Careless Linemen

That's why I advise supplying your own.

Bob

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:T%Odg.750186$084.532251@attbi_s22...
Tell you what I suggest for the futu Lay hands on enough rubber or
soft plastic to cover the area of the filler with a good margin around
it, and cut out a circle just a tad larger than the filler opening. Tell
the lineboy to put it in place before inserting the nozzle.

The most damage I've ever had inflicted by a lineman was due to a guy
using one of those rubber mats.

It had been "stored" in the gravel adjacent to the fuel pump, and
(unbeknownst to him) the underside had become caked with sand and small
stones. That sand- and rock-paper was ground into the paint by the weight
of the line-guy's arm and the edge of the fuel filler spout.

It seems silly to have to say it, but if your FBO uses a rubber mat make
sure they brush off the loose stuff before laying it on your wing.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

On Fri, 26 May 2006 17:43:32 -0700, "Bob Gardner"
wrote:

Tell you what I suggest for the futu Lay hands on enough rubber or soft
plastic to cover the area of the filler with a good margin around it, and
cut out a circle just a tad larger than the filler opening. Tell the lineboy
to put it in place before inserting the nozzle. I'll bet you could go to a
second-hand store and pick up place mats, dish mats, etc that would do the
job for pennies.

I've stopped over at a number of good sized airports and most of the
FBOs used a matt like this to protect the paint. At Tyson McGee (sp?)
they even rolled out a carpet for us to walk on. They did that for
every plane stopping over. That was a few years ago, so I wonder if
they still do it.

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com

That filler mat will work well. I've seen people use the rubber padding
stores sell for lining drawers of tool boxes as well.
The previous owner of our 172 had a lineboy rest the fuel nozzle like
you mentioned. On later inspection he found a cracked filler neck on
the fuel tank. That's a costly repair for what seems like a harmless
action. My A&P taught me to hold the hose over my shoulder, keeping the
weight of the hose off of the airplane. For us high wingers you also
need to watch and make sure the linemen dont stand on the struts(unless
you've got the steps and pads some models do) and bang the ladder into
the wings/fuselage/strut.

Brock Boss

Kyle Boatright wrote:
How do the rest of you deal with careless linemen? The kind who scratch
your airplane or chip the paint because they are either careless or have not
been properly trained on how to avoid damaging aircraft when refueling 'em.

Every owner probably handles things like this differently. I agree it can be
a real hassle when somebody puts a nice dent or ding on that nice new Imron
paint job you just forked out 10 grand for.
There are two scenarios involved with this type of thing; one at your home
field; the other on the road.
It's a lot easier to handle it on your home field. Just walk into the flight
office and very nicely but with some authority state quite clearly exactly
how you wish your airplane to be handled. If using a rag between a hose
nozzle and your paint is something you prefer, tell them.
I've done this for fifty years and never had a problem.
On the other hand, getting serviced at strange fields has it's risks. Trust
me I know :-)
You can always leave explicit instructions with the line office that define
any concerns you might have. Also, something I always did was to have a
prepared notice on a neatly done signboard that I left showing in plain
sight inside my canopy for the line people to see asking for rags between
metal at all times when servicing my airplane. This also served me well
through the years, as did the nice little pitot cover my wife made for me
out of red fabric with a nice lightning bolt sewn on both sides with the
following sewn into it........."DON'T TOUCH THIS. HIGH VOLTAGE" :-))))
Worked like a charm!!!
Dudley Henriques


"Kyle Boatright" wrote in message
...
How do the rest of you deal with careless linemen? The kind who scratch
your airplane or chip the paint because they are either careless or have
not been properly trained on how to avoid damaging aircraft when refueling
'em.

Case in point - this afternoon I stopped by the airport to prep for a trip
to the beach tomorrow. I grabbed a couple of maps and the handheld gps
from the airplane while the lineman was getting ready to fuel the
airplane. By the time I grabbed those things, the lineman had already
filled the left tank, and there was a brand spankin' new paint chip near
the fuel filler on the tank. How do I know it was brand new? Because I'd
just wiped off a nice collection of bugs from the airplane, and it wasn't
chipped then... Anyway, I eased over to see how he was coming with the
other tank, and he had the entire 10" long nozzle in the right tank and
was using a notch in the fuel nozzle's handle to catch the edge of the
fuel filler neck to provide a mechanical stop.

