US Air Force survival gun?

"Paul J. Adam" wrote in message ...

Again, for survival after escaping from an unflyable aircraft? The idea is
"not to die of exposure, hunger or angry wildlife", not "stand off all of 3
Shock Army singlehandedly". Every ounce of grenades, heavy-calibre
ammunition, et cetera you carry is an ounce less of food, water, radio
beacon, spare batteries, flares, dye markers and other items that might
actually improve your chances of living until rescue.

Respectfully, doesn't that depend on what you are most likely to need
to do in order to survive?

WILDERNESS survival in peacetime is different from survival behind
enemy lines in time of war.

--

FF

(Fred the Red Shirt) wrote:
"Paul J. Adam" wrote in message ...

Again, for survival after escaping from an unflyable aircraft? The idea is
"not to die of exposure, hunger or angry wildlife", not "stand off all of 3
Shock Army singlehandedly". Every ounce of grenades, heavy-calibre
ammunition, et cetera you carry is an ounce less of food, water, radio
beacon, spare batteries, flares, dye markers and other items that might
actually improve your chances of living until rescue.

Respectfully, doesn't that depend on what you are most likely to need
to do in order to survive?

WILDERNESS survival in peacetime is different from survival behind
enemy lines in time of war.

Not really. The "angry wildlife" he mentioned is just expanded
to include assholes standing on two legs and armed with
rifles...

"Escaping from an unflyable aircraft" doesn't mean launching a
full scale attack on the nearest military garrison just because
you are in the neighborhood and in a bad mood.

--
Floyd L. Davidson http://web.newsguy.com/floyd_davidson
Ukpeagvik (Barrow, Alaska)

From: (Fred the Red Shirt)


"Paul J. Adam" wrote in message
...

Again, for survival after escaping from an unflyable aircraft? The idea is
"not to die of exposure, hunger or angry wildlife", not "stand off all of 3
Shock Army singlehandedly". Every ounce of grenades, heavy-calibre
ammunition, et cetera you carry is an ounce less of food, water, radio
beacon, spare batteries, flares, dye markers and other items that might
actually improve your chances of living until rescue.

Respectfully, doesn't that depend on what you are most likely to need
to do in order to survive?

WILDERNESS survival in peacetime is different from survival behind
enemy lines in time of war.

--

FF

Aircrews are taught escape and evasion(E&E). Unless you are Rambo with an
unlimited amount of ammunition an no need to eat or drink you will have almost
no chance of surviving or affecting the war if you take on the enemy. You can,
however E&E and see what information you can pick up on your way. That
information and your skills have more effect on the war than you getting killed
trying to take out an enemy or two. For one thing very few aircrewmen are
infantry qualfied, USMC excepted, and the bad guys probably are.

You are better off finding a way to make sure you are rescued and can survive
until you are.

In this sense the survival kit is essentially the same as what you would need
if you were lost in the words.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

Backpacking survival gun. For what reason? To get something to eat? A
Savage Model 24 rifle/shorgun over-under can be had in 22LR/20gauge,
on up to 30-30 over 12 gauge. Gives you one shot each barrel for
grizzly or brown bear. If you just want something to pot food, get a
22LR revolver and LEARN HOW to shoot it. Hint - buy a couple cartons
of 22 and find a coach. You'll learn much faster. If you're going into
grizzly/brown bear country - well, pack enough rifle. Here in the
Rockies our trouble is now mountain lions. They're not particularly
fazed by humans, either, and dine quite well on the poodles they find
around Boulder. BTW one of my friends runs a ranch in the Sierra
foothills and says they're having the same problem only there in Cal
shooting mountain lions is forbidden. Here in CO I carry my 357 Model
19 while up in the hills. (The 44M is too big and boisterous for good
double action shooting.)
Walt BJ

WILDERNESS survival in peacetime is different from survival behind
enemy lines in time of war.


Someone ought to tell the military survival school instructors, then, because
they are teaching people the wrong stuff.

"Kevin Brooks" wrote in message
...

"John Keeney" wrote in message
...

"Peter Stickney" wrote in message
...

I haven't heard any credible stories of Black Bear attacks either.
They're pretty willing to just go about their business and amble
along. I think that the Bears (and us) face more danger from the
Charging Buick than anything else.

I believe a back country camper was killed in the Rocky Mountain
National Park last summer just before I was out there. Drug out
of his tent at night.

Actually, from what I have read the case in Colorado did not involve a
camper; instead, it was apparently a logger/timberman who had a
backcountry
cabin, from which he was drug, killed, and partially consumed. There was
also a similar case in New Mexico, where the victim was a 90 year old
woman,
again in her cabin. Black bears are not necessarilly cuddly creatures.

