Ack!! video A320 xwind in Germany

"Vaughn Simon" wrote in
:


"Bertie the Bunyip" wrote in message
...
Doesn't really work all that well with anything, but it's a neccesary
evil in some airplanes. High performance fighter jets have to do it
and some airliners, especially four engined ones,

And most gliders. The issue is ground clearance with those long
wings. I
was originally a glider pilot and I still have to think ahead and hold
my mouth just right before I can slip a power plane all the way down
to touchdown.


Yep, but the side load matters little in the glider case since you just
slide on the grass anyways/

I learned to fly in them too.




Bertie

Orval Fairbairn wrote in
news
In article ,
Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

Marty Shapiro wrote in
:

D Ramapriya wrote in
news:706e02c1-4a48-4b69-91e9-
:

On Mar 4, 1:04 am, Jim Logajan wrote:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...538926,00.html

Scroll to the bottom for an editor's note: "An earlier version of
this story contained information from German wire service DPA
that listed the strength of storm winds near the airport at 250
kilometers-per-hour (155 miles per hour)."


Jim, it was the plane that was traveling @ 155 mph

Ramapriya


On the local CBS news tonight (Channel 5, San Francisco) they
stated the winds were 150 miles per hour.

They weren't. If they had been, the A320 would have climbed away
vetically. I was inthe area at the time, BTW, and it was blowing
about 50 in the gusts.


Bertie

It still raises a couple of questions:

1. Why did ATC direct them to a runway with such an excessive
crosswind?

2. Why did the Captain accept such a clearance?


Probably it was within limits.. I just got of the phone with an A320
friend of mine. Demonstrated x-wind as published by Airbus is 35 knots.
He reckons Lufty might have that shortened to 33.
If it's within limits you take it if you are comfortable.
The wind may have veered and or strengthened while he was on approach.
That's tkind of th enature of high wind. We try and keep an ear out for
the current wind as we're making the aproach.Also, we have several wind
displays on board. There'd be a wind arrow on the nav screen with
direction and strength, and a digital display breaking it down into head
and crosswind components, so the crew can see whan the wind is where
they are at any given moment. In short, they knew what the wind was on
the runway and it would have been within limits when they shot the
approach.



Bertie

Marty Shapiro wrote in
:

Bertie the Bunyip wrote in
:

Marty Shapiro wrote in
:

D Ramapriya wrote in
news:706e02c1-4a48-4b69-91e9-
:

On Mar 4, 1:04 am, Jim Logajan wrote:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...538926,00.html

Scroll to the bottom for an editor's note: "An earlier version of
this story contained information from German wire service DPA that
listed the strength of storm winds near the airport at 250
kilometers-per-hour (155 miles per hour)."


Jim, it was the plane that was traveling @ 155 mph

Ramapriya


On the local CBS news tonight (Channel 5, San Francisco) they stated
the winds were 150 miles per hour.

They weren't. If they had been, the A320 would have climbed away
vetically. I was inthe area at the time, BTW, and it was blowing
about 50 in the gusts.


Bertie

Accuracy from a news report regarding aviation -- no way! Not only
did they say it was a 150 MPH crosswind, they also stated that both
wings hit the runway.

It looks like they did, actually. Looks like he got them both in turn if
you watch carefully. There's a stil shot out there of the left most
definitely on the ground and if you look at the video the right seems to
be touching as he aborts as well. Could be that the right is just
raising a little wake in the water, though.


Bertie

Doing a simple Google yielded some historical wind gusts for the
Hamburg area show about 46mph. I'm amazed that the mis information is
still being put out there. Yahoo still has it on their homepage.
There wasn't even a question that the guys chatting and video taping
at the field might have had just a bit of a tough time doing so in
150mph winds?

Would a jet make a second attempt in 155mph winds at the same field?
This is one of the best examples of media stupidity as it refers to
Aviation.

