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#91
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Cherokee 235 vs Trinidad vs Comanche
"Newps" wrote in message . .. Beech just announced they are lowering prices on the Bonanza and Baron. Now a typically outfitted glass panel Bo has a suggested retail of $574K down from $667K. The Baron goes from $1.186 million to $1.046 million. Just as I (more or less) predicted in the thread about the Raytheon buyout. |
#92
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Cherokee 235 vs Trinidad vs Comanche
Douglas Paterson wrote:
1) The throw-over yoke. That's just downright weird--and, especially my first time out, I'm deliberately avoiding weird. "Baby steps." Not to worry! http://www.cygnet.aero/p_dualyoke.html |
#93
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Cherokee 235 vs Trinidad vs Comanche
We are happy owners of a 150 hp Warrior...
But with recently installed Mattison VG's and gap seals... SERIOUS change in takeoff performance!.. POH is no good any more. Need to nail down an all new set of numbers.. ....Need a new page in the book..... Been fun... Dave On 15 Jan 2007 20:31:08 -0800, "Jay Honeck" wrote: And here's a comparison for you. Have Jay take his plane out with two seats in and 40 gallons. At a density altitude of 5500 my 182 would get off the ground in 450 feet, it would land in the same distance. If you can't or don't want to remove the rear seats then reduce the fuel load accordingly. With the back seats removed (they pop out in seconds, without tools -- a *very* handy option) and less than half tanks, I'd be hanging on the prop in about the same distance. Almost all of my flights are with four people, and full tanks. However, I clearly remember test-flying the plane with my 135-pound instructor, and about 25 gallons on board. 'Bout scared the crap outta myself, seeing only sky and an impossible deck angle on departure. I was whooping and hollering like an Indian, while my CFI just sat there laughing... Coming from a 150 horse Warrior, I thought I was flying a rocketship... ;-) |
#94
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Cherokee 235 vs Trinidad vs Comanche
But they look cool!
Might as well look cool and go fast. I didn't realize that Mooneys were being considered. --- Ken Reed M20M, N9124X -- Ken Reed M20M, N9124X |
#95
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Cherokee 235 vs Trinidad vs Comanche
"Newps" wrote in message
. .. Douglas Paterson wrote: The further I get in this process, the more I'm leaning away from the Comanche and toward the Trinidad You said the Bonanza was not the right plane for you but the Trinidad is? Holy Cow. I don't understand this comment. You're obviously a Bonanza fan, and I'm starting to gather you don't care for Trinidads--but am I missing something objective here? -- Doug "Where am I to go/Now that I've gone too far?" -- Golden Earring, "Twilight Zone" (my email is spam-proofed; read the address and make the appropriate change to contact me) |
#96
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Cherokee 235 vs Trinidad vs Comanche
Consolidating my replies to several folks who responded on this
sub-thread--Dave's reply pretty much covered them all, so it's convenient to do so. "dave" wrote in message news Doug, Don't throw out the bonanza for the wrong reasons. 1 - you can have a dual yoke or throw over yoke. No big deal. The throw over yoke very clever and extremely well made as is everything else in a Bonanza. If you don't want to throw it over you don't have to. It's like flying with any other other yoke but you'll be surprised at how smooth and robust the controls are. I know every description I've read of Bonanzas have the theme of "well built" and "solid"--no argument there. I'm also aware of the adapters (right term?) that convert it to a dual-yoke system--but, that still leaves a huge bar (two, now) out in front of the panel. Big deal? Probably not, but it is a detractor (to me). 2 - I've heard this before about reversed controls. In my Bonanza there's really nothing that's odd or out of place so I'm not sure what it means. The flaps, gear, throttle, mixture and prop controls are all clearly identified. My citabria had the throttle on the left and the stick in my right hand. Now it's yoke in the left hand and throttle in the right hand as it is in most side by side airplanes. Here again I'm going on what I've read. "Clearly identified" isn't the point--my understanding is that both the engine controls and the flap/gear handles are reversed from a standard setup. 