OK, I just did a search for the story and it seems it wasn't a fatal attack.
Two people in separate tents were attacked but no fatalities.
I thought for a while there must have been another incident because
the area of the park they were attacked in didn't match the area I recalled
(Fern Lake Trail for the attack vs Wild Basin from memory), but it
seems the Wild Basin is where they finally killed the bear.

"Fred the Red Shirt" wrote in message
om...
"Paul J. Adam" wrote in message
...

Again, for survival after escaping from an unflyable aircraft? The idea
is
"not to die of exposure, hunger or angry wildlife", not "stand off all
of 3
Shock Army singlehandedly". Every ounce of grenades, heavy-calibre
ammunition, et cetera you carry is an ounce less of food, water, radio
beacon, spare batteries, flares, dye markers and other items that might
actually improve your chances of living until rescue.

Respectfully, doesn't that depend on what you are most likely to need
to do in order to survive?

WILDERNESS survival in peacetime is different from survival behind
enemy lines in time of war.

A lone downed airman -or lone downed crew for that matter- isn't
in a position to get into fire fights: there's just no way they can have
brought enough fire power with them. Not getting captured means
stealth and recovery. Survival means not ****ing off the more heavily
armed people around you, water, shelter in bad weather and food.
In that order.
A good knife can be used stealthily in making shelter, some places
getting water and food. Perhaps a gun with subsonic ammo would
be sufficiently comforting and useful for small game in a long term
situation to be worth while.

Again, for survival after escaping from an unflyable aircraft? The idea
is
"not to die of exposure, hunger or angry wildlife", not "stand off all
of 3
Shock Army singlehandedly". Every ounce of grenades, heavy-calibre
ammunition, et cetera you carry is an ounce less of food, water, radio
beacon, spare batteries, flares, dye markers and other items that might
actually improve your chances of living until rescue.

Respectfully, doesn't that depend on what you are most likely to need
to do in order to survive?

WILDERNESS survival in peacetime is different from survival behind
enemy lines in time of war.

A lone downed airman -or lone downed crew for that matter- isn't
in a position to get into fire fights: there's just no way they can have
brought enough fire power with them. Not getting captured means
stealth and recovery. Survival means not ****ing off the more heavily
armed people around you, water, shelter in bad weather and food.
In that order.
A good knife can be used stealthily in making shelter, some places
getting water and food. Perhaps a gun with subsonic ammo would
be sufficiently comforting and useful for small game in a long term
situation to be worth while.



History has not borne out the need for firearms in a survival situation
following am aircraft downing so far as I am aware. Roger Locher survived on
the ground for 21 days in North Vietnam without using his sidearm and another
fellow survived in the Sierras for nearly three months after ejecting into a
snowbank in late winter, finding a cabin, then walking out after being given up
for dead. IN an area where there is lots of wilderness your main needs are
wate, signalling, and shelter for a long term situation, not protection from
critters..

(B2431) wrote in message ...
From: Jim Yanik


(B2431) wrote in
:

snip

The Armalite AR-7 is the one that
takes apart and stores in its own stock. Mine is made by Charter arms
and is in 22LR. If memory serves the current maker is Henry.

James Bond used one in Goldfinger (I think)

No, it was used in "From Russia with Love".

many people over in rec.guns claim that the Henry AR-7 is plagued with jams
and failure-to-feeds.

True, true... just like the hinge pin problem on the M6. Guess US
manufacturers can't make precision guns the way the Germans do.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net

The only problem I have with my Charter Arms AR-7 is the charging handle can
drop out and is easily lost while disassembly. I was hoping Henry's AR-7s were
as good as Charter Arm's.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

(can't wait for the Obituary that reads: Dan, U.S. Air Force,
expired)!

From: (robert arndt)


(B2431) wrote in message
...
From: Jim Yanik


(B2431) wrote in
:

snip

The Armalite AR-7 is the one that
takes apart and stores in its own stock. Mine is made by Charter arms
and is in 22LR. If memory serves the current maker is Henry.

James Bond used one in Goldfinger (I think)

No, it was used in "From Russia with Love".

many people over in rec.guns claim that the Henry AR-7 is plagued with
jams
and failure-to-feeds.

True, true... just like the hinge pin problem on the M6. Guess US
manufacturers can't make precision guns the way the Germans do.

Despite your blatant anti American feelings several American companies are
capable of making precision firearmes and do.

Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net

The only problem I have with my Charter Arms AR-7 is the charging handle
can
drop out and is easily lost while disassembly. I was hoping Henry's AR-7s
were
as good as Charter Arm's.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

(can't wait for the Obituary that reads: Dan, U.S. Air Force,
expired)!

I guess if you can't wait you will have to find something else to occupy your
time. Someday I will die as will you. Perhaps you will out live me and perhaps
you won't.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired