General Aviation Dead?

On 16/10/2011 11:14 AM, Mr. V wrote:
And let's not forget how the costs of defending against and paying
large judgments for liability insurance have so increased costs that
manufacturers of affordable planes have been either forced out of
business or are no longer able to produce an affordable, entry level
aircraft for GA.

Goodbye, Piper Cub.


Nice rant. Here's a bit of reality for you:

Private aircraft are only part of general aviation which, to
over-simplify like wikki, is everything unscheduled. To manufacturers of
aircraft, GA is larger because aircraft used for both scheduled and
unscheduled (like the King air or Otter) get lumped in.

the Cessena 150 cost $7K stripped in 1958, when it came out, comparable
aircraft today are around 140K. Both are roughly half the price of a
single detached house.

The piper cub went out of production in 1947.

--
Peter

In article ,
Peter Skelton wrote:

On 16/10/2011 11:14 AM, Mr. V wrote:
And let's not forget how the costs of defending against and paying
large judgments for liability insurance have so increased costs that
manufacturers of affordable planes have been either forced out of
business or are no longer able to produce an affordable, entry level
aircraft for GA.

Goodbye, Piper Cub.


Nice rant. Here's a bit of reality for you:

Private aircraft are only part of general aviation which, to
over-simplify like wikki, is everything unscheduled. To manufacturers of
aircraft, GA is larger because aircraft used for both scheduled and
unscheduled (like the King air or Otter) get lumped in.

the Cessena 150 cost $7K stripped in 1958, when it came out, comparable
aircraft today are around 140K. Both are roughly half the price of a
single detached house.

The piper cub went out of production in 1947.

And it's back in production thanks to a couple different companies, such as
Cubcrafters, running about the price you mentioned above. In the case of
Cubcrafters, several versions, from basic Light Sport to pretty sporty Super Cub
types.

On Sun, 16 Oct 2011 13:56:38 +0200, Mxsmanic wrote:

General Aviation is in decline mostly because of cost. A large part of the
former middle class is gone in the United States. Anyone wishing to fly must
either have a great deal of money (e.g., the top 1%) or must be willing to
make gigantic sacrifices to raise the money for flying. Most people don't want
to fly enough to make gigantic sacrifices, and most people don't make much
money, so GA is in decline.

If a prosperous middle class were to reappear, this trend would probably
reverse.

Another problem is the massive regulation of aviation, which raises the price
and creates many other barriers, surmountable and sometimes insurmountable, to
flying. But this is mostly a constant rather than a variable, so it does not
push GA into decline so much as it holds it at an artificially low level.

Some aspects of GA are doing much better than others. The top 1% is still very
interested in flying around on private jets, for example.

Mxsmanic=Tom=Mu=Chung=Courtney Brown

I win.

Again.

A*

On Sun, 16 Oct 2011 11:05:29 -0700, Steve Hix wrote:

In article ,
Peter Skelton wrote:

On 16/10/2011 11:14 AM, Mr. V wrote:
And let's not forget how the costs of defending against and paying
large judgments for liability insurance have so increased costs that
manufacturers of affordable planes have been either forced out of
business or are no longer able to produce an affordable, entry level
aircraft for GA.

Goodbye, Piper Cub.

Nice rant. Here's a bit of reality for you:

Private aircraft are only part of general aviation which, to
over-simplify like wikki, is everything unscheduled. To manufacturers of
aircraft, GA is larger because aircraft used for both scheduled and
unscheduled (like the King air or Otter) get lumped in.

the Cessena 150 cost $7K stripped in 1958, when it came out, comparable
aircraft today are around 140K. Both are roughly half the price of a
single detached house.

The piper cub went out of production in 1947.

And it's back in production thanks to a couple different companies, such as
Cubcrafters, running about the price you mentioned above. In the case of
Cubcrafters, several versions, from basic Light Sport to pretty sporty Super Cub
types.

I know all this. Mr. V is my sockpuppet so STFU.

I win.

Again.

A*

On 16/10/2011 2:05 PM, Steve Hix wrote:
In ,
Peter wrote:

On 16/10/2011 11:14 AM, Mr. V wrote:
And let's not forget how the costs of defending against and paying
large judgments for liability insurance have so increased costs that
manufacturers of affordable planes have been either forced out of
business or are no longer able to produce an affordable, entry level
aircraft for GA.

Goodbye, Piper Cub.


Nice rant. Here's a bit of reality for you:

Private aircraft are only part of general aviation which, to
over-simplify like wikki, is everything unscheduled. To manufacturers of
aircraft, GA is larger because aircraft used for both scheduled and
unscheduled (like the King air or Otter) get lumped in.

the Cessena 150 cost $7K stripped in 1958, when it came out, comparable
aircraft today are around 140K. Both are roughly half the price of a
single detached house.

The piper cub went out of production in 1947.

And it's back in production thanks to a couple different companies, such as
Cubcrafters, running about the price you mentioned above. In the case of
Cubcrafters, several versions, from basic Light Sport to pretty sporty Super Cub
types.

