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#81
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
"Newps" wrote in message ... Allen wrote: They are also multi-million dollar aircraft engine companies that recommend against LOP operation. (Unless you are running a FADEC system). Yes, suddenly it's OK to run LOP when you give them $10K for their FADEC. That is because you have zero control over the fuel-air mixture, they do. Allen |
#82
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
"Allen" wrote in message . com... "Allen" wrote in message . com... They are also multi-million dollar aircraft engine companies that recommend against LOP operation. (Unless you are running a FADEC system). "Matt Barrow" wrote in message ... Have they ever shown you or anyone else REAL DATA? No? Gee, why not? Yes, like Lycoming who recommends 50ROP. Got any idea what THAT will do to your valves, heads, exhaust system? Oh, and Columbia recommends LOP for it's IO-550'ed 400 model. Well gee, think of the lure that TCM would have to produce engines for aircraft manufacturers if they could tout running lean of peak. They don't. Why not? Warranty costs. Get a clue. What warranty? What warranty costs? You still haven't shown us any DATA, just regurgitating the same BS. What is the lure that TCM and Lycoming have for running ROP? Oh, just engines that last 800 hours...maybe. Sure sell a lot of 'em, won't they. And, hey...if the break, it sure is easy to put a Lycoming into a Bonanza, or a TCM into a current Cessna, right? Get a clue yourself. Gullibility is not attractive in adults. |
#83
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
"Matt Barrow" wrote in message ... "Allen" wrote in message . com... "Allen" wrote in message . com... They are also multi-million dollar aircraft engine companies that recommend against LOP operation. (Unless you are running a FADEC system). "Matt Barrow" wrote in message ... Have they ever shown you or anyone else REAL DATA? No? Gee, why not? Yes, like Lycoming who recommends 50ROP. Got any idea what THAT will do to your valves, heads, exhaust system? Oh, and Columbia recommends LOP for it's IO-550'ed 400 model. Well gee, think of the lure that TCM would have to produce engines for aircraft manufacturers if they could tout running lean of peak. They don't. Why not? Warranty costs. Get a clue. What warranty? What warranty costs? You still haven't shown us any DATA, just regurgitating the same BS. What is the lure that TCM and Lycoming have for running ROP? Oh, just engines that last 800 hours...maybe. Sure sell a lot of 'em, won't they. And, hey...if the break, it sure is easy to put a Lycoming into a Bonanza, or a TCM into a current Cessna, right? Get a clue yourself. Gullibility is not attractive in adults. Let's see, the company that designed and manufactured the engine says don't run lean of peak, the aircraft manufacturer (except for a handful of instances) says don't run lean of peak but Matt Barrow says ok to run lean of peak. Whom to believe, whom to believe. Talk about being gullible, look in the mirror. Don't you think that if running lean of peak would make their engines reach TBO that TCM wouldn't jump on that in an instant? |
#84
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
On 05/12/06 11:21, Allen wrote:
"Matt Barrow" wrote in message ... "Allen" wrote in message . com... "Allen" wrote in message . com... They are also multi-million dollar aircraft engine companies that recommend against LOP operation. (Unless you are running a FADEC system). "Matt Barrow" wrote in message ... Have they ever shown you or anyone else REAL DATA? No? Gee, why not? Yes, like Lycoming who recommends 50ROP. Got any idea what THAT will do to your valves, heads, exhaust system? Oh, and Columbia recommends LOP for it's IO-550'ed 400 model. Well gee, think of the lure that TCM would have to produce engines for aircraft manufacturers if they could tout running lean of peak. They don't. Why not? Warranty costs. Get a clue. What warranty? What warranty costs? You still haven't shown us any DATA, just regurgitating the same BS. What is the lure that TCM and Lycoming have for running ROP? Oh, just engines that last 800 hours...maybe. Sure sell a lot of 'em, won't they. And, hey...if the break, it sure is easy to put a Lycoming into a Bonanza, or a TCM into a current Cessna, right? Get a clue yourself. Gullibility is not attractive in adults. Let's see, the company that designed and manufactured the engine says don't run lean of peak, the aircraft manufacturer (except for a handful of instances) says don't run lean of peak but Matt Barrow says ok to run lean of peak. Whom to believe, whom to believe. Talk about being gullible, look in the mirror. Don't you think that if running lean of peak would make their engines reach TBO that TCM wouldn't jump on that in an instant? Have you read the John Deakin articles on AVWeb? He talks in great length about LOP operations and why the manufacturers (generally) don't recommend it in the POHs. The articles have a lot of data to back up the claims. Regardless of which camp you're in, they're a very good read. Best Regards, |
