OSH: Icon A5 presentation

In article jYnlk.227768$TT4.225382@attbi_s22,
Jay Honeck wrote:
the ICON A5

One for the marketing department:

At OSH they hired a sky-writer to write "ICON A5" over the Airventure
grounds. It looked great -- but everyone (myself included) thought that the
pilot was simply misspelling "ICOM A5" -- which is one of ICOM's hand-held
models.

When I saw the subject of the thread, I mis-read it in the same
way, and it was a few messages in before I figured out it was about
a plane and not a radio.

John
--
John Clear - http://www.clear-prop.org/

In article ,
Jay Maynard wrote:

It suffers from a 2008 version of the 1940s tendency to try to make airplane
panels look like automobile dashboards. It didn't work then, and it doesn't
work now. Airplanes are not cars, and shouldn't try to act like them.

That was exactly my thought when I saw it.

On 2008-08-03, Blueskies wrote:
LSAs can be night & IFR equipped, and if so, then a properly rated pilot
can fly it IMC at night...

As I commented earlier in the thread, mine is fully IFR certified. The
placard on the panel says "Day Night VFR or IFR in Non Icing Conditions".
There's a whole section in the POH on IFR operations.

As it happens, there are exactly two SLSAs that do not have a limitation in
the POH prohibiting IFR operations: the Tecnam Bravo/Sierra and the AMD
Zodiac.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (got it!)

On 2008-08-03, Peter Dohm wrote:
Interesting question. My best guess is that it would not be permitted to
fly under IFR at night; because the Rotax 912 is not certified to a standard
compatible with night IFR. Day IFR is another issue, and one on which I can
not even guess.

The Rotax 912S is fully FAR 33 certificated. It's only the ULS that isn't
(and has a limitation for day VFR only in its manual).

Not all LSAs use the Rotax, however. That's one big reason I went with the
Zodiac: it uses a bog standard O-200-A.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (got it!)

"Jay Maynard" wrote in message
...
On 2008-08-03, Blueskies wrote:
LSAs can be night & IFR equipped, and if so, then a properly rated pilot
can fly it IMC at night...

As I commented earlier in the thread, mine is fully IFR certified. The
placard on the panel says "Day Night VFR or IFR in Non Icing Conditions".
There's a whole section in the POH on IFR operations.

As it happens, there are exactly two SLSAs that do not have a limitation
in
the POH prohibiting IFR operations: the Tecnam Bravo/Sierra and the AMD
Zodiac.

You have a Rotax engine, right?

How can it be certified for what you have said, if the engine is not
certified for those conditions?

That is still missing the point of my question, though.

How can an airplane that is certificated by LSA, (a certification process
that is day VFR only) be allowed to be equal with those that went through
the full part 23 process?

I would think that if an airplane manufacturer wanted to fly in conditions
past the limitations of the LSA, they would be required to go through the
part 23 process. If they were to get the full approval for part 23, and it
met all of the qualifications for LSA, it then (of course) be allowed to be
flown as a LSA, by a LS pilot.

See what I mean? It seems like a loop-hole that should not exist. I am all
for less regulations and restrictions, but this is one area I must question
as whether it is fair to all, or not.

"Jay Maynard" wrote in message
...
On 2008-08-03, Peter Dohm wrote:
Interesting question. My best guess is that it would not be permitted to
fly under IFR at night; because the Rotax 912 is not certified to a
standard
compatible with night IFR. Day IFR is another issue, and one on which I
can
not even guess.

The Rotax 912S is fully FAR 33 certificated. It's only the ULS that isn't
(and has a limitation for day VFR only in its manual).

Not all LSAs use the Rotax, however. That's one big reason I went with the
Zodiac: it uses a bog standard O-200-A.

OK, that answers one question of my previous post. I still wonder how the
LSA process can give higher approval than the limitations of said
classification.
--
Jim in NC

"Jay Maynard" wrote

Not all LSAs use the Rotax, however. That's one big reason I went with the
Zodiac: it uses a bog standard O-200-A.

By the way, good choice with not using a Rotax.

I have not, nor will I ever get into the air behind a Rotax.

Many will say they are a wonderful, reliable engine. Perhaps, but my gut is
that I do not trust them with my life.

My personal choice. It is not likely to change.

Why? The company makes too much other junk. Not 4-cycles, but junk just
the same.
--
Jim in NC

"Bob Noel" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"Peter Dohm" wrote:

My best guess is that it would not be permitted to
fly under IFR at night; because the Rotax 912 is not certified to a
standard
compatible with night IFR.

huh? What's the night IFR standard for a certified engine?

--
Bob Noel
(goodness, please trim replies!!!)

I couldn't remember it at the time of my post, but someone else did--part
33. And IIRC, it's part 35 for the prop.

Peter
(OK, but this was short enough to avoid the scissors)

"Morgans" wrote in message
...


Yes, and avoid spending all of the startup (investment) money before the
project becomes self sustaining.

I don't know about everyone else, but it about breaks my heart to see good
people bring a project (like designing and marketing an airplane or jet)
almost to the finish line, then run out of money. Then, the choice is to
sell the company and lose control, and see your dream brought to
completion by someone else with the money to finish up the last 10% of the
job, or give up.

Sad, but it seems to happen far too often in aviation.
--
Jim in NC
I believe that it happens in everything. We are interested in aviation, so
we are more aware of the problem in aviation. The certification process may
make the initial startup a little worse, but the higher threshold of entry
should also make the next phase a little easier.

Peter

On 2008-08-04, Morgans wrote:
You have a Rotax engine, right?

No. The AMD Zodiac uses an O-200-A, fully certificated, just like the one
you'll find on the average 150.

How can an airplane that is certificated by LSA, (a certification process
that is day VFR only) be allowed to be equal with those that went through
the full part 23 process?

Because the LSA certification rule says that the aircraft may be used for
anything that's in the POH. Check out the AOPA's statement on the subject
at http://www.aopa.org/whatsnew/regulat....html#aircraft ...and
the EAA says the same thing.
--
Jay Maynard, K5ZC http://www.conmicro.com
http://jmaynard.livejournal.com http://www.tronguy.net
Fairmont, MN (FRM) (Yes, that's me!)
AMD Zodiac CH601XLi N55ZC (got it!)