Instrument Rating Checkride PASSED (Very Long)

C Kingsbury wrote:

"Chris" wrote in message
...

The FAA does not recommend that an examiner agree to act as PIC of a

flight

during a practical test.

( http://av-info.faa.gov/data/staticdocs/8710-3c.pdf ) page 54

That does suggest that flying in IMC is not what should happen on an
instrument checkride.



To me it suggests that the FAA wants to limit its liability in the event of
an accident on a checkride.

-cwk.



Yes, recommending something isn't the same as prohibiting or requiring it.


Matt

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 14:24:26 -0000, "Chris" wrote:

No I am not suggesting that but the practice is not recommended by the FAA
as per the examiners handbook;


Would this be parsed as (1) "not recommended" by the FAA, or (2) not
"recommended by the FAA"?

It hardly matters but the fact is that the practice of DPE being PIC is
something the FAA prefers not to happen to the extent that they put it in
the examiners handbook.

Therefore if something goes wrong then its likely a black mark for the
examiner and if some inspector decides to have a downer on an examiner then
it provides whatever evidence the inspector needs.

"Chris" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
...
On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 14:24:26 -0000, "Chris" wrote:

No I am not suggesting that but the practice is not recommended by the
FAA
as per the examiners handbook;


Would this be parsed as (1) "not recommended" by the FAA, or (2) not
"recommended by the FAA"?

It hardly matters but the fact is that the practice of DPE being PIC is
something the FAA prefers not to happen to the extent that they put it in
the examiners handbook.

Therefore if something goes wrong then its likely a black mark for the
examiner and if some inspector decides to have a downer on an examiner
then it provides whatever evidence the inspector needs.


The other test is whether you say as a candidate to be an examiner sitting
there with an inspector watching you, you brief the applicant that you want
to be PIC so you can have the applicant fly the checkride in IMC.

The truth is you would get busted as an candidate examiner for doing
something that's not recommended so you would not, it would be done by the
book.

But the examiner does not know ahead of time how the student is going to
handle IMC. The student could freak out and lose control in IMC. As an
instructor do not take a new student in IMC until I have flown with that
student a few times. The examiner does not have that luxury.


"G. Sylvester" wrote in news:eDMud.41454
:

congrats on passing. I'm coming to final part of my traniing and I
can't wait.

In the
morning, it was still raining with a low ceiling. Since the
checkride needs
to be flown in VFR conditions, we had to cancel and reschedule the
checkride.

I'm fairly certain you can take the checkride in IMC. Of course it is
also up to the DPE. I'm sure you need VMC for the 'bad attitude' parts
but otherwise why not shoot approaches in IMC. If he doesn't
feel confident to pass you under the hood, do you think he's going to
sign you off solo?

Gerald

On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 01:54:36 -0000, "Chris" wrote:

It hardly matters but the fact is that the practice of DPE being PIC is
something the FAA prefers not to happen to the extent that they put it in
the examiners handbook.

Therefore if something goes wrong then its likely a black mark for the
examiner and if some inspector decides to have a downer on an examiner then
it provides whatever evidence the inspector needs.


My guess is that since there is a requirement that an approach be done
partial panel on the practical test, that someone (rightly, in my
opinion) thinks it's an unsafe idea to be doing them in actual
conditions, and anyone who would do unusual attitudes partial panel in
the clouds probably ought to have his head examined.

But hey, inspectors having downers on examiners?

What's that all about?

On 12 Dec 2004 20:13:52 -0600, Andrew Sarangan
wrote:

But the examiner does not know ahead of time how the student is going to
handle IMC. The student could freak out and lose control in IMC. As an
instructor do not take a new student in IMC until I have flown with that
student a few times. The examiner does not have that luxury.


So in effect, the FAA is saying "We don't want you endangering our
highly experienced instrument examiners because you might freak out
the first time you are IMC, but we don't care if you endanger your
wife and kids or any other unsuspecting passenger after you get your
ticket, so go test your skills on them"?

I don't think so.

From the DE's point of view, flying in IMC is a risky. What if the
student can't do it? He would have to take over in an airplane that he
may not be familiar with. There are also the added unknowns of dealing
with ATC. ATC might not be able to give the DE the clearances he needs
to satisfy the PTS.

From the student's point of view, well, personally, I would prefer not
to do it. I have had enough problems with ATC to not want to add that
to my workload.

But, bottom line, it is up to the DE. Some have given checkrides in
IMC. It is not prohibited.

On Sun, 12 Dec 2004 14:24:26 -0000, "Chris" wrote:

..
..


That does suggest that flying in IMC is not what should happen on an
instrument checkride.



There's also the question of the plane itself. One sage piece of
advice my instructor gave me was: "don't take a GA plane into IMC
unless you've flown it recently in VMC. Even then, be very, very
careful if it's a rented plane."

Putting myself in the place of the examiner, I'd certainly not be
willing to take an unknown plane into IMC with an unknown pilot beside
me.

Tim.

On Mon, 13 Dec 2004 09:12:17 -0700, Tim Auckland wrote:

There's also the question of the plane itself. One sage piece of
advice my instructor gave me was: "don't take a GA plane into IMC
unless you've flown it recently in VMC. Even then, be very, very
careful if it's a rented plane."

Putting myself in the place of the examiner, I'd certainly not be
willing to take an unknown plane into IMC with an unknown pilot beside
me.

Tim.


Excellent point, and very good advice.

Hi,

I've just reviewed the latest PTS for the IR, and it's littered with
references to "in simulated or actual weather conditions" which certainly
implies that the checkride can be flown in actual.

Derek...


"Matt Whiting" wrote in message
...
C Kingsbury wrote:

"Chris" wrote in message
...

The FAA does not recommend that an examiner agree to act as PIC of a

flight

during a practical test.

( http://av-info.faa.gov/data/staticdocs/8710-3c.pdf ) page 54

That does suggest that flying in IMC is not what should happen on an
instrument checkride.



To me it suggests that the FAA wants to limit its liability in the event
of
an accident on a checkride.

-cwk.



Yes, recommending something isn't the same as prohibiting or requiring it.


Matt