Attitudes & Reality

On Monday, April 30, 2018 at 11:20:17 AM UTC-7, wrote:
Add 'I'm safer because I have the latest gadgets' to the dangerous attitudes list.

Dude, remember the Biz jet and brand new ASG-29 over the Pine Nuts? Lastest technology (transponder on) would have kept that event from happening. I understand why 2-33's without radios or batteries do not have transponders and Flarm, but every private ship flying XC should be equipped with either.. We just had a near miss in the Chicago area with a 737 and an ASH-26 (without transponder)! You don't see the guy behind you flying 200 knots faster than you. You must have 20/20 20/20 vision, with the eyes in the back of your head.

I would argue composite gliders are safer than wooden gliders, GPS is safer than paper maps, Moving map computers are safer than a wiz wheel and paper map... list goes on and on. Technology moves with progression of time, clocks that bind will be left to rust.

I am not sure what your point is, my flight computer actually verbally tells me where to look for conflict traffic. My transponder and Flarm also tell other pilots where I am. I keep a good scan as that is also how you see the weather, and traffic, but when my computer tells me where to look I do, and it is safer for BOTH me and traffic.

Are you seriously arguing that transponders and Flarm are not added safety?

As for brakes on horseless carriage, standard equipment, as should a transponder and/or Flarm.

To the guy that accuses us of having "monkey brains-"

Do you really believe that great eyesight and a proper scan (while desirable and a definite benefit) are somehow superior to great eyesight, a proper scan AND situational awareness of gliders, power traffic and UFOs? Let's face it- if there is somebody in my "six" and I get a notification on the "TV" (as you put it), then that is one more piece of the situational awareness that affects my decision process.

If, on the other hand, you in your little Luddite world have no knowledge of Mister X coming up behind you, and you decide to make a hard left into a thermal populated by the guys you CAN see, and are nailed by Mister X, (who had Flarm, an XPDR with ADS-B and maybe a red flag), does your smug sense of superiority make the bailout any less traumatic?

On Monday, April 30, 2018 at 7:55:30 PM UTC-4, Ramy wrote:

To Greg, are you for real?

I welcome Gregg's posts because he speaks for many pilots. Contrary posts clarify people's thinking.

Keep the posts coming Gregg. It's good to know that pilots like you are out there.

You think you are safe at cloudbase because you have a transponder and or Flarm? Hooked up to a hobby battery with wires and connectors from radio shack. Lolz. Good number of the posts on RAS are about our glider electronics malfunctioning. And with working gadgets we still have the monkey brain electronic gadget interface incompatibilities.
For those offended by 'monkey brain' as a description of the machinations of human pilots try one of the scientific terms. Risk homeostasis is a good start.

On Monday, April 30, 2018 at 4:41:14 PM UTC-4, wrote:
Monkey brain - Really......

It is attitude we are talking about. (I think) - My rational is based completely on what keeps other people affected by our behaviors safer.

Now if you want to make the argument that flying to cloud base in a glider with no transponder and no Flarm (many of us in IFR Airways) is safer than have either one or both - now that's what I would love to hear. and if you suggest we (as a group) do not do that....... than we are not having an honest discussion.

Just think about what you say to the family of the people on the Jet Blue flight that hit you while descending through the cloud that you were sitting under........ actually let's be real - the person making the excuse for you is not you, it is your wife/mother/dad..... because you are not there to tell them "sorry I didn't see you".

The text at the beginning of the thread was food for thought - so I thought - I merely added that some of the thought needs to be directed at the people we forget about while we are focused during the act of flying.

One of the main drivers to changed attitude is "Empathy" - when you hurt yourself, you are not the only one affected - sometime I forget this. That's all.

All I am saying is next time your at 6,000 MSL in your glider with only your 2 eyeballs to prevent the business jet from dropping out of the cloud onto your head - ponder the possible outcomes (1. nothing comes down, 2 jet comes down and misses you, 3 jet comes down and you get hurt, 4 everyone gets hurt) and how you justify each to ALL the people affected.

WH

"You think you are safe at cloudbase because you have a transponder and or Flarm? Hooked up to a hobby battery with wires and connectors from radio shack."

