Class B bust my fault or the controllers ?

Roy Smith wrote:

In article , wrote:


Brad Zeigler wrote:

"Everett M. Greene" wrote in message
...
"Guillermo" writes:
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote
wrote

Reduced Vertical Separation Minimum. It went into effect
in the U.S., Mexico and Canada this past January 20th,
where the former 2,000 feet of vertical separation above
flight level 290 was reduced to 1,000 feet, and you have
to have additional approval to operate up there.

Not above FL290, between FL290 and FL410.

ok, so then I'll take the C172RG to FL420 and I'll be OK
with no RVSM

But then you have to keep your eyes open for low-flying SR-71s!
I believe they're a tad faster than your 172.

Strange limits. You can be cleared to FL410 and above but
how do you get there without the RVSM and DME?

By climbing through all the altitudes below your clearance altitude.

But, if you are not RVSM compliant, you can't even climb or descend
through the RVSM altitudes unless ATC gives you a dispensation.


Get NASA to give you a lift on one of their shuttle-carrier 747's then
drop you once you're up there. At least that takes care of the
climbing part; I guess you still need to figure out the descending
part.

If you can work that out, you can probably afford to upgrade to RVSM. But,
if you would rather not on principle, then you simply remain at, or above,
FL 430, and when the gas gets low, you declare an emergency and descend.

Jose wrote:

But, if you are not RVSM compliant, you can't even climb or descend
through the RVSM altitudes unless ATC gives you a dispensation.

... or you go out over the Pacific ocean. Or is this global?

No, and probably never will be. But, RVSM went into effect over the
North Atlantic oceanic airspace before it migtrated to the U.S.

So far as I know, it hasn't migrated to the busier Pacific Ocean
airspace, but I am sure it will. The routes between LAX, SFO, PDX, and
SEA, could can some relief with RVSM.

Not exactly accurate. RVSM airspace is used in the North Atlantic Airspace
which is designated on appropriate charts. You can go outside the coastal
ADIZ, be in international airspace, but not RVSM airspace. The Pacific does
have RVSM in some areas (desiganted on the charts), but they are much more
tolerant of waiver requests. There is no chance for a waiver in the
Atlantic, except in an emergency, and even then it is likely to be denied
because of the "congestion."

In Europe, we have had our aircraft which were not RVSM equiped and above
FL430 and were were required to descend to below the RVSM airspace. After
official complaints, the offending country's ATC apologized for the required
descent.


wrote in message ...


Jose wrote:

But, if you are not RVSM compliant, you can't even climb or descend
through the RVSM altitudes unless ATC gives you a dispensation.

... or you go out over the Pacific ocean. Or is this global?

No, and probably never will be. But, RVSM went into effect over the
North Atlantic oceanic airspace before it migtrated to the U.S.

So far as I know, it hasn't migrated to the busier Pacific Ocean
airspace, but I am sure it will. The routes between LAX, SFO, PDX, and
SEA, could can some relief with RVSM.

"Everett M. Greene" wrote in message
...

But then you have to keep your eyes open for low-flying SR-71s!
I believe they're a tad faster than your 172.


There are no SR-71s flying at any altitude.



Strange limits. You can be cleared to FL410 and above but
how do you get there without the RVSM and DME?


The requirement for DME kicks in at FL240, RVSM apply to FL290 thru FL410.