#85
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
"Mark Hansen" wrote in message ... On 05/12/06 11:21, Allen wrote: "Allen" wrote in message . com... Let's see, the company that designed and manufactured the engine says don't run lean of peak, the aircraft manufacturer (except for a handful of instances) says don't run lean of peak but Matt Barrow says ok to run lean of peak. Whom to believe, whom to believe. Talk about being gullible, look in the mirror. Don't you think that if running lean of peak would make their engines reach TBO that TCM wouldn't jump on that in an instant? Have you read the John Deakin articles on AVWeb? He talks in great length about LOP operations and why the manufacturers (generally) don't recommend it in the POHs. The articles have a lot of data to back up the claims. Regardless of which camp you're in, they're a very good read. Best Regards, Yes. |
#86
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
Lower octane autogas is quite common in mountain states where the
elevation is high. Non turbo-charged car engines have a bigger denotation margin at higher elevation and require less octane. |
#87
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
Maybe you can have him explain how he's doing such a great business in when
maybe 5% of the aircraft are being run LOP? Maybe you can have him explain how that happens when the EGT is symetrical on either side of peak EGT, and the CHT is actually cooler...much cooler? I believe Dawley's exhaust business is benefiting from people running INCORRECTLY lean of peak. The problem isn't necessarily running lean of peak, which most people know should produce cooler (not hotter) EGTs and CHTs. The trouble comes with everyone TRYING to run LOP (or, just plain leanER) to save gas, without the proper instrumentation, technique, or knowledge. Heat kills exhaust systems. Dawley has noticed a spike in their sales since gas prices went through the roof, and they believe it is due to everyone trying to run LOP. I have no reason to doubt them. People are saving a few bucks on gas, but are spending a few hundred on more frequent exhaust system replacement costs. I would imagine this may translate into other repair costs as well. It's the nature of the beast. -- Jay Honeck Iowa City, IA Pathfinder N56993 www.AlexisParkInn.com "Your Aviation Destination" |
#88
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
Allen wrote: "Newps" wrote in message ... Allen wrote: They are also multi-million dollar aircraft engine companies that recommend against LOP operation. (Unless you are running a FADEC system). Yes, suddenly it's OK to run LOP when you give them $10K for their FADEC. That is because you have zero control over the fuel-air mixture, they do. Which isn't their argument now. They flat out say it isn't good for the engine period. |
#89
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
On 12 May 2006 12:00:24 -0700, "M" wrote:
Lower octane autogas is quite common in mountain states where the elevation is high. Non turbo-charged car engines have a bigger denotation margin at higher elevation and require less octane. So that's why "super" mogas in Florida is 93 octane but only 92 octane in the Seattle area. Thanks everyone for the replies (usenet is good for something besides arguing about politics afterall!). Bela P. Havasreti |
#90
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MoGas Tips, Tricks, Concerns, How To
"Newps" wrote in message . .. Allen wrote: "Newps" wrote in message ... Allen wrote: They are also multi-million dollar aircraft engine companies that recommend against LOP operation. (Unless you are running a FADEC system). Yes, suddenly it's OK to run LOP when you give them $10K for their FADEC. That is because you have zero control over the fuel-air mixture, they do. Which isn't their argument now. They flat out say it isn't good for the engine period. That is correct, because you can't control the fuel flow to all cylinders precisely enough. The FADEC system will not allow the engine to run in an condition that will cause damage. If a CHT is too high or EGT too high guess what happens. It INCREASES the fuel flow to that one cylinder to bring it down. It can also retard the ignition on that one cylinder only to correct the condition. It never LEANS further to cool cylinders or EGT temps. |
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