Apache gun camera video

Clark wrote:

Andrew wrote in :


Darrell A. Larose wrote:

Andrew ) writes:

http://w3.kill-9.com/apache_kills.mpeg

Andrew


A more complete version is located at:

http://home.comcast.net/~antman01/ap...on_in_iraq.avi

This appears to be corrupted. If you encoded it, could try to
re-encode it, otherwise does anyone else have the complete clip?


It downloaded fine for me

And me

John

"Tony Volk" wrote

Ghoulish? Maybe. But it also helps us to understand conditions there,
and
what the troops, pilots, and Iraqis are going through. I found it very
disturbing.

I don't question the motives of the pilots (not nearly enough info to
do
that), I just think that all this posting of footage of Americans killing
enemies (Afghanistan & Iraq) is pretty tasteless. Sure, some of these
victims are evil men who are deserving of justice (death or not isn't
something I'll debate), and the pilots were probably acting under
self-defense or justifiable acts of war. I'm not blaming the pilots, I'm
not blaming the American troops or the efforts against terrorism.
I just think it's tasteless to show their deaths across the world,
especially in such trivial contexts. Imagine if their deaths were
accidental, and their families knew that their faces were being shown
across
the world (remember the Somalis dragging the dead American soldiers, or
the
people falling from the WTC?). I'm not attacking you (as you also found
them disturbing), just the general idea that it's OK to broadcast explicit
videos of people dying in such a trivial context. This isn't soldiers
doing
the dirty work of analyzing battle footage. This is either trivia or
entertainment and I don't think either of those justify trivializing the
death of a group of human beings. As my quote from Randy said, when you
start taking other people's death as no big deal, that might be a sign you
really don't belong here amongst moral, civilized people.

War is a grisly affair. Most people (read civilians) don't appreciate just
how grisly.

Maybe, if more of these grisly bits were shown, there'd be less overall
support for future wars, by whatever country.

3 guys dying in a field is far more realistic than "The 4th ID takes the
town of FupDuk".

If you want to go to war, fine. Just realize exactly what it is you are
doing.

Pete

On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 00:34:45 -0500, "Tony Volk" wrote:

Ghoulish? Maybe. But it also helps us to understand conditions there, and
what the troops, pilots, and Iraqis are going through. I found it very
disturbing.

I don't question the motives of the pilots (not nearly enough info to do
that), I just think that all this posting of footage of Americans killing
enemies (Afghanistan & Iraq) is pretty tasteless. Sure, some of these
victims are evil men who are deserving of justice (death or not isn't
something I'll debate), and the pilots were probably acting under
self-defense or justifiable acts of war. I'm not blaming the pilots, I'm
not blaming the American troops or the efforts against terrorism.
I just think it's tasteless to show their deaths across the world,
especially in such trivial contexts. Imagine if their deaths were
accidental, and their families knew that their faces were being shown across
the world (remember the Somalis dragging the dead American soldiers, or the
people falling from the WTC?). I'm not attacking you (as you also found
them disturbing), just the general idea that it's OK to broadcast explicit
videos of people dying in such a trivial context. This isn't soldiers doing
the dirty work of analyzing battle footage. This is either trivia or
entertainment and I don't think either of those justify trivializing the
death of a group of human beings. As my quote from Randy said, when you
start taking other people's death as no big deal, that might be a sign you
really don't belong here amongst moral, civilized people.

Tony

Every one dies, life is a terminal disease. Death is really
not that big of a deal, get over it.

Al Minyard

War is a grisly affair. Most people (read civilians) don't appreciate just
how grisly.
Maybe, if more of these grisly bits were shown, there'd be less overall
support for future wars, by whatever country.
3 guys dying in a field is far more realistic than "The 4th ID takes the
town of FupDuk".
If you want to go to war, fine. Just realize exactly what it is you are
doing.
Pete

My entire point is that people should take more concern regarding death.
I don't think many citizens take war lightly, and I think most appreciate
that it's a very grisly business.
But if you really want to warn citizens about the perils of war,
wouldn't it be far more effective to show their own soldiers die? Let's get
some footage of American soldiers dying. Preferably some really good stuff
of a wounded soldier screaming in pain, missing a limb, bleeding to death,
and passing on a message of love to his family before dying. Then let's air
that and see how tasteful or necessary showing combat deaths become. I
don't think showing people die is an appropriate educational or propaganda
tool.

