Tu-160 just crashed near Saratov

A Russian Tupolev-160 strategic bomber crashed in the Saratov Region
on Thursday, the press service of the Russian Air Force has reported.
"The fate of the four crewmembers is unknown. A search and rescue
operation is underway at the scene. Information about casualties and
damage at the crash site needs to be clarified," an Air Force
spokesman said.

The aircarft was conducting a test flight after one of its engines was
replaced. According to preliminary reports it was carrying no weapons.

The Tu-160 bomber (Blackjack, according to NATO classifications) is
capable of carrying nuclear bombs and missiles. Its maximum flight
weight amounts to 275 tons. //Interfax

foor polites died. they reported fire in the replaced engine.

Michael

"Michael Petukhov" wrote in message
m...
A Russian Tupolev-160 strategic bomber crashed in the Saratov Region
on Thursday, the press service of the Russian Air Force has reported.
"The fate of the four crewmembers is unknown. A search and rescue
operation is underway at the scene. Information about casualties and
damage at the crash site needs to be clarified," an Air Force
spokesman said.

The aircarft was conducting a test flight after one of its engines was
replaced. According to preliminary reports it was carrying no weapons.

The Tu-160 bomber (Blackjack, according to NATO classifications) is
capable of carrying nuclear bombs and missiles. Its maximum flight
weight amounts to 275 tons. //Interfax

foor polites died. they reported fire in the replaced engine.

Michael

In the US we ground test engines after they are replaced. We find it's much
easier to shut down than from 30,000 feet.

"Christians for Cheeseburgers." wrote:


foor polites died. they reported fire in the replaced engine.

Michael

In the US we ground test engines after they are replaced. We find it's much
easier to shut down than from 30,000 feet.


Why would you think that they didn't ground run them before the
flight test?...gee....
--

-Gord.

"Christians for Cheeseburgers." wrote in
message . net
"Michael Petukhov" wrote in message
m...
A Russian Tupolev-160 strategic bomber crashed in the Saratov Region
on Thursday, the press service of the Russian Air Force has
reported. "The fate of the four crewmembers is unknown. A search
and rescue operation is underway at the scene. Information about
casualties and damage at the crash site needs to be clarified," an
Air Force
spokesman said.

The aircarft was conducting a test flight after one of its engines
was replaced. According to preliminary reports it was carrying no
weapons.

The Tu-160 bomber (Blackjack, according to NATO classifications) is
capable of carrying nuclear bombs and missiles. Its maximum flight
weight amounts to 275 tons. //Interfax

foor polites died. they reported fire in the replaced engine.

Michael

In the US we ground test engines after they are replaced. We find
it's much easier to shut down than from 30,000 feet.

A remarkably tasteless comment.

And that assumes the crash was even related to the engine change. No
guarantee that it was. And even if it was, there's no reason to believe
that they didn't ground test it first. Even in the US, we'd do a
maintenance check flight after major maintenance. Ground test first, but
flying the plane will find things that no ground test ever will.

--�
Tom Schoene Replace "invalid" with "net" to e-mail
"If brave men and women never died, there would be nothing
special about bravery." -- Andy Rooney (attributed)

"Thomas Schoene" wrote in message
ink.net...
"Christians for Cheeseburgers." wrote in

In the US we ground test engines after they are replaced. We find
it's much easier to shut down than from 30,000 feet.

A remarkably tasteless comment.

And that assumes the crash was even related to the engine change. No
guarantee that it was. And even if it was, there's no reason to believe
that they didn't ground test it first. Even in the US, we'd do a
maintenance check flight after major maintenance. Ground test first, but
flying the plane will find things that no ground test ever will.


Indeed. The RAF lost a Nimrod MR, in what sounds like a very similar
situation some six or seven years ago (engine fire on a test flight).
Thankfully on this occasion there were no lives lost or serious injury.

The Tu-160 is perfectly capable of taking off with one engine, it has
much more excess thrust than the B-1. In fact, there's a true story of a
U.S. official (can't remember who, but some big-whig) coming to watch a
Tu-160 take off (shortly after Iron Curtain fell). The crew couldn't start
one of their engines, so they just took off without it on and still gave an
impressive performance. So it must have been something more than just a
simple engine failure (e.g., control failure, catastrophic engine failure,
etc.).

Tony

"Thomas Schoene" wrote in message
ink.net...
"Christians for Cheeseburgers." wrote in
message . net
"Michael Petukhov" wrote in message
m...
A Russian Tupolev-160 strategic bomber crashed in the Saratov Region
on Thursday, the press service of the Russian Air Force has
reported. "The fate of the four crewmembers is unknown. A search
and rescue operation is underway at the scene. Information about
casualties and damage at the crash site needs to be clarified," an
Air Force
spokesman said.

The aircarft was conducting a test flight after one of its engines
was replaced. According to preliminary reports it was carrying no
weapons.

The Tu-160 bomber (Blackjack, according to NATO classifications) is
capable of carrying nuclear bombs and missiles. Its maximum flight
weight amounts to 275 tons. //Interfax

foor polites died. they reported fire in the replaced engine.

Michael

In the US we ground test engines after they are replaced. We find
it's much easier to shut down than from 30,000 feet.

A remarkably tasteless comment.

And that assumes the crash was even related to the engine change. No
guarantee that it was. And even if it was, there's no reason to believe
that they didn't ground test it first. Even in the US, we'd do a
maintenance check flight after major maintenance. Ground test first, but
flying the plane will find things that no ground test ever will.

