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#31
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
Doug wrote: Highly unlikely you will keep the plane for 40 years. Practically unheard of. One more reason why the mainland is different from Hawai'i... Two guys at the airport have had their Cessnas for the better part of 50 years now, one guy has a Cherokee Six he's had for 30, before that he had a Piper cub for 20. Lot's of Beech Volpars are still in service with the same people (or their grand-children) with which they were in service beggining in the 30s, while one cargo airline (Kamaka Air) flies DC-3s that it had fully restored, which I believe were old Trans-Pacific (Aloha Airlines) DC-3s. I would recommend buying a single, non-retract airplane that will carry the load you need to carry. Cessna 172 or 182 or a Piper Warrior or Pathfinder. Retractable gear is a maintenance headache. With your short hops, speed doesn't really matter. I would also recommend buying it with the avionics you want, although with 10K in shipping costs you may have a hard time finding exactly whay you want in Hawaii. Call me fickle, self-oriented, greedy, snobby, what have you, but I do not fly and will not own a fixed-gear plane. As for leaseback, a simple plane like a 172 or Warrior will rent MUCH more often and the required insurance premium and required 100 hour inspections will dictate that you rent it as much as possible if you want to have any hope at all of breaking even or better. Yes, but it will rent to people who wil bust it up too, I'm not looking for volume, I'm looking for people who are willing to spend a bit more than they normally would to get a premium product, which I can think of at least 4 already. If I were in your shoes I would either get a 172 or a 182, one of the later models (1999 or so), but not a new one. New airplanes depreciate a LOT the first year, so I'd let someone else take that hit. However an older model that has the avionics I want, if I can find it, would do even better financially, but would not have the newer planes reliability. If you prefer the Piper line, then choose one of those. No fixed gear, I would entertain a 182RG, but the 235 HP engine puts a big bump up in that insurance over the 200 hp one in the 177 and the Arrow, also I in particular dislike 172s for their stall characteristics, they seem to break quickly and fall rather than stall out. Good luck. |
#32
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
Both the Arrow and the Cardinal...........and for that matter the Sierra,
were produced for ONE reason only. 200HP, retractable gear for commercial students. They are TRAINERS for the GI Bill guys of the 60's and 70's. All these airplanes fly like trucks, have no control harmony to speak of, are not particularly nice looking and mostly worn out. The day the GI Bill ran out, which was in about 1978, true support for these airplanes ran out as well. If you like low performance and the feel of a truck...........any of the three will suit you. Karl "Curator" N185KG |
#33
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
"karl gruber" wrote: Both the Arrow and the Cardinal...........and for that matter the Sierra, were produced for ONE reason only. 200HP, retractable gear for commercial students. BS. True in the case of the Cutlass RG, perhaps; not true in the case of the Cardinal RG. And what's 200 hp got to do with it? -- Dan C172RG at BFM |
#34
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper ArrowIII (brand new)
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#35
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
On Sat, 16 Sep 2006 08:24:10 -0700, "karl gruber"
wrote: They are TRAINERS for the GI Bill guys of the 60's and 70's. All these airplanes fly like trucks, have no control harmony to speak of, are not particularly nice looking and mostly worn out. Where did you get this from??? I have been flying a Cardinal for years (and just purchased a Cardinal RG) and they fly wonderfully; far nicer than a 172 for instance. Looks are in the eye of the beholder, but I think Cardinals are beautiful. randall g =%^) PPASEL+Night 1974 Cardinal RG http://www.telemark.net/randallg Lots of aerial photographs of British Columbia at: http://www.telemark.net/randallg/photos.htm Vancouver's famous Kat Kam: http://www.katkam.ca |
#36
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
Call me fickle, self-oriented, greedy, snobby, what have you, but I do
not fly and will not own a fixed-gear plane. That's the goofiest thing I've read here in a long time. Atlas, our fixed-gear Piper Cherokee 235 Pathfinder, will absolutely walk away from an Arrow in a head-to-head speed race, (I've never raced a Cardinal RG, but I've over-taken older Mooneys and Bonanzas, too) has a 1460 pound useful load, and burns that sweet car gas. In every measurable way, the Pathfinder is superior to the Arrow, except one -- fuel burn. With the money you're talking about, that hardly matters. Do what you want, but IMHO if you've got the kind of money you're talking about spending, you'd be crazy not to get a Lancair or a Cirrus. -- Jay Honeck Iowa City, IA Pathfinder N56993 www.AlexisParkInn.com "Your Aviation Destination" |
#37
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper ArrowIII (brand new)
Do what you want, but IMHO if you've got the kind of money you're
talking about spending, you'd be crazy not to get a Lancair or a Cirrus. For short hops? Jose -- There are more ways to skin a cat than there are cats. for Email, make the obvious change in the address. |
#38
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
In article .com,
"Jay Honeck" wrote: Call me fickle, self-oriented, greedy, snobby, what have you, but I do not fly and will not own a fixed-gear plane. That's the goofiest thing I've read here in a long time. Atlas, our fixed-gear Piper Cherokee 235 Pathfinder, will absolutely walk away from an Arrow in a head-to-head speed race Um. If Atlas is faster than an Arrow, it has to be because of speed mods. Put the equivalent speed mods on the Arrow and Atlas will lose. For example, vref says the 1973 Arrow cruise is 140 knots and the 1973 235 cruise is 133 knots. Of course, Atlas will haul way more than any Arrow. -- Bob Noel Looking for a sig the lawyers will hate |
#39
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
Um. If Atlas is faster than an Arrow, it has to be because of speed mods.
Put the equivalent speed mods on the Arrow and Atlas will lose. For example, vref says the 1973 Arrow cruise is 140 knots and the 1973 235 cruise is 133 knots. We flight plan 142 knots. Of course, Atlas will haul way more than any Arrow. Atlas will haul more than any single engine plane short of a Caravan. He's a beast -- but we love him anyway... ;-) -- Jay Honeck Iowa City, IA Pathfinder N56993 www.AlexisParkInn.com "Your Aviation Destination" |
#40
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
Do what you want, but IMHO if you've got the kind of money you're
talking about spending, you'd be crazy not to get a Lancair or a Cirrus. For short hops? For any hops. If I had half a million bucks laying around, I'd be looking at a Lancair. That is one helluva an airplane. -- Jay Honeck Iowa City, IA Pathfinder N56993 www.AlexisParkInn.com "Your Aviation Destination" |
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