Tony

Every one dies, life is a terminal disease. Death is really
not that big of a deal, get over it.
Al Minyard

Wow. Deep, deep, statement. So if everyone you cared about died, it
would be no big deal, right? Heck, if someone went to kill you, that'd just
be advancing the course of your terminal disease. You're right, there's
nothing special about life, and the violent end of another human's life is
really no big deal. You should teach ethics! Sarcasm off.

Tony

"Tony Volk" wrote:

My entire point is that people should take more concern regarding death.
I don't think many citizens take war lightly, and I think most appreciate
that it's a very grisly business.

I pretty much agree with your point about the tastefulness of
this video being released and broadcast - and I don't find any reason
to critique the aircrew either, especially since there appears to be
weaponry being handled by the soldiers near the trucks.

However, don't take it for granted that people are actually
clued-in as to how violent combat is. Take the movie "Titanic" for
example - while a visually impressive narrative, what seems to have
struck most viewers is that it depicted the death and tragedy of the
wreck - and thus showing them something they were too obtuse or
willfully ignorant to consider made it "a great film." People shocked
at the violence of this gun camera footage are simply ignorant of war
and and what it really means, let alone why it is sometimes necessary.




----== Posted via Newsfeed.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeed.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups
---= 19 East/West-Coast Specialized Servers - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

However, don't take it for granted that people are actually
clued-in as to how violent combat is. Take the movie "Titanic" for
example - while a visually impressive narrative, what seems to have
struck most viewers is that it depicted the death and tragedy of the
wreck - and thus showing them something they were too obtuse or
willfully ignorant to consider made it "a great film." People shocked
at the violence of this gun camera footage are simply ignorant of war
and and what it really means, let alone why it is sometimes necessary.

Well, I'm not an expert on the psyche of the average citizen, so I won't
debate this. I think I've made my point about being sensitive (glad to
hear you agree!), and I'll leave with the suggestion that there are perhaps
more sensitive ways of exposing people to the horrors of war (not being a
combat vet myself, I think I'll leave what those ways are to people more
qualified than I). Cheers,

Tony

Clark wrote:
It downloaded fine for me

The avi didn't work for me--Apple said it needed things
to decode it that it didn't have.

Is it just me, or did two of those guys wave something
(cloth, white?) before getting bopped? Check the one
by the tractor.


Jeff

"Jeff Crowell" wrote in message
...
Clark wrote:
It downloaded fine for me

The avi didn't work for me--Apple said it needed things
to decode it that it didn't have.

Is it just me, or did two of those guys wave something
(cloth, white?) before getting bopped? Check the one
by the tractor.


Jeff



It's you. The video I saw is not color so it's impossible to tell what
color objects are. Or do you have a different version?

Jarg

My entire point is that people should take more concern regarding death.
I don't think many citizens take war lightly, and I think most appreciate
that it's a very grisly business.
But if you really want to warn citizens about the perils of war,
wouldn't it be far more effective to show their own soldiers die? Let's get
some footage of American soldiers dying. Preferably some really good stuff
of a wounded soldier screaming in pain, missing a limb, bleeding to death,
and passing on a message of love to his family before dying. Then let's air
that and see how tasteful or necessary showing combat deaths become. I
don't think showing people die is an appropriate educational or propaganda
tool.

Tony


More likely than not it would have the US citizens howling for MORE of
the enemy's blood. And pretty much any news service that focused on
US soldiers with the intent to demoralize the population would
shooting themselves in the head. If you REALLY want war to be gone
then figure out how to make assholes like Saddam go away. Really all
you are saying is you want to scare people into letting tyrants rule
because I can guarantee you that people like Saddam don't give a ****
if their citizens get slaughtered.