--�
Tom Schoene Replace "invalid" with "net" to e-mail
"If brave men and women never died, there would be nothing
special about bravery." -- Andy Rooney (attributed)

"Tony Volk" wrote in message
...
The Tu-160 is perfectly capable of taking off with one engine, it has
much more excess thrust than the B-1. In fact, there's a true story of a
U.S. official (can't remember who, but some big-whig) coming to watch a
Tu-160 take off (shortly after Iron Curtain fell). The crew couldn't
start
one of their engines, so they just took off without it on and still gave
an
impressive performance. So it must have been something more than just a
simple engine failure (e.g., control failure, catastrophic engine failure,
etc.).

So you really think that a plane that weighs 275000kg at full load can take
off perfectly well with one engine that produces 25000kg of thrust? So why
build it with four engines?

You might want to re-think your position, since its obviously flawed.

You would have to be remarkably unknowledgeable about aviation to
think neither the ground crew nor the flight crew didn't do a thorough
ground runup prior to takeoff. Unfortunately a ground check is no
insurance against problems in the air. I lost two good friends in an
F104B when an eighth stage compressor blade failed at about 20000
during climb out while bringing the aircraft back from major overhaul
at McClellan AFB (MAAMA). They were over Sacramento above an overcast
and decided to try to land rather than eject over the city. The cloud
bottoms were about 8000 AGL. The aircraft, still heavy with fuel,
impacted in the approach end overrun making a hole about three feet
deep. Two posthumous DFCs. There are no guarantees in aviation. Now
four Russian familes have lost their men.
Walt BJ

Ragnar wrote:

"Tony Volk" wrote in message
...
The Tu-160 is perfectly capable of taking off with one engine, it has
much more excess thrust than the B-1. In fact, there's a true story of a
U.S. official (can't remember who, but some big-whig) coming to watch a
Tu-160 take off (shortly after Iron Curtain fell). The crew couldn't
start
one of their engines, so they just took off without it on and still gave
an
impressive performance. So it must have been something more than just a
simple engine failure (e.g., control failure, catastrophic engine failure,
etc.).

So you really think that a plane that weighs 275000kg at full load can take
off perfectly well with one engine that produces 25000kg of thrust? So why
build it with four engines?

You might want to re-think your position, since its obviously flawed.

Condensed from 'Tupolev Tu-160 Blackjack - Russia's Answer to the B-1' by Yefim
Gordon. Volume 9 in the 'Red Star' series...........................

On 12 August 1988 Frank C. Carlucci, then US Secretary of State, visited
Kubinka, near Moscow.

A flying display was staged - including 2 Tu-160's.

When it came for takeoff, a single engine on each of the bombers would not
start.

To save embarassment, the VVS top command authorised a go-ahead for the flights
- so the two bombers took off on THREE engines.

The flights went well - thanks to some excellent airmanship - the fact that only
3 of the four engines were emitting smoke did not escape the US delegation - so
they asked why.

The Russian Long-Range Aviation Commander, Col. Gen. Pyotr S Deynekin answered -
with a straight face - that the Tu-160's engines had several operating modes,
not all of which were characterised by a smoke trail.

Later, when being shown around the flight deck, Carlucci banged his head on a
circuit-breaker panel.

That panel is still know to Long-Range Aviation crews as 'Carluccis' Panel'.

So, while not normal, a Tu-160 certainly can takeoff on only 3 engines -
although obviously, not at max weight.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++
Ken Duffey - Flanker Freak & Russian Aviation Enthusiast
Flankers Website - http://www.flankers.co.uk/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ ++++++++++++++++

"Tony Volk" wrote in message ...
The Tu-160 is perfectly capable of taking off with one engine, it has
much more excess thrust than the B-1. In fact, there's a true story of a
U.S. official (can't remember who, but some big-whig) coming to watch a
Tu-160 take off (shortly after Iron Curtain fell). The crew couldn't start
one of their engines, so they just took off without it on and still gave an
impressive performance. So it must have been something more than just a
simple engine failure (e.g., control failure, catastrophic engine failure,
etc.).

Tony

Exactly there was right wing fuel tank explosion in two minites
after fire started in a right engine #2. Right wing was found
in 3 km from the main part of Tu-160 airframe.

Michael


"Thomas Schoene" wrote in message
ink.net...
"Christians for Cheeseburgers." wrote in
message . net
"Michael Petukhov" wrote in message
m...
A Russian Tupolev-160 strategic bomber crashed in the Saratov Region
on Thursday, the press service of the Russian Air Force has
reported. "The fate of the four crewmembers is unknown. A search
and rescue operation is underway at the scene. Information about
casualties and damage at the crash site needs to be clarified," an
Air Force
spokesman said.

The aircarft was conducting a test flight after one of its engines
was replaced. According to preliminary reports it was carrying no
weapons.

The Tu-160 bomber (Blackjack, according to NATO classifications) is
capable of carrying nuclear bombs and missiles. Its maximum flight
weight amounts to 275 tons. //Interfax

foor polites died. they reported fire in the replaced engine.

Michael

In the US we ground test engines after they are replaced. We find
it's much easier to shut down than from 30,000 feet.

A remarkably tasteless comment.

And that assumes the crash was even related to the engine change. No
guarantee that it was. And even if it was, there's no reason to believe
that they didn't ground test it first. Even in the US, we'd do a
maintenance check flight after major maintenance. Ground test first, but
flying the plane will find things that no ground test ever will.

--�
Tom Schoene Replace "invalid" with "net" to e-mail
"If brave men and women never died, there would be nothing
special about bravery." -- Andy Rooney (attributed)