The Cubcrafters stuff is Super Cub derivative and much updated, a fine
plane but with no commonality with the original cub.

--
Peter

On 10/16/2011 4:55 PM, Peter Skelton wrote:
On 16/10/2011 2:05 PM, Steve Hix wrote:
In ,
Peter wrote:

On 16/10/2011 11:14 AM, Mr. V wrote:
And let's not forget how the costs of defending against and paying
large judgments for liability insurance have so increased costs that
manufacturers of affordable planes have been either forced out of
business or are no longer able to produce an affordable, entry level
aircraft for GA.

Goodbye, Piper Cub.


Nice rant. Here's a bit of reality for you:

Private aircraft are only part of general aviation which, to
over-simplify like wikki, is everything unscheduled. To manufacturers of
aircraft, GA is larger because aircraft used for both scheduled and
unscheduled (like the King air or Otter) get lumped in.

the Cessena 150 cost $7K stripped in 1958, when it came out, comparable
aircraft today are around 140K. Both are roughly half the price of a
single detached house.

The piper cub went out of production in 1947.

And it's back in production thanks to a couple different companies,
such as
Cubcrafters, running about the price you mentioned above. In the case of
Cubcrafters, several versions, from basic Light Sport to pretty sporty
Super Cub
types.

The Cubcrafters stuff is Super Cub derivative and much updated, a fine
plane but with no commonality with the original cub.


Cub clones are also popular with home builders.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

On 10/16/2011 4:55 PM, Peter Skelton wrote:

The Cubcrafters stuff is Super Cub derivative and much updated, a fine
plane but with no commonality with the original cub.

An homage, then, at the least.

On 16/10/2011 9:23 PM, Dan wrote:
On 10/16/2011 4:55 PM, Peter Skelton wrote:
On 16/10/2011 2:05 PM, Steve Hix wrote:
In ,
Peter wrote:

On 16/10/2011 11:14 AM, Mr. V wrote:
And let's not forget how the costs of defending against and paying
large judgments for liability insurance have so increased costs that
manufacturers of affordable planes have been either forced out of
business or are no longer able to produce an affordable, entry level
aircraft for GA.

Goodbye, Piper Cub.


Nice rant. Here's a bit of reality for you:

Private aircraft are only part of general aviation which, to
over-simplify like wikki, is everything unscheduled. To
manufacturers of
aircraft, GA is larger because aircraft used for both scheduled and
unscheduled (like the King air or Otter) get lumped in.

the Cessena 150 cost $7K stripped in 1958, when it came out, comparable
aircraft today are around 140K. Both are roughly half the price of a
single detached house.

The piper cub went out of production in 1947.

And it's back in production thanks to a couple different companies,
such as
Cubcrafters, running about the price you mentioned above. In the case of
Cubcrafters, several versions, from basic Light Sport to pretty sporty
Super Cub
types.

The Cubcrafters stuff is Super Cub derivative and much updated, a fine
plane but with no commonality with the original cub.


Cub clones are also popular with home builders.


Are you aware of any that aren't super cub based?


--
Peter

On 17/10/2011 1:41 AM, Steve Hix wrote:
On 10/16/2011 4:55 PM, Peter Skelton wrote:

The Cubcrafters stuff is Super Cub derivative and much updated, a fine
plane but with no commonality with the original cub.

An homage, then, at the least.

Deserved too.

--
Peter

On 10/17/2011 6:04 AM, Peter Skelton wrote:
On 16/10/2011 9:23 PM, Dan wrote:
On 10/16/2011 4:55 PM, Peter Skelton wrote:
On 16/10/2011 2:05 PM, Steve Hix wrote:
In ,
Peter wrote:

On 16/10/2011 11:14 AM, Mr. V wrote:
And let's not forget how the costs of defending against and paying
large judgments for liability insurance have so increased costs that
manufacturers of affordable planes have been either forced out of
business or are no longer able to produce an affordable, entry level
aircraft for GA.

Goodbye, Piper Cub.


Nice rant. Here's a bit of reality for you:

Private aircraft are only part of general aviation which, to
over-simplify like wikki, is everything unscheduled. To
manufacturers of
aircraft, GA is larger because aircraft used for both scheduled and
unscheduled (like the King air or Otter) get lumped in.

the Cessena 150 cost $7K stripped in 1958, when it came out,
comparable
aircraft today are around 140K. Both are roughly half the price of a
single detached house.

The piper cub went out of production in 1947.

And it's back in production thanks to a couple different companies,
such as
Cubcrafters, running about the price you mentioned above. In the
case of
Cubcrafters, several versions, from basic Light Sport to pretty sporty
Super Cub
types.

The Cubcrafters stuff is Super Cub derivative and much updated, a fine
plane but with no commonality with the original cub.


Cub clones are also popular with home builders.


Are you aware of any that aren't super cub based?


I stopped paying attention a long time ago, but I do remember a
company that produced the super and the original. I don't recall if they
provided full kits or just the fuselage frames.

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired