Rumsfeld's on Bravery

On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:19:33 -0600, Gene Storey wrote:
CNN reports:

"In the last analysis, he seemed not terribly brave," Rumsfeld said.

About 600 soldiers of the 1st Brigade, 4th Infantry Division, and
special operations forces of Task Force 121 conducted the raid in
Ad Dawr, near a group of ramshackle buildings. They found Saddam
hiding in a 6- to 8-foot-deep hole, equipped with a basic ventilation
system and covered with bricks and dirt.

What's Saddam going to do? Use his pistol against anti-tank weapons
like his sons? He was never considered stupid. I'm beginning to think
Rumsfeld might be talking through his ass again.

Saddam was an assassin in his youth, which presumably took osme
courage. What's the bravest thing Rumsfeld has personally done?

--
"It's easier to find people online who openly support the KKK than
people who openly support the RIAA" -- comment on Wikipedia
(Email: , but first subtract 275 and reverse
the last two letters).

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" wrote in message
.com...
B2431 wrote:
Saddam paid the families of suicide bombers, promised to go down
fighting and called on others to fight to the very end. He caved. If
he was really smart he would have made the U.S. soldiers kill him
thereby making him a martyr.


That reminds me of another brave Middle Eastern leader, Yasser Arafat.
After
whining about the Israelis outside his door and how much he wanted to die
and
become a martyr, he refused to open the door. I'm sure the Israelis would
have
been happy to oblige him.


Actually, Israeli certainly wouldn't have been (though they may have
detained him in some humiliating way). They know very well that killing him
would also kill any attempt for peace for a very long time.

"Yama" wrote in message
...

"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" wrote in message
.com...
B2431 wrote:
Saddam paid the families of suicide bombers, promised to go down
fighting and called on others to fight to the very end. He caved. If
he was really smart he would have made the U.S. soldiers kill him
thereby making him a martyr.


That reminds me of another brave Middle Eastern leader, Yasser Arafat.
After
whining about the Israelis outside his door and how much he wanted to
die and
become a martyr, he refused to open the door. I'm sure the Israelis
would have
been happy to oblige him.


Actually, Israeli certainly wouldn't have been (though they may have
detained him in some humiliating way). They know very well that killing
him
would also kill any attempt for peace for a very long time.

If not the West Bank, where would Christian Arabs go?

Yama wrote:
Actually, Israeli certainly wouldn't have been (though they may have
detained him in some humiliating way). They know very well that
killing him would also kill any attempt for peace for a very long
time.


Frankly, I've come to the conclusion that it doesn't really matter what the
Israelis do. As long as Israel exists, the Arabs will always try to destroy it.



--
Mortimer Schnerd, RN


http://www.mortimerschnerd.com

Emmanuel Gustin wrote:
"Mortimer Schnerd, RN" wrote in message
. com...

Frankly, I've come to the conclusion that it doesn't really matter what the
Israelis do. As long as Israel exists, the Arabs will always try to destroy
it.

The recent "Geneva accords" prove that it is possible for
moderate Israelis and moderate Palestinians to work out
a fair and workable peace deal. What is patently missing
is some way to force the radicals (in Gaza, in Jerusalem,
in Washington, in Damascus) to accept such a deal.

It would probably be acceptable progress if someone could find an effective way
to keep those radicals from killing off their moderate brethren.

George Z.

"phil hunt" wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:19:33 -0600, Gene Storey wrote:
CNN reports:

"In the last analysis, he seemed not terribly brave," Rumsfeld
said.

About 600 soldiers of the 1st Brigade, 4th Infantry Division, and
special operations forces of Task Force 121 conducted the raid in
Ad Dawr, near a group of ramshackle buildings. They found Saddam
hiding in a 6- to 8-foot-deep hole, equipped with a basic
ventilation
system and covered with bricks and dirt.

What's Saddam going to do? Use his pistol against anti-tank weapons
like his sons? He was never considered stupid. I'm beginning to think
Rumsfeld might be talking through his ass again.

Saddam was an assassin in his youth, which presumably took osme
courage. What's the bravest thing Rumsfeld has personally done?

He flew jets onto and off of carriers at one time--have you done that? And
FYI, being an assassin does not necessarily take a lot of guts--we just
finished trying one here in VA, and his accomplice is nearing the end of his
trial. I'd characterize niether of them as being particularly brave.

Brooks

--

On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 01:01:32 GMT, Kevin Brooks wrote:

"phil hunt" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:19:33 -0600, Gene Storey wrote:
CNN reports:

"In the last analysis, he seemed not terribly brave," Rumsfeld
said.

About 600 soldiers of the 1st Brigade, 4th Infantry Division, and
special operations forces of Task Force 121 conducted the raid in
Ad Dawr, near a group of ramshackle buildings. They found Saddam
hiding in a 6- to 8-foot-deep hole, equipped with a basic
ventilation
system and covered with bricks and dirt.

