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#71
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US engagement in WW2 was in response to an attack just before a declaration
of war by Japan and another attack just after a declaration of war by Germany. 1)If you read some history,you must know that FDR was very eager for US engagement. 2)If you read history you must also know that that FDR promised the nation not enter war unless attacked (a requirement of domestic politics) A solution to satisfy two contradictionary requirements=The Pearl Harbor trap Pearl Harbor was only one of US (Union) vaccination operations. Short history of US (Union) is full of such operations ,like Ft.Sumter,Maine,Pearl Harbor,9/11 you name it. If Hitler'd won the war , Nazi version of Reichstag fire would be the official version.period. Reading history from the books is by no means enough,one must learn to "read" events themselves. |
#72
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Denyav wrote in message ...
Firstly part of my deleted text, There was no Pearl Harbor warning delivered to the US and the last people to know of one would have been the army intelligence, they were not watching the IJN. The diplomatic cables give no warning on any of the Japanese attacks, only that there was a high probability someone would be attacked. Title: The "Magic" background of Pearl Harbor. Publisher: [Washington] : Dept. of Defence, U.S.A. : for sale by the Supt. of Docs., U.S. Govt. Print. Off., [1978] Description: 5 v. in 8 : maps (on lining paper) ; 27 cm. Pardon me,but but by repeating official stories we cannot learn much more than what we already know. Let us see the claim what the war warning messages contained about Pearl Harbor is deleted, along with the actual messages themselves, since the truth destroys the claim. Now comes the decision to delete the transcripts of the Japanese messages, since the claimed "attack Pearl Harbor" message does not exist the actual record needs to be deleted as well. More deleted text, "It contains the cables, including decode dates, the transcripts of bugged Japan-US phone calls and state department assessments of the various meetings. There is a project at Purdue University to put the above books into electronic form with an index, I am unsure about its current status. See also Author: Komatsu, Keiichiro. Title: Origins of the Pacific War and the importance of 'magic'. Publisher: New York : St. Martin's Press, 1999. Where as part of the work the author looks at the problems with translating Japanese into English and what sort of effects mistranslations had." I suggest reading the messages, they tell you lots, things like the maps of Panama that were so good a courier was to take them to Japan. The ships in harbour messages from the other ports, not just Hawaii and so on. Kimmel and/or his descendants were given chance to defend themselves and to challenge to official version only TWICE,one Navy investigation (There were several Navy investigations but in only one he was allowed to defend himself aganist charges !!!) the other was Congressional and both of them came to conclusion that Kimmel should be exhonorated.period. Try again, the Congressional investigation found against Kimmel. The navy investigation found for him. By the way investigations are about deciding charges, trials are for defending charges. 1) Roberts Commission, 1941/42 found against Kimmel and Short 2) Hart Inquiry in 1944, mainly evidence collecting 3) Pearl Harbor Army Board in 1944, criticised Short, Marshall and Gerow. 4) Naval Court of Inquiry, exonerated Kimmel. 5) Clausen Investigation, 1944/45, mainly evidence gathering. (He wrote a book on it and gives Kimmel and Short the highest rankings in the contributors to the defeat list.) 6) Hewitt Inquiry, 1945, follow on to Naval court, Kimmel denied access, no report published. 7) Clarke Investigation, 1944/45 investigation into claims of documents being destroyed, found this not to be the case. 8) Joint Congressional Committee, 1945/46, Hawaiian commanders guilty of errors of judgement, not dereliction of duty. Kimmels defense were basically "FDR-Stimson-Marshall trio wanted it happen and made it happen by witholding information that was known in Washington and London. Putting words into Kimmel's mouth now I see. Kimmel's defence was that he was deprived of information he needed, mainly messages from the local Japanese consulate and timely warning of the time the last Japanese message was supposed to be presented to the US. There was nothing said about senior leaders wanting the attack to happen. All "official" facts were known to panelists but they still accepted Kimmels version. If one entity becomes evidence collector ,DA,police,judge,jury and executioner the evidence that they present becomes irrelevant. I like this, if the one entity argument is followed then the claimed let off for Kimmel is the rigged result, it was an all Navy affair. The Thurman knew it line appears to be part of the Pearl Harbor movie plot. Presumably the system noticed it was really Dan Aykroyd in disguise with false ID. See for example, http://www.epinions.com/content_68513926788 Military Intelligence Characters of this movie were based on real characters moreover they and/or their relatives were interviewed by the the makers of the movie. I see "based on real characters", and I presume the transcripts of these claimed conversations are available? I presume you have traced the people the pilots and nurse were based on as well? Found the message the plot line was based on as well? Double checked the interviews were with people present, not relatives reporting hearsay 60 years later? Perhaps the fundamental reality that the US Army intelligence people did not work on IJN codes will intrude at some stage. Alternatively Hollywood movies said to be fiction can be taken as the truth, so the US has Luke Skywalker hiding somewhere no doubt. John Wayne won WWII almost single-handed, serving in all branches of the US military? It sums up the "evidence" quite well when a Hollywood entertainment product is the source of truth. Geoffrey Sinclair Remove the nb for email. |
