How to get IFR Clearance enroute?

Snowbird wrote:

wrote in message ...
Snowbird wrote:

My point was to the chap who seemed to imply, if you have to file
enroute, you didn't brief properly preflight...t'aint true. Mommy
Nature doesn't seem to read the TAFs.

Nope, the chap was giving a setup for how to best guestimate where to have a composite flight plan
convert from VFR to IFR.

Hmmmm....FWIW, if that was your intent, these words:
***begin quote***
If you don't have a pretty good idea of where you are likely to encounter
IMC en route, you haven't done a very good job of flight planning.
***end quote***

don't do a very good job of conveying that intent.

Sounds a lot more to me like you're saying, if you encounter IMC
unexpectedly and need to file a pop-up clearance, you haven't done
a very good job of flight planning.


That is exactly what I am saying.


I disagree, but of course if your intent was just to say something
like "use your preflight briefing to guesstimate where you might
encounter IMC, then file a composite flight plan with the IFR portion
starting where your briefing leads you to believe the clouds will
be", that's one way to handle the problem.

Thanks for improving my intent.



FWIW, I haven't found composite flight plans too useful. Seem
to cause some kind of SNAFU with the ATC computers where the strip
doesn't get sent to the right facility at the right time. I have
better luck just filing separate flight plans with a departure
time delayed by my ETE to the point where I plan to activate the
IFR plan.

And it still doesn't address the issue of how to get an IFR clearance
enroute when you need one.

It doesn't? One of us doesn't understand a composite flight plan.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message hlink.net...
wrote in message ...

In that scheme of events, the processing of G/A flight plans isn't exactly
on the top of the pile. Keep in mind that the airlines and biz jets don't
have flight plan issues.~


I can't recall ever having a bizjet file enroute. I'm certain I've never
had an airliner do it.

A few years ago an inbound Swissair or Lufthansa 747 had to divert to
Quebec city for some reason (not 9-11). It was in the news. I was
flying around Burlington Vt the next day and heard a thick germanic
accent get hold of FSS and start an airfile IFR to JFK. I still
remember him stumbling along with the slash codes and then ... souls
on board 309, fuel, 50 metric tons...and then one of the standard
arrivals to JFK from the north. He was pretty low but its a short hop
for a 747.

(Hankal) wrote in message ...
The first step is to use flight following, which puts you in contact with
ATC right off the bat.

not always possible if ATC is busy with IFR traffic, or the approach/ departure
person is not in the mood. Here in the East we get unable many times.

Bob & Hankal:

Interestingly, my original reason for starting this thread (THANKS
everyone!!) was due to a recent response of "UNABLE" from Flight
Following in the NYC area when trying to file IFR. The resultant
scramble for available options made me rethink not just the textbook
procedures, but also the generally-accepted procedures as well.

Stimbo
Medford, NJ

My eventual goal is to the Bahamas.

Been there, loved it. Chicken to fly back SE since our child was
born. If you fly over 10k you can typically minimize the time
you're out of glide to a few minutes. We did the "out islands"
(Eleuthera, Harbor Island among others) and flew back from Marsh
Harbor (the busiest non-towered airport I ever encountered -- made
me want to kiss the next 10 ATCS I talked to). AOPA has a pretty
good package on it, and Pilot's Guide was pretty helpful.

Cheers,
Sydney

Sydney:

Well.... I guess I picked the "busiest non-towered" airport for my
first Bahamas experience. I'll be staying 5 days at Abaco Beach
Resort at Marsh Harbor in mid-July. Downloaded the AOPA package.
Bought the 2004 Pilot's Guide. Got my Customs sticker. Made plenty
of copies of all forms. I'm psyched! The Pilot's Guide even got me a
good pilot's discount! Paid for the book and more. Plan to fly
10-12K as you said. However, it sure takes a long time for a 172 to
get that high in July. ;^)

Stimbo
Medford, NJ

(Stimbo) wrote in message . com...
Well.... I guess I picked the "busiest non-towered" airport for my
first Bahamas experience. I'll be staying 5 days at Abaco Beach
Resort at Marsh Harbor in mid-July. Downloaded the AOPA package.
Bought the 2004 Pilot's Guide. Got my Customs sticker. Made plenty
of copies of all forms. I'm psyched! The Pilot's Guide even got me a
good pilot's discount! Paid for the book and more. Plan to fly
10-12K as you said. However, it sure takes a long time for a 172 to
get that high in July. ;^)

Cool! Good luck with it...just keep your head on a swivel. I'm told
we were there on the busiest day of the year (Jan 2nd) which can't
have helped. The problem is, there's no taxiway and the FBO/ramp are
close to one end of the runway...if the other rwy is favored by wind,
it's hard to find a long enough break in traffic to back-taxi. Also
hard to fit into the pattern, what with turboprops and bizjets flying
long straight-ins. But hey, it's the Bahamas...no problem, it will
all work out.

Are you going to rent a raft, and do you have lifevests/EPIRB?

Have a blast,
Sydney

wrote in message ...

Not at all. The carriers make sure the skids are greased for their flight
plans to seamlessly and automatically transfer from their host to the FAA
host. Unless someone wants to manually change a route on an air carrier
domestic flight plan, no human is even involved. It all is computed and
sent to the appropriate station and the FAA in a timely manner.


Flight data processing is done exactly the same for the carriers as any
other operator.

Steven P. McNicoll wrote:
wrote in message ...

Not at all. The carriers make sure the skids are greased for their flight
plans to seamlessly and automatically transfer from their host to the FAA
host. Unless someone wants to manually change a route on an air carrier
domestic flight plan, no human is even involved. It all is computed and
sent to the appropriate station and the FAA in a timely manner.



Flight data processing is done exactly the same for the carriers as any
other operator.

The difference, I think, is that the carriers have human dispatchers on the
ground to worry about all of the details for them, including filing the
original or revised flight plans. It's the same as a rich person who can
afford to pay someone to stand in line to get concert tickets -- the ticket
office isn't showing favouritism even though the rich person has it easier
that everyone else.


All the best,


David

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote:



Flight data processing is done exactly the same for the carriers as any
other operator.

That is not the point. It all started about F-I-L-I-N-G.

David Megginson wrote:



The difference, I think, is that the carriers have human dispatchers on the
ground to worry about all of the details for them, including filing the
original or revised flight plans. It's the same as a rich person who can
afford to pay someone to stand in line to get concert tickets -- the ticket
office isn't showing favouritism even though the rich person has it easier
that everyone else.

The dispatcher only checks the computer-generated route and fuel burn, then
issues a dispatch release to the crew. The flight plan itself, unless changed,
is auto-filed by the carrier's flight plan computer and does not go to a FSS or
to a DUAT/DUATS interface.

wrote in message ...

That is not the point. It all started about F-I-L-I-N-G.


Actually, I think it all started with getting an IFR clearance while
enroute. At some point you injected the processing of G/A flight plans into
the discussion. What you've said about flight plan processing is wrong.