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Training for my CFII - Got a couple questions
What is the best course of action I should take to get my CFII?
I am currently a CFI at a 141 school. My instrument skills are weak (I only have 10 hours actual, 60 simulated) and rarely fly instruments because all my students are primary. I need to get my knowledge test done, and I want to get my CFII as soon as I can. What steps should I take to get it done? Thanks in advance |
#2
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My instrument skills are weak [...] I want to get my CFII as soon as I can. What steps should I take to get it done? I don't know the answer to the question you are asking. But I am prompted to ask why you want to be a CFII if your instrument skills are weak. Why do you want to teach something you don't know? I'd say (opinion only) your first task is to get good instrument skills, and learn more about weather flying. Jose -- (for Email, make the obvious changes in my address) |
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#4
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Thanks
I'll hit the sim today On 30 Apr 2004 12:33:58 GMT, Andrew Sarangan wrote: (Teacherjh) wrote in : My instrument skills are weak [...] I want to get my CFII as soon as I can. What steps should I take to get it done? I don't know the answer to the question you are asking. But I am prompted to ask why you want to be a CFII if your instrument skills are weak. Why do you want to teach something you don't know? I'd say (opinion only) your first task is to get good instrument skills, and learn more about weather flying. Jose I would concur with that. If your instrument skills are weak, what exactly will you be teaching, not to mention that you will also have difficulty with the CFII checkride. The written test is a no brainer. The CFII written is exactly the same as the IR written. If you are having difficulty with the written, then you have some serious work to do. Not only should you be able to effortlessly pass the written, you should be able to score near 100% since this is really the second time around. The flying portion requires practice and experience. Look for IMC days, rent an airplane and fly around to get some actual experience and dealing with ATC. Proficiency in IFR requires a lot more knowledge and experience than what a typical IR checkride demands. In order to give effective instruction, you must have that experience. |
#5
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BoDEAN wrote:
Thanks I'll hit the sim today With all due respect, I think this was the wrong answer. Hitting the sim will probably help you pass the CFI-I checkride, but it won't do much towards making you a better instrument pilot, or a better instrument instructor. When I took my CFI-I ride, I did a bunch of sim work too. I hadn't really flown any NDB approaches since my initial instrument training, and was having trouble getting them back up to snuff. It was a lot cheaper to buy a copy of X-plane and fly a bunch of approaches at my desk than to bore holes in the sky re-learning how an ADF works. But, flying good approaches in the sim doesn't make you a good instrument pilot, and being a good instrument pilot is essential to being a good instrument instructor. A fair amount of instructing involves letting the student make mistakes, both in terms of procedures, and in judgement. With instruments, the limits of how big a mistake you can let them make are smaller, and the consequences of going too far much worse than VFR. But, you still need to let them explore the edges of envelope. And to do that, you need to know what's safe w/r/t getting killed, what's safe w/r/t getting ATC ****ed at you, and what's safe w/r/t you being able to recover from the mess you let your student dig themselves into. Another thing I've discovered about instructing (especially in busy airspace like around New York), is that a fair part of your job is being able to anticipate what ATC will let you do and what they won't. Some of my biggest failures have been flights where I came up with a lesson plan only to discover that ATC denied us the clearances required to execute the plan. The problem is, unless you're out there flying in the system, in weather, experiencing and coping with real-life problems yourself, you won't have the experience to pass on to your students, and you won't have the judgement to know where to draw the line on making mistakes. You won't get that in a sim. |
#6
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"Roy Smith" wrote in message ... BoDEAN wrote: Another thing I've discovered about instructing (especially in busy airspace like around New York), is that a fair part of your job is being able to anticipate what ATC will let you do and what they won't. Some of my biggest failures have been flights where I came up with a lesson plan only to discover that ATC denied us the clearances required to execute the plan. Ditto here... I fly on the other side of NY from Roy and spend a lot of time with my students teaching how much difference there is between the book world and the real world... It's like chess... Always be thinking ahead... As one of my buddies always asks his instrument students... What are the two most important things in instrument flying??? (you'd really be suprised at the variety of things you get back)... The next 2 things... John Price CFII/AGI/IGI http://home.att.net/~jm.price |
#7
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BoDEAN wrote