I say "hey, let me show you something" and show him that the sharp corner
of the casting is resting on the fuel filler. He pulls the nozzle out of
the tank, and there is a noticable mark on the paint where he was resting
the nozzle. He said he didn't realize he was doing that. I didn't point
out the new chip on the other wing, which I speculate was caused by either
the same technique, or the other technique I've seen many times, where the
lineman puts the nozzle into the tank at a 45 degree angle, and the weight
of the nozzle rests on the painted edge of the fuel filler.

This is my home airport, and the guy was nice enough, so I didn't make an
issue out of it, but it is really frustrating to have avoidable dings and
chips on your airplane when it costs $5k or $10k to have the thing
repainted...

BTW, self serve is not an option at my home field, which is why I usually
go elsewhere for fuel. That and the high prices that are caused by having
to pay the "fuel truck guy" to hang around the airport all day long when
there really isn't much fuel being sold...

Also, now that I'm giving this more thought, I need to see if the guy
dented the bottom of my fuel tanks by sticking the nozzle so far in
there... Sheesh...

I just refuel my own plane. I do have a plane that not all lineman have seen
so it usually doesn't take much convincing.

When I check in, I either ask for fuel right then and go back out and wait
for it or I tell them that I'll order the fuel when I get back. Either way,
I'm there for it.

As they drive up, I have the ground clip pulled out and clipped on before
they get out of their truck. As they are zeroing the counter and unwinding
the hose, I'm climbing on my plane so all they have to do is hand it to me.

I have only had two guys challenge me that it was against their policy for
them to let me fuel. In both cases, I simply said "I understand. Well I
guess unless you want to call your boss for an exception, that'll do it
then. Sorry to bring you out here for nothing." In both cases, they relented
and handed me the fuel nozzle.

In one of the above cases, the guy actually said it was against the law for
him to let me do the fueling. I didn't argue with him but I did say, "That
would be incorrect but I would believe that you have a company polciy
against it. Is that what you are thinking of?" He said, "Yea, Yea, that's
what I meant. Policy. Stupid policy. After all, it's your plane. Here you
go. You want me to get the windshield while your fueling?"

--
-------------------------------
Travis
Lake N3094P
PWK

"Dudley Henriques" wrote in message
nk.net...
Every owner probably handles things like this differently. I agree it can
be a real hassle when somebody puts a nice dent or ding on that nice new
Imron paint job you just forked out 10 grand for.
There are two scenarios involved with this type of thing; one at your home
field; the other on the road.
It's a lot easier to handle it on your home field. Just walk into the
flight office and very nicely but with some authority state quite clearly
exactly how you wish your airplane to be handled. If using a rag between a
hose nozzle and your paint is something you prefer, tell them.
I've done this for fifty years and never had a problem.
On the other hand, getting serviced at strange fields has it's risks.
Trust me I know :-)
You can always leave explicit instructions with the line office that
define any concerns you might have. Also, something I always did was to
have a prepared notice on a neatly done signboard that I left showing in
plain sight inside my canopy for the line people to see asking for rags
between metal at all times when servicing my airplane. This also served me
well through the years, as did the nice little pitot cover my wife made
for me out of red fabric with a nice lightning bolt sewn on both sides
with the following sewn into it........."DON'T TOUCH THIS. HIGH VOLTAGE"
:-))))
Worked like a charm!!!
Dudley Henriques


"Kyle Boatright" wrote in message
...
How do the rest of you deal with careless linemen? The kind who scratch
your airplane or chip the paint because they are either careless or have
not been properly trained on how to avoid damaging aircraft when
refueling 'em.

Case in point - this afternoon I stopped by the airport to prep for a
trip to the beach tomorrow. I grabbed a couple of maps and the handheld
gps from the airplane while the lineman was getting ready to fuel the
airplane. By the time I grabbed those things, the lineman had already
filled the left tank, and there was a brand spankin' new paint chip near
the fuel filler on the tank. How do I know it was brand new? Because I'd
just wiped off a nice collection of bugs from the airplane, and it wasn't
chipped then... Anyway, I eased over to see how he was coming with the
other tank, and he had the entire 10" long nozzle in the right tank and
was using a notch in the fuel nozzle's handle to catch the edge of the
fuel filler neck to provide a mechanical stop.