What's Saddam going to do? Use his pistol against anti-tank weapons
like his sons? He was never considered stupid. I'm beginning to think
Rumsfeld might be talking through his ass again.

Saddam was an assassin in his youth, which presumably took osme
courage. What's the bravest thing Rumsfeld has personally done?

He flew jets onto and off of carriers at one time

Anywhere near a war zone?

--have you done that?

Nope. The only thing I've ever flown is a glider.

And
FYI, being an assassin does not necessarily take a lot of guts

I suspect it probably does, in that it does seem to be a rather
dangerous activity, if one gets caught.

--
"It's easier to find people online who openly support the KKK than
people who openly support the RIAA" -- comment on Wikipedia
(Email: , but first subtract 275 and reverse
the last two letters).

(B2431) wrote:

--

Saddam paid the families of suicide bombers, promised to go down fighting and
called on others to fight to the very end. He caved. If he was really smart he
would have made the U.S. soldiers kill him thereby making him a martyr.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired

Does anyone really think that he gives a flying **** about his
country or countrymen?. After he killed how many hundreds of
them?...and of course it would have helped his cause if he had
become a martyr. It's only too bad that all the suicide bombers
couldn't see him for what he is...a muddy dirty rodent hiding in
a rathole...nust make the families of those poor deluded bombers
quite proud to see who their precious children were revering and
laying their lives down for. Miserable *******.

-Gord.

"I'm trying to get as old as I can,
and it must be working 'cause I'm
the oldest now that I've ever been"

"phil hunt" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 01:01:32 GMT, Kevin Brooks
wrote:

"phil hunt" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 15 Dec 2003 02:19:33 -0600, Gene Storey wrote:
CNN reports:

"In the last analysis, he seemed not terribly brave," Rumsfeld
said.

About 600 soldiers of the 1st Brigade, 4th Infantry Division,
and
special operations forces of Task Force 121 conducted the raid
in
Ad Dawr, near a group of ramshackle buildings. They found Saddam
hiding in a 6- to 8-foot-deep hole, equipped with a basic
ventilation
system and covered with bricks and dirt.

What's Saddam going to do? Use his pistol against anti-tank weapons
like his sons? He was never considered stupid. I'm beginning to
think
Rumsfeld might be talking through his ass again.

Saddam was an assassin in his youth, which presumably took osme
courage. What's the bravest thing Rumsfeld has personally done?

He flew jets onto and off of carriers at one time

Anywhere near a war zone?

IIRC his service was just after the Korean Conflict. That said, it takes a
decent pair to land a high performance aircraft on a pitching and rolling
deck IMO.


--have you done that?

Nope. The only thing I've ever flown is a glider.

So you are somewhere beneath Rumsfeld then on this mythical
totem-pole-of-courage?


And
FYI, being an assassin does not necessarily take a lot of guts

I suspect it probably does, in that it does seem to be a rather
dangerous activity, if one gets caught.

Gee, you could say the same thing about the guy who specializes in snatching
purses from little old ladies in the shopping mall parking lot--but I still
don't consider that to be an example of bravery. Stupidity, sure...bravery,
no. Neither does assassination garner the laurels of bravery in most cases
(a few exceptions, like the guys who nailed Heydrich back during WWII). Lee
Harvey oswald was not "brave". John Wilkes Booth was not particularly
"brave". And those two slimeballs we are applying the rules of justice to
right now for shooting women in parking lots, killing men pumping gas into
their cars at service stations, etc., from the ass-end of a specially
configured sedan with a 5.56mm rifle sure as hell don't qualify as brave,
either.

Brooks

"Gord Beaman" wrote in message
...
(B2431) wrote:

--

Saddam paid the families of suicide bombers, promised to go down fighting
and
called on others to fight to the very end. He caved. If he was really
smart he
would have made the U.S. soldiers kill him thereby making him a martyr.

Dan, U. S. Air Force, retired

Does anyone really think that he gives a flying **** about his
country or countrymen?. After he killed how many hundreds of
them?...and of course it would have helped his cause if he had
become a martyr. It's only too bad that all the suicide bombers
couldn't see him for what he is...a muddy dirty rodent hiding in
a rathole...nust make the families of those poor deluded bombers
quite proud to see who their precious children were revering and
laying their lives down for. Miserable *******.

One of the TV networks here reported this evening that he came darned close
to meeting his end in that spiderhole. According to the report, the special
operator on the open end was getting ready to chuck a grenade in the hole
when Saddam stuck his hands up and said, in english no less, "I am Saddam
Hussein. I am the President of Iraq. I want to negotiate." It appears he was
willing to fight to the death...the death of his last misguided follower,
that is. All of his past promises to go down fighting evaporated when it
came time to place himself in the suicidal situation he had sent so many
others into with such gusto and false bravado. Miserable ******* indeed.

Brooks


-Gord.

"I'm trying to get as old as I can,
and it must be working 'cause I'm
the oldest now that I've ever been"