What is the best course of action I should take to get my CFII? I am currently a CFI at a 141 school. My instrument skills are weak (I only have 10 hours actual, 60 simulated) and rarely fly instruments because all my students are primary. I need to get my knowledge test done, and I want to get my CFII as soon as I can. What steps should I take to get it done? Start by reading the other replies (from Andrew and Roy) - I won't repeat what they covered, but I agree with every word they said. I also understand that you probably have financial constraints that preclude you from renting/buying an airplane and acquiring real in-the-system and in-the-weather experience. I have a suggestion. Seek out pilot-owners who have real instrument airplanes and actually fly IFR in IMC on a regular basis, and ask if you can ride along. Offer to act as safety pilot, sign off BFR's (and IPC's once you get your CFII), wash the airplane, etc. Carefully observe and ask questions - you may be flying with a private pilot, but if he's the one who flies IFR regularly and you're the one with 10 hours of actual, then you are the student and he's the instructor - and getting your CFII won't change that. To quote Yogi Berra, "Sometimes you can observe a lot by watching." If you do a good job of observing, you will be able to answer the following questions: How does the pilot negotiate with ATC? What are normal deviations in attitude when the pilot is focused? How about when he's looking up charts and copying clearances? How does the pilot deal with bad weather? Bad vectors? Being a CFII will give you the authority to give dual instruction required for the instrument rating; you ALREADY have the authority to give dual instruction in IMC. Approach this carefully, and don't start by doing it with an instrument student. Ideally, start by sitting in the right seat and observing a proficient instrument pilot in IMC. Then move up to giving instruction in IMC to someone who is already a proficient instrument pilot, and just needs an aircraft checkout or IPC. In these situations you can't do much damage. Or you can ignore all of this, hit the sim, squeak out a checkride, and teach instruments strictly under the hood to career-track students who will never fly any significant amount of IMC until they hit the right seat of a commuter. Your call. Michael |
#8
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Michael wrote in message om... BoDEAN wrote Being a CFII will give you the authority to give dual instruction required for the instrument rating; you ALREADY have the authority to give dual instruction in IMC. True, as long as it's not training for an instrument rating per 61.195(a)(3) So you could take your student pilot into IMC as part of the 3 hours of instrument training; just not an instrument student. Approach this carefully, and don't start by doing it with an instrument student. Ideally, start by sitting in the right seat and observing a proficient instrument pilot in IMC. Then move up to giving instruction in IMC to someone who is already a proficient instrument pilot, and just needs an aircraft checkout or IPC. In these situations you can't do much damage. My recollection is that you need a CFII to give an IPC (or an IGI if you give it in a sim). As I recall when I looked it up on Lynch some time ago, a CFI cannot give IPC's. Max T, MCFI |
#9
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An IGI cannot give an IPC, only the training for one. He cannot sign
one off. (FAR 61.215, training and endorsements vs. 61.193 (g), training only) An IGI can only give the endorsement for an instrument knowlege test and none other. He can give the training, however for an IPC. On Fri, 30 Apr 2004 23:08:36 GMT, "Max T, CFI" wrote: Michael wrote in message om... BoDEAN wrote Being a CFII will give you the authority to give dual instruction required for the instrument rating; you ALREADY have the authority to give dual instruction in IMC. True, as long as it's not training for an instrument rating per 61.195(a)(3) So you could take your student pilot into IMC as part of the 3 hours of instrument training; just not an instrument student. Approach this carefully, and don't start by doing it with an instrument student. Ideally, start by sitting in the right seat and observing a proficient instrument pilot in IMC. Then move up to giving instruction in IMC to someone who is already a proficient instrument pilot, and just needs an aircraft checkout or IPC. In these situations you can't do much damage. My recollection is that you need a CFII to give an IPC (or an IGI if you give it in a sim). As I recall when I looked it up on Lynch some time ago, a CFI cannot give IPC's. Max T, MCFI |
#10
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A key point for BoDEAN is that a CFI is not an "authorized instructor"
and hence could not give an IPC when it was suggested to him Then move up to giving instruction in IMC to someone who is already a proficient instrument pilot, and just needs an aircraft checkout or IPC" Regarding an IGI giving an IPC, I've posted the latest text from Lynch below. It's certainly convoluted. It sounds like he previously said an IGI "can conduct the IPC," (which is what I recalled) but now is saying they can "perform the training for an IPC," but not the check itself, since IGI's aren't listed in 61.215(c)(2) Max T, MCFI QUESTION: Can an personal computer aviation training device (PCATD) be used for the instrument proficiency check? ANSWER: Ref. § 61.57(d)(1): No. {Q&A-94} QUESTION: In § 61.57 of the "Frequently Asked Questions of parts 61& 141" the question is asked whether an IGI can conduct the proficiency check required in an approved ground training device. The answer given is yes. However, I have a letter from AFS 840 signed by Michael Sacrey stating that "Only a certificated instrument flight instructor may conduct the instrument competency check, regardless of whether given in a ground training device, an aircraft simulator, or in an aircraft." Which interpretation is the correct one? ANSWER: Ref. § 61.215(c)(2). Yes, an IGI can perform training in a flight simulator or flight training device ". . . for an instrument proficiency check." It has been brought to my attention that my earlier answer on Question 2 may have confused training vs. checking. Only those persons identified in § 61.57(d)(2) can GIVE the instrument proficiency check. {Q&A-104} Bill Zaleski wrote in message ... An IGI cannot give an IPC, only the training for one. He cannot sign one off. (FAR 61.215, training and endorsements vs. 61.193 (g), training only) An IGI can only give the endorsement for an instrument knowlege test and none other. He can give the training, however for an IPC. |
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