First off, I don't use "hobby batteries" or connectors from Radio Shack. (Not that it matters- RS has some decent stuff if you know what to look for. And I know how to wire my cockpit. Tefzel wire etc. etc.)

Am I safe at cloudbase with Flarm, transponder and ADS-B? Maybe, maybe not. But I am definitely safer than you with nothing but the Mk 1 eyeball and a chip on your shoulder.

On 4/30/2018 6:58 PM, Jonathan St. Cloud wrote:
As for brakes on horseless carriage, standard equipment, as should a transponder and/or Flarm.
No argument here, just musing on progress.Â* Remember when seat belts in
cars cost extra, or when you had to buy the top of the line model to get
air bags?Â* Now they're all standard equipment though cars cost a lot
more than they used to, even, I'd wager, when considering inflation.

I was watching across the taxiway as the owner of the hangar across from
mine was preparing to replace his Flarm portable with a brick in his
brand new Ventus 3.Â* Later, I walked over to check on his progress and
he told me that he was already receiving ADS-B targets!Â* How could he
have completed the installation so quickly? As it turns out and, I think
to his surprise, the factory had already installed an antenna in the
tail, all the cabling required, and even a mounting plate under the
glare shield!Â* All he had to do was hook up the cables, attach the brick
to the mount, and turn on the master switch.Â* That was pretty good
service, if you ask me.
--
Dan, 5J

On Tuesday, May 1, 2018 at 7:42:53 AM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
.....Â* Remember when seat belts in
cars cost extra, ...
Dan, 5J

No, I don't.

Maybe I misspoke.Â* My '63 Chevy Nova, purchased in '68, didn't have seat
belts so I bought and installed them.Â* Maybe they simply weren't
available from the factory...

On 5/1/2018 8:52 AM, Jonathan St. Cloud wrote:
On Tuesday, May 1, 2018 at 7:42:53 AM UTC-7, Dan Marotta wrote:
....Â* Remember when seat belts in
cars cost extra, ...
Dan, 5J
No, I don't.

--
Dan, 5J

On Tuesday, May 1, 2018 at 10:00:01 AM UTC-4, wrote:
"You think you are safe at cloudbase because you have a transponder and or Flarm? Hooked up to a hobby battery with wires and connectors from radio shack."

I agree with one of the earlier posts - it is good that Gregg is in the conversation - the first step convincing anyone of any thing is to understand where how their thought process.

I think some people of Gregg opinion think that if you do something new or that adds, it replaces what was the norm - the "you can not do 2 things at the same time" i.e. Flarm replaces See and Avoid. It is a pretty common argument from most late adapters and no need for drama or ridicule. More a human condition thing.

Again I go back to - your opinion may be that you are safe at cloud base with only see and avoid (looking where you can not see) - but I bet if you asked any or every jet pilot about gliders circling at cloud base without a way to see if they are there - there would be 100% agreement in that result. Shouldn't they matter to us (the soaring community)

On "New Gadgets" - were are not talking about new improved decals - gadget kind of marginalizes the topic.

If you took ta 2018 car (any car) and started taking stuff off it until you only had items found in a 1954 muscle car - I do not think there is any doubt in anyone's mind which is the safer thing to drive. Pretty much a slam dunk.

Everyone has their own threshold of risk - I just think we need to remember the risk is not only to "Me the Pilot". I just do not see how flying Stealth allows another aircraft from slamming into you because they could not see you - and how you justify your desire to not allow them to see you. I decided a while ago not to fly without both a Flarm and transponder - and if they make something else that allows another aircraft to see me - i will get that also.

It is pretty common to hear glider pilots giving advice on a glider purchase to say " spend money on a glider you like and more for to get a trailer you love" - I would add "budget for a device you can see other planes and they can see you".

As I was told by my mentor in gliding - "the glider that hits you is the one you did not see"

WH

At cloud base you have violated FARs. How many Western pilots actually know and adhere to cloud clearance regulations above 10,000ft?

111 1,000 ft below; 1,000 above and 1 sm horizontal

....Again I go back to - your opinion may be that you are safe at cloud base ....