Logging again

A Private Pilot Airplane Single Engine Land takes training in a
Seaplane. He does not have a Seaplane rating. Can he log the training
time he receives before he obtains his rating as PIC?

"Doug" wrote:

A Private Pilot Airplane Single Engine Land takes training in a
Seaplane. He does not have a Seaplane rating. Can he log the training
time he receives before he obtains his rating as PIC?

Is this a trick question? (Is this related to IFR?)

You need to phrase your question more clearly. There are two ways to parse
that sentence, and the yes/no answer is different depending on how you
intend us to interpret the question.

The first possibility is as Bob already said, obviously yes, you can log the
instruction as dual received prior to obtaining the rating to act as PIC.

The second possibility, also obvious from 61.51(e), is no, you cannot log
the instruction time as PIC because you're not rated for the airplane.

Sorry to be unclear. The question is, can a private rated pilot single
engine land log pre-seaplane checkride training time as PIC? Yes he
logs it as dual instruction received, but can he log it as PIC by
virtue of manipulating the controls? 61.51

Perhaps a
Craig Prouse wrote in message ...
"Doug" wrote:

A Private Pilot Airplane Single Engine Land takes training in a
Seaplane. He does not have a Seaplane rating. Can he log the training
time he receives before he obtains his rating as PIC?

Is this a trick question? (Is this related to IFR?)

You need to phrase your question more clearly. There are two ways to parse
that sentence, and the yes/no answer is different depending on how you
intend us to interpret the question.

The first possibility is as Bob already said, obviously yes, you can log the
instruction as dual received prior to obtaining the rating to act as PIC.

The second possibility, also obvious from 61.51(e), is no, you cannot log
the instruction time as PIC because you're not rated for the airplane.

Sole manipulator of an aircraft for which he is rated (61.51e)...if his
ticket says "Single Engine - Land" he is not rated for seaplanes and cannot
log the time as PIC.

Bob Gardner

"Doug" wrote in message
om...
Sorry to be unclear. The question is, can a private rated pilot single
engine land log pre-seaplane checkride training time as PIC? Yes he
logs it as dual instruction received, but can he log it as PIC by
virtue of manipulating the controls? 61.51

Perhaps a
Craig Prouse wrote in message
...
"Doug" wrote:

A Private Pilot Airplane Single Engine Land takes training in a
Seaplane. He does not have a Seaplane rating. Can he log the training
time he receives before he obtains his rating as PIC?

Is this a trick question? (Is this related to IFR?)

You need to phrase your question more clearly. There are two ways to
parse
that sentence, and the yes/no answer is different depending on how you
intend us to interpret the question.

The first possibility is as Bob already said, obviously yes, you can log
the
instruction as dual received prior to obtaining the rating to act as
PIC.

The second possibility, also obvious from 61.51(e), is no, you cannot
log
the instruction time as PIC because you're not rated for the airplane.

"Bob Gardner" wrote

Sole manipulator of an aircraft for which he is rated
(61.51e)...if his ticket says "Single Engine - Land" he is not
rated for seaplanes and cannot log the time as PIC.

Bob, what about any solo practice time that he is signed-off
to fly prior to the practical test? Seems to me that this
would be treated as any student pilot solo time and be logged
as PIC. I don't think that the original poster specified that
it was dual instruction as opposed to solo instruction.

Bob Moore

I don't want to extrapolate my own seaplane training to the whole wide
world, but no solo time is required and I didn't get any. Considering how
the insurance industry has come down on water operations generally, I wonder
if any float-plane school allows students to solo, and if any owner-student
has a policy permitting flight before the rating is earned.

Bob Gardner

"Robert Moore" wrote in message
. 6...
"Bob Gardner" wrote

Sole manipulator of an aircraft for which he is rated
(61.51e)...if his ticket says "Single Engine - Land" he is not
rated for seaplanes and cannot log the time as PIC.

Bob, what about any solo practice time that he is signed-off
to fly prior to the practical test? Seems to me that this
would be treated as any student pilot solo time and be logged
as PIC. I don't think that the original poster specified that
it was dual instruction as opposed to solo instruction.

Bob Moore

"Doug" wrote in message om...
Sorry to be unclear. The question is, can a private rated pilot single
engine land log pre-seaplane checkride training time as PIC? Yes he
logs it as dual instruction received, but can he log it as PIC by
virtue of manipulating the controls?

No. He must be rated for the aircraft.
He can log PIC time any time he solos the seaplane.