I say "hey, let me show you something" and show him that the sharp corner
of the casting is resting on the fuel filler. He pulls the nozzle out of
the tank, and there is a noticable mark on the paint where he was resting
the nozzle. He said he didn't realize he was doing that. I didn't point
out the new chip on the other wing, which I speculate was caused by
either the same technique, or the other technique I've seen many times,
where the lineman puts the nozzle into the tank at a 45 degree angle, and
the weight of the nozzle rests on the painted edge of the fuel filler.

This is my home airport, and the guy was nice enough, so I didn't make an
issue out of it, but it is really frustrating to have avoidable dings and
chips on your airplane when it costs $5k or $10k to have the thing
repainted...

BTW, self serve is not an option at my home field, which is why I usually
go elsewhere for fuel. That and the high prices that are caused by
having to pay the "fuel truck guy" to hang around the airport all day
long when there really isn't much fuel being sold...

Also, now that I'm giving this more thought, I need to see if the guy
dented the bottom of my fuel tanks by sticking the nozzle so far in
there... Sheesh...

Actually, in Oregon, it IS against the law to fuel your own airplane. Can't
fuel your own car either.

Karl
"Curator" N185KG


In one of the above cases, the guy actually said it was against the law
for him to let me do the fueling. I didn't argue with him but I did say,
"That would be incorrect but I would believe that you have a company
polciy against it. Is that what you are thinking of?" He said, "Yea, Yea,
that's what I meant. Policy. Stupid policy. After all, it's your plane.
Here you go. You want me to get the windshield while your fueling?"

--
-------------------------------
Travis
Lake N3094P
PWK

karl gruber wrote:

Actually, in Oregon, it IS against the law to fuel your own airplane. Can't
fuel your own car either.

Heh, even in New Jersey (no self service at service stations) you can
fuel your own airplane, and the marina "line man" will hand you the
nozzle to fill your boat too. Go figure.

The only exception to the self service for road vehicles that I've found
in NJ is the base gase station at McGuire.

Jessica wrote:
karl gruber wrote:

Actually, in Oregon, it IS against the law to fuel your own airplane.
Can't fuel your own car either.

Heh, even in New Jersey (no self service at service stations) you can
fuel your own airplane, and the marina "line man" will hand you the
nozzle to fill your boat too. Go figure.

The only exception to the self service for road vehicles that I've found
in NJ is the base gase station at McGuire.

That's because the airports and the marinas weren't the one that got
that law put in placed. Despite the bogus claims of safety, the
reason the law exists is because the small gas station owners banded
together with enough political clout to stave off the single
employee mega gas and go that they feared would put them out of business.

But you can always stand there an supervise, it is the PIC
duty. Let the coffee wait. If you have to ****, do it on
the ramp, but be there to talk to the line guy and see to
the cleanliness and procedures.


--
James H. Macklin
ATP,CFI,A&P

--
The people think the Constitution protects their rights;
But government sees it as an obstacle to be overcome.
some support
http://www.usdoj.gov/olc/secondamendment2.htm
See http://www.fija.org/ more about your rights and duties.


"karl gruber" wrote in message
...
| Actually, in Oregon, it IS against the law to fuel your
own airplane. Can't
| fuel your own car either.
|
| Karl
| "Curator" N185KG
|
|
| In one of the above cases, the guy actually said it was
against the law
| for him to let me do the fueling. I didn't argue with
him but I did say,
| "That would be incorrect but I would believe that you
have a company
| polciy against it. Is that what you are thinking of?" He
said, "Yea, Yea,
| that's what I meant. Policy. Stupid policy. After all,
it's your plane.
| Here you go. You want me to get the windshield while
your fueling?"
|
| --
| -------------------------------
| Travis
| Lake N3094P
| PWK
|
|
|

"karl gruber" wrote in message
...
Actually, in Oregon, it IS against the law to fuel your own airplane.
Can't fuel your own car either.

Karl
"Curator" N185KG

Really? Cite?

Al