Doug

"Orval Fairbairn" wrote in message
news
In article ,
Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

Marty Shapiro wrote in
:

D Ramapriya wrote in
news:706e02c1-4a48-4b69-91e9-
:

On Mar 4, 1:04 am, Jim Logajan wrote:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...538926,00.html

Scroll to the bottom for an editor's note: "An earlier version of
this story contained information from German wire service DPA that
listed the strength of storm winds near the airport at 250
kilometers-per-hour (155 miles per hour)."


Jim, it was the plane that was traveling @ 155 mph

Ramapriya


On the local CBS news tonight (Channel 5, San Francisco) they stated
the winds were 150 miles per hour.

They weren't. If they had been, the A320 would have climbed away
vetically.
I was inthe area at the time, BTW, and it was blowing about 50 in the
gusts.


Bertie

It still raises a couple of questions:

1. Why did ATC direct them to a runway with such an excessive crosswind?

2. Why did the Captain accept such a clearance?

--
Remove _'s from email address to talk to me.

Winds were 290, choices were 23 or 33.

EDDH 011220Z 29028G48KT 9000 -SHRA FEW011 BKN014 07/05 Q0984 TEMPO
29035G55KT 4000 SHRA BKN008

Al G

On Tue, 4 Mar 2008 08:17:31 -0800, Al G wrote:

Winds were 290, choices were 23 or 33.

EDDH 011220Z 29028G48KT 9000 -SHRA FEW011 BKN014 07/05 Q0984 TEMPO
29035G55KT 4000 SHRA BKN008

Gust to 48 from my E6B:

Rwy 23 - x-wind: 41.6 h-wind: 24

Rwy 33 - x-wind: 30.9 h-wind: 36.8


--
Dallas

On Mon, 3 Mar 2008 20:57:26 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

Boeing recommend slipping from
about 200 feet down

So Bertie, will this pilot, "Oliver A.", generally be seen in the pilot
community as having screwed up?

Could he have prevented the wing strike by slamming the stick to the right
as he was kicking out of the crab?

I also guessing Lufthansa's corporate line will be to call him a hero
rather than admit that their pilots don't know how to land an airplane.


--
Dallas

On Tue, 4 Mar 2008 08:15:37 -0800 (PST), gliderguynj wrote:

Would a jet make a second attempt in 155mph winds at the same field?

Not to mention that it would be impossible to kick an airliner straight
with 155 mph gust slamming the vertical stabilizer.


--
Dallas

Dallas wrote in
:

On Mon, 3 Mar 2008 20:57:26 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip wrote:

Boeing recommend slipping from
about 200 feet down

So Bertie, will this pilot, "Oliver A.", generally be seen in the
pilot community as having screwed up?

I don't think so. Not if the numbers were reasonable on approach. Many of
the accident reports I've read afterwards gave me a sick "that could have
happened to anyone, incuding me" type of feeling, which is what makes them
worth reading , of course.

Could he have prevented the wing strike by slamming the stick to the
right as he was kicking out of the crab?

I don't know. The FBW 'Busses are supposed to be able to sort those thngs
out themselves.

I also guessing Lufthansa's corporate line will be to call him a hero
rather than admit that their pilots don't know how to land an
airplane.

Well, I don't know that he did do anything wrong. My only point in posting
the link was to point out that the kick it straight school of landing an
airplane is an inferior way of landing an airplane whether it's done by
computer or a pilot. The 757 I fly is roughly a similar size and
configuration and slipping it onto the runway gives a demonstrated 40 knot
x-wind. I've flown in quite nearly that component and it's actually
relatively easy. There's enough control authority to keep it straight even
in that wind.

Bertie

On Mar 4, 12:10*pm, Dallas wrote:
On Mon, 3 Mar 2008 20:57:26 +0000 (UTC), Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
*Boeing recommend slipping from
about 200 feet down

So Bertie, will this pilot, "Oliver A.", generally be seen in the pilot
community as having screwed up?

CNN is reporting that she is onlly 24 years old. Maybe she doesn't
have a lot of experience in cross wind landings??

-Robert