#73
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The diplomatic cables give no warning on any of the Japanese
attacks, only that there was a high probability someone would be attacked. Really? Now two quotas from "recent" law the requesting exonoration of Kimmel: 1)"Numerous investigations following the attack on Pearl Harbor have documented that Adm.Kimmel and Lt.Gen.Short were not provided neccesary and critical intelligence that was available, that was foretold of war with Japan,that warned of imminent attack,and that would have alerted them to prepare for the attack,including such essential communiques as the Pearl Harbor Bomb Plot message of Sep.24,1941 and the message sent from IJ Foreign ministry to Japanase Ambassador in US from Dec 6 to 7 1941,known as fourteen part message". 2)"On July 1997 Adm.Richardson USN (Ret) responded to Dorn report with his own study which confirmed the findings of the Naval Court of Inquiry and and Army Pearl Harbor Board of Investigations and established ,among other facts,that the war effert in 1941 was undermined by a restrictive distrubution policy,and the degree to which the commanders of US forces in Hawai were not alerted about impending attack was directly attributable to the witholding of intelligence from Adm.Kimmel and Gen.Short".) Roberts Commission, 1941/42 found against Kimmel and Short 2) Hart Inquiry in 1944, mainly evidence collecting 3) Pearl Harbor Army Board in 1944, criticised Short, Marshall and Gerow. 4) Naval Court of Inquiry, exonerated Kimmel. 5) Clausen Investigation, 1944/45, mainly evidence gathering. (He wrote a book on it and gives Kimmel and Short the highest rankings in the contributors to the defeat list.) 6) Hewitt Inquiry, 1945, follow on to Naval court, Kimmel denied access, no report published. 7) Clarke Investigation, 1944/45 investigation into claims of documents being destroyed, found this not to be the case. 8) Joint Congressional Committee, 1945/46, Hawaiian commanders guilty of errors of judgement, not dereliction of duty. In in Nr.4 of this list he was allowed to defend himself,Court exhonorated him,BUT findings were kept secret.period. aid to be fiction can be taken as the truth, so the US has Luke Skywalker hiding somewhere no doubt. John Wayne won WWII almost single-handed, serving in all branches of the US military? Dont underestimate Holywood,Its nations premier quasi-governmental PSYOP organization. For more info check out: "Who paid the Piper? . The CIA and cultural Cold War". By Frances Saunders. |
#74
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"Denyav" wrote in message ... US engagement in WW2 was in response to an attack just before a declaration of war by Japan and another attack just after a declaration of war by Germany. 1)If you read some history,you must know that FDR was very eager for US engagement. 2)If you read history you must also know that that FDR promised the nation not enter war unless attacked (a requirement of domestic politics) A solution to satisfy two contradictionary requirements=The Pearl Harbor trap and so you head off into the land of the lunatics. Pearl Harbor was only one of US (Union) vaccination operations. Short history of US (Union) is full of such operations ,like Ft.Sumter,Maine,Pearl Harbor,9/11 you name it. If Hitler'd won the war , Nazi version of Reichstag fire would be the official version.period. Reading history from the books is by no means enough,one must learn to "read" events themselves. Or to put another way, paranoid dip****s like yourself learn to "read" anything that matches your delusions into being "truth". What an "interesting" world you must inhabit, where your totally unsupported opinion = "truth". The other name for that condition is "insanity". |
#75
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#76
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Or better yet,have been there.
Right. |
#77
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and so you head off into the land of the lunatics.
Do you really think that you can supress the truth for forever by resorting to Ad Hominem attacks?Or to put another way, paranoid dip****s like yourself learn to "read" anything that matches your delusions into being "truth". What an "interesting" world you must inhabit, where your totally unsupported opinion = "truth". The other name for that condition is "insanity". Your nervousness is understandable and fully justified. |
#78
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#79
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To simplify it for you: a bill passed by Congress doesn't become law until it
is signed by the President. As George Z. clarified,executive Branch refused and still refuses to sign it and will NEVER sign it (even if the president wants to sign it),which is alone an indicator that much more than exonoration of two individuals are in the line. |
#80
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