3 - Expensive to buy? I can't imagine getting a decent tb20 for less than 150-200k. For that money you'll get a fantastic Bonanza. Costly to maintain. I'm really not there yet. So far I've bought two rubber flap bumpers for $2.70 each and had a attitude indicator rebuilt for $400.00. You point is a good one but remember, no matter what parts cost - labor is labor. Also keep in mind that much of the maintenance will be stuff that is common not Beech specific-engine, radio, instruments, tires, brakes, fluids, paint, upholstery, wire, lights, etc. Not true. Later models, sure, but late-80s TB-20s are in the $120Ks--I even saw a '92 model (w/ a GNS 530!) for $119.9K (it had already sold--I suspect it had that Lycoming cam subject to the SB in it as a driver of the price). Compared to similar vintage Bos, that's a lot less money, no? Understood on the mx issues. Like most things, you should try one for yourself and see what you think. It sounds like you've been given advice from folks that don't own or don't like Bonanzas. I never thought I'd own one but I'm glad I let my friends talk me into at least flying one before I bought something else. True again. Of course, if I could fly everything that's out there, I'd never get around to buying.... I've never seen a Bo for rent--could be I haven't looked hard enough (which is true), but they're hardly an FBO staple.... Regardless of the airplane you buy, one thing that was a real bonus for me was to hire a Bonanza expert. He helped me search for planes and spoke to the sellers and their mechanics on my behalf. I guess mechanics speak a special language. He's an AP/IA so he was able to get better information from other mechanics than I could have. Finally when we had what we thought was a winner. He did the pre-buy inspection for me. Now THAT is probably the most key piece of advice yet! How did you go about finding the "expert"? What were his qualifications (AP/IA--but, did you look for someone w/ XXX experience working on Bos, or what)? I'm obviously going to want to have a pre-buy done--I imagine that you paid more than you would have for "just" a pre-buy, but less than you would have for a pre-buy plus another person acting as your search agent.... Intriguing idea, I think I want to use it! I enjoyed the search for my planes I hope you do too. Best of luck. Dave M35 Enjoying it, yes--but, also frustrated. Every time I feel like I've learned enough to make a decision, another data point comes in that skews the result! I certainly appreciate everyone's help and the overall discussion, though.... Thanks! Doug -- Doug "Where am I to go/Now that I've gone too far?" -- Golden Earring, "Twilight Zone" (my email is spam-proofed; read the address and make the appropriate change to contact me) |
#97
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Cherokee 235 vs Trinidad vs Comanche
"Newps" wrote in message
... The problem you're going to have with the Trinidad is parts. Nobody has them in stock, everything always has to be ordered. That takes time and expense. Plus they aren't very fast for what you're going to pay. Please help me understand this. Are you saying that the Bo (for example) has parts lying in stock at just about every FBO? I find that hard to believe. The Socata folks are committed (they say) to a three-day maximum delivery for parts not in stock (at their service centers--nearest to me is Phoenix), with lots of stuff in stock "in the system" [source: http://www.socata.org/html/upload.as...ir craft.pdf]. Is this significantly sub-standard to the situation with Beech parts? Very fast vs $$? I don't follow. The Trins cruise around 160ktas at 12-14gph; the highest numbers I've seen for the Bo is 168ktas at the same fuel burn. Slower (marginally), yes. Do I have bad numbers, or have I missed something? Thanks! -- Doug "Where am I to go/Now that I've gone too far?" -- Golden Earring, "Twilight Zone" (my email is spam-proofed; read the address and make the appropriate change to contact me) |
#98
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Cherokee 235 vs Trinidad vs Comanche
"Ken Reed" wrote in message
... But they look cool! Might as well look cool and go fast. I didn't realize that Mooneys were being considered. Rim shot! Well done.... Seriously, I did consider Mooneys. Right up until I climbed into one and felt like I was in a mummy bag.... Great airplanes, just too small for me.... -- Doug "Where am I to go/Now that I've gone too far?" -- Golden Earring, "Twilight Zone" (my email is spam-proofed; read the address and make the appropriate change to contact me) |
#99
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Cherokee 235 vs Trinidad vs Comanche
"Montblack" wrote in message
... What is your acquisition cap? $80K? $100K $150K? $200K? Not really written in stone, but.... I started w/ $100K; I've since revised that to $150K (with an obvious desire to stay lower rather than higher!!). The reason I ask is, how about something brand new ...with two other partners? Love the idea. Problem is, I move frequently--any partnership I got into would have to dissolve or buy me out in a matter of a couple of years. Primarily for that reason, I discarded the partnership idea early on. Thanks for the thought, though! -- Doug "Where am I to go/Now that I've gone too far?" -- Golden Earring, "Twilight Zone" (my email is spam-proofed; read the address and make the appropriate change to contact me) |
#100
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Cherokee 235 vs Trinidad vs Comanche
I think they are ugly. I like the looks of Jays Pathfinder better than
a Trinidad. :-) Although our Pathfinder is a very fine looking plane, I'd have to give the styling edge to the Trinidad. But I wouldn't trade Atlas for one, even up. -- Jay Honeck Iowa City, IA Pathfinder N56993 www.AlexisParkInn.com "Your Aviation Destination" |
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