are important to understand:

***Begin Quote***
We've always suggested trying just a touch of carb heat to improve
mixture distribution, but that was always an afterthought, secondary
to the tiny MP reduction with throttle, and we had no data.

Walter has been playing with AMPLE carburetor heat, even full
carburetor heat! On his airplane, and on a couple flat engines he's
tried, it works like a charm! It brings the EGTs and CHT into close
alignment (which isn't all that important), but more important, it
evens up the mixtures to each combustion chamber, allowing smooth and
LOP operations for the first time in some of these engines!

You heard it here first, thanks entirely to Walter. We need more data
on this to be sure it's a universal solution, or if it's peculiar to
certain engines.

There are a couple of very minor "problems" with using carb heat. One
is that on most engines, it bypasses the intake air filter and takes
combustion air from inside the warm engine compartment, or from a muff
around the exhaust tubes. Any sand, dust, or debris in the air can get
sucked into the engine, and that's not really too beneficial. On the
other hand, a lot of engines run without air filters entirely
(Walter's Twin Beech being one), apparently without much harm. Doing
this may cause a small elevation in silicone in your oil analysis, but
it's not clear how harmful this might be. Simple answer to this is
just don't use carb heat on the ground, except for testing. Or when
flying in a dust storm.

Inflight with carb heat on, some ram air effect may be lost, costing
you an inch or so of MP on some installations. But when LOP, air isn't
the determinant of power, fuel is.

Finally, using carb heat at *sea level takeoff power on a hot day* may
raise the induction air temperature so much that it will infringe on
the detonation margin if the engine is already "critical." But
full-power operation is not the real problem here, because we
recommend full power and ROP for all takeoffs. At lesser power
settings, or on cold days, even full carburetor heat is not an issue
for detonation, on most of these flat engines.

If any of you have carbureted engines with the JPI instrumentation,
and can download the data, please experiment with this, and send me
the data file. This might best be done by someone who is already a
"user" of our LOP methods, as there will be less "mystery" during the
testing. Just go up to somewhere above 5,000', and try WOT, LOP, and
play with different carb heat settings, including full heat. This is
really looking good, but we need data!

Walter thinks the warmer air is dramatically improving vaporization
and distribution, but we don't know a lot on this, yet.

You WILL run into great "resistance" at your local airport on this!
Just ask, "Do you have the data for that?" We will have, shortly.
Meanwhile, think of the IO-550B on my airplane, where we hung a turbo
on it, and we're using the same full manifold pressure as always, but
now heated dramatically by the turbo. It doesn't seem to hurt. What's
the difference between hot induction air and hot induction air?
Nothing.

This "News Flash" is the ONLY part of this column aimed at carbureted
engines! The main part of the column is about fuel-injected engines.
Sorry for the confusion, but I wanted to get this information out as
soon as possible.


February 2, 2003
Pelican's Perch #65
Where Should I Run My Engine?
(Part 3 -- Cruise)

***End Quote***

Corky Scott

Jay might finally be willing to allow a "Purple Pride" bumper sticker on
The Mighty Grape ...now that Randy Moss has been sent to Oakland. g

With Moss' departure, the Vikings have taken one small step back toward
legitimacy. They've still got a long ways to go, however.

When they start playing outside again, I'll know they've returned from the
Dark Side.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"