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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
So I've decided to buy a plane (in July of 2007), and I've come to a
dilemma. I learned to fly on a Piper Arrow and very much like that plane, though I haven't flown one in over a year, what I have been flying is a Cessna Cardinal 177 RGII, very nice plane, great handling and a pleasure to fly as well, I live in Hawai'i and shipping plays a big part in inflating the value of planes here... Any plane I buy I will be putting an AVIDYNE avionics twin LCD system into so I don't care about the stock avionics packaged, hence my dilemma is as follows... I can either buy my flight clubs 177 for 50K (without avionics and a high time engine (for 20K more the clubs mechanic will put a brand new engine and prop on). I can buy a Piper Arrow on the mainland and have it shipped to Hawai'i for about 10K (from Cali), and refit that with the AVIDYNE system. or... I can buy a brand new Piper Arrow for a whopping 427,000 (with the AVIDYINE and other options I can't get on the older planes stock). And have peace of mind in a brand new plane that will last a long time without incurring added maintenance expenses. Whichever one I buy I will be doing a "lease-back" to the club to allow other guys to fly it, with a small profit for me (mainly to pay for gas and maintenance on the plane when I fly it) Any advice is appreciated. |
#2
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper ArrowIII (brand new)
or...
I can buy a brand new Piper Arrow for a whopping 427,000 (with the AVIDYINE and other options I can't get on the older planes stock). IF a half million dollar investment is a reasonable possibility, take a look at what you can get, used, for that price. Jose -- There are more ways to skin a cat than there are cats. for Email, make the obvious change in the address. |
#3
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
Jose wrote: or... I can buy a brand new Piper Arrow for a whopping 427,000 (with the AVIDYINE and other options I can't get on the older planes stock). IF a half million dollar investment is a reasonable possibility, take a look at what you can get, used, for that price. Jose -- There are more ways to skin a cat than there are cats. for Email, make the obvious change in the address. I could get a lot, like a Piper 6XT or Saratoga, but the operating costs and insurance costs blow those out of the picture, Hawai'i is a unique flying environment, most flights are island hoppers, 30 minutes to an hour at most, so the gas a Saratoga would burn on the ground would make it very un-economical to operate here. |
#4
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper ArrowIII (brand new)
I could get a lot, like a Piper 6XT or Saratoga, but the operating
costs and insurance costs blow those out of the picture, So get a 300,000 plane and save 200,000 for operating costs. Hawai'i is a unique flying environment, most flights are island hoppers, 30 minutes to an hour at most, so the gas a Saratoga would burn on the ground would make it very un-economical to operate here. I'll help keep it flying for you. Jose -- There are more ways to skin a cat than there are cats. for Email, make the obvious change in the address. |
#5
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
Jose wrote: I could get a lot, like a Piper 6XT or Saratoga, but the operating costs and insurance costs blow those out of the picture, So get a 300,000 plane and save 200,000 for operating costs. Hawai'i is a unique flying environment, most flights are island hoppers, 30 minutes to an hour at most, so the gas a Saratoga would burn on the ground would make it very un-economical to operate here. I'll help keep it flying for you. Jose -- There are more ways to skin a cat than there are cats. for Email, make the obvious change in the address. That would be the dream... but I can't take out a loan for operating costs, I really wish I had 500,000 in the bank though. |
#6
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper ArrowIII (brand new)
So get a 300,000 plane and save 200,000 for operating costs.
That would be the dream... but I can't take out a loan for operating costs, I really wish I had 500,000 in the bank though. It's a nice dream. I like it too. And in Hawaii to boot. If you couldn't do the 200,000 in operating costs on a 300,000 plane (how many years would that take you to use up?), then how could you convince a bank to lend you half a mil for a new Arrow? I'd like to talk to your banker, I have some ideas too. Any plane I buy I will be putting an AVIDYNE avionics twin LCD system into Why that particular one? For Hawaii flying, it seems all you need is the wide screen HRPD. The transition between Cessna and Piper is no big deal (as you know). I've flown the Arrow and the Cutlass (though not the Cardinal). I wouldn't pick based on what you most recently flew. I just wonder why buy if you are going to lease back? (or why lease back if you are going to buy?) Seems you would lose the part of the benefit of owning that you don't get from being part of a club. Consider a partnership. Why is the new Arrow even in the mix? It would be hard for maintanance expenses to reach half a mil for the other airplanes you were considering. As to short island hops, a higher performance plane will take you across the entire chain faster. Where do you intend to go? Jose -- There are more ways to skin a cat than there are cats. for Email, make the obvious change in the address. |
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
Dave S wrote: Having flown the Cardinal RG and the Pa-28R-200, (and liked both).. I would lean towards the cardinal. You have much greater visibility out the Cardinal (and can EASILY lean forward to put your head ahead of the leading edge and visually clear above the wing).. Never tried leaning forward, the positive thing though about the high wing is I can visually confirm gear are locked and down. High wing gives you some rain protection on the ground loading and unloading.. I used to live in Hawaii and remember afternoon showers there regularly on the windward sides of the islands.. Agreed, on Oahu you get a lot of showers that get driven over the mountains and into two VFR arrivals for HNL, one came over so fast one time (and the temperature dropped on me) and a thunderstorm started forming around me, I had to dive the plane between two volcanic craters to 400 feet AGL (one of which tops out at 1208 MSL, the other at about 350 MSL). Large doors that open VERY wide make for easy boarding and loading, and there are two of them. Agreed Cardinal RG strikes me as just a tad faster/sleeker It's slower by 10 knots... but speed wasn't my concern on a primarily sub-cross country flight. The reason the "new Arrow" is in the mix is because I plan on keeping the plane for 40 years at a minimum (thats the plan, might not happen but all signs point to yes) which would mean that a plane with 0 TT will be a lot friendlier to my schedules than a plane thats got 5800 TT (Cardinal RG I'm looking at). |
#9
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
wrote: Cardinal RG strikes me as just a tad faster/sleeker It's slower by 10 knots... Says who? -- Dan C172RG at BFM |
#10
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Cessna Cardinal 177 RG II v. Piper Arrow III (70s) v. Piper Arrow III (brand new)
Dan Luke wrote: wrote: Cardinal RG strikes me as just a tad faster/sleeker It's slower by 10 knots... Says who? -- Dan C172RG at BFM The POH Also most of our club planes are brand new (8 years)... minus the Cardinal and the Chieftains. |
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