Soaring Accident in Washington State

No License, Butt, plenty of experience
Florida man here... Lived in NW, flown in more than several Gliders.
Been winched up, car towed up, Pawnee towed up, worked the winch on
way more than 20 flights alone, lots of hours in everything from a
Stearman to F-4, 3 place gliders and 2 place gliders... How could
anyone use a 200' tow rope on a Automobile launch on a 2,500 strip and
hope to have ANY leeway to recover from ANY deviation from
perfection ?... sounds like a serious lack of EXPERIENCE met an eager
CREW trying to perform on camera. And... where is this Precious Video
that surely will shed more than light on this tragic accident?... This
Boggs Guy seems to have called it...
You do not know what You have not experienced

On Oct 15, 4:34*pm, Michael Dewitt Allen
wrote:

You do not know what You have not experienced

H'okay...

How could anyone use a 200' tow rope on an automobile launch on a 2,500 strip and
hope to have ANY leeway to recover from ANY deviation from
perfection?

Indeed...and those deviations will all occur more quickly in time as the rope
shortens, whether on an aerotow or ground launch, as any kid who has ever
launched a kite would be likely to know.

Sadly,
Bob W.

On Oct 15, 5:43*pm, BobW wrote:
How could anyone use a 200' tow rope on an automobile launch on a 2,500 strip and
hope to have ANY leeway to recover from ANY deviation from
perfection?

Indeed...and those deviations will all occur more quickly in time as the rope
shortens, whether on an aerotow or ground launch, as any kid who has ever
launched a kite would be likely to know.

Sadly,
Bob W.

I have many times launched with a 200' rope on a 1500 foot runway
(Torrey Pines) - but I was not attempting to climb! - only to get 50
feet off the ground and make it to the cliff edge on a blowing day; no
problem. (I have also launched with 1500' rope on a mile-long dry
lake; also fine)
If he attempted to climb, he would immediately find himself at an
extremely high angle of attack - the glider is not in free flight but
is subject to the force along the rope, which, with a short rope, will
very rapidly be at a very large angle to the glider's attitude.
Perhaps when we see the video from the helicopter we will understand
exactly what happened.

if the rope had not broken, what would he do at ~150' at the end of
the runway....

On Oct 15, 8:33*pm, Caterina Jardini wrote:
if the rope had not broken, what would he do at ~150' at the end of
the runway....

The plan was likely for him to land straight ahead after they got
their few seconds of footage.

No. The plan was for him to do a 180. It was doomed before they even
hit the gas.


On Oct 15, 9:53*pm, Liam wrote:
On Oct 15, 8:33*pm, Caterina Jardini wrote:

if the rope had not broken, what would he do at ~150' at the end of
the runway....

The plan was likely for him to land straight ahead after they got
their few seconds of footage.

Florida Guy here... Commenting on the "Great North West Caper" in
Washington State

Seems like this Boggs Guy has it "Right On" again...

If the "Plan" was to do a 180... AFTER a "Launch"
on a tooo short rope...
on a tooo short Runway...

The Genius that had suggested a "180 degree Return to Runway"
Had to be smokin something serious.
This "Plan" seems to have been "Doomed to Failure" from inception.

On Oct 16, 2:35*am, GARY BOGGS wrote:
No. The plan was for him to do a 180. It was doomed before they even
hit the gas.

On Oct 15, 9:53*pm, Liam wrote:



On Oct 15, 8:33*pm, Caterina Jardini wrote:

if the rope had not broken, what would he do at ~150' at the end of
the runway....

The plan was likely for him to land straight ahead after they got
their few seconds of footage.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

On Oct 15, 4:34*pm, Michael Dewitt Allen
wrote:
How could
anyone use a 200' tow rope on a Automobile launch on a 2,500 strip and
hope to have ANY leeway to recover from ANY deviation from
perfection ?

Since this is all speculation I'll add mine. Differences between
starting a launch on a 200ft rope behind a tow plane and the same
launch behind a powerful truck a

1. the lack of prop wash and
2. the potential for greatly increased initial acceleration

A reasonable scenario for the shoot would have been for the glider to
become airborne for a few seconds and then release to land ahead while
the truck accelerated out of the way. On the face of it the risks
seem manageable and no worse than the initial segment of an aerotow
from the same runway.

I wonder how much the combination of high initial acceleration and
short rope contributed to this accident. A key factor may be whether
the launch used a nose hook or a CG hook. If the plan was to land
ahead with no attempt to gain significant altitude then the nose hook
may have been the right choice.

People are questioning the experience of the glider pilot. Maybe the
experience of the truck driver is just as important?

Andy
(aerotow, winch and ground launch in my log)

On Oct 16, 6:33*am, Michael Dewitt Allen
wrote:
Florida Guy here... Commenting on the "Great North West Caper" in
Washington State

Seems like this Boggs Guy has it "Right On" again...

If the "Plan" was to do a 180... AFTER a "Launch"
on a tooo short rope...
on a tooo short Runway...

The *Genius that had suggested a "180 degree Return to Runway"
Had to be smokin something serious.
This "Plan" seems to have been "Doomed to Failure" from inception.


While the "plan" seems to be seriously flawed, and contributed to the
accident, it may not be the direct cause. Photos and videos clearly
show the right airbrake extended and the left retracted. This points
to a failure of the airbrake controls, which would be consistent with
what most witnesses reported (he veered off to the right after doing a
pull-up). There is an AD out on the DG-1000 airbrake control circuit.
These controls hookup automatically, so an assembly error is not
likely.