Sad day for Mxsmanic

You are both flying a desk, dumb ass.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Now this is just childish.

Most of this group argue that a simmer has NO knowledge whatsoever of
what occurs inside a real aircraft because he has never set foot
inside that model for which he is 'familiar' with.
When evidence is placed in front of you that a REAL 747-400 has an
audible alarm on autopilot disengagement you still throw insults back
saying 'you are wrong'.

Going back to the original comments on whether a novice could land
this aircraft on an emergency under guidance this entire video clip
clearly shows all that is required. ATC are giving the pilot heading,
speed and altitude commands and he is adjusting the MCP. He is NOT
flying the aircraft, the autopilot is and with adequate instruction
others could adjust the appropriate knobs too as the are ALL on the
Mode Control Panel (as clearly demonstrated on this clip). The AP is
controlling the throttles and elevator trim etc to maintain the course
etc as entered on the MCP. The pilot COULD have done a full autoland
on runway 28L as LAND3, Rollout and Flare were all armed and confirmed
by the pilot. By switching on the autobrakes the autopilot and
autothrottle system would have cut the throttles at 50ft, flared the
aircraft and autobraked whilst keeping the aircraft on the centreline
without the pilot even touching the controls or manual braking. If
you dont believe it go ask a 747-400 captain.

Ibby

On Mar 9, 8:02*pm, george wrote:
On Mar 10, 8:51*am, Ibby wrote:

*It doesnt matter how I know this either
via the sim, reading or videos, the simple fact is Boeing have an
alarm but because an honest and accurate comment about a 747-400 comes
from either MX or myself or millions of other sim users (even real
pilots who do both) it means ****all on this group

Yup. You finally twigged it.
Return at all haste to your 'sim' group and leave we poor real time
pilots to wallow in reality.

So George why not go ask a REAL 747-400 pilot to confirm all that has
been said here and what is 'reality'. A 747-400 HAS an alarm, plain
simple, to argue against that you're bloody stupid. Even if I wasn't
a simmer I know a real one has it on it's systems

You are really stuck on this warning bell thing. Have you had your hearing
tested lately?

Because that is one issue you lot said directly to myself was a LIE.
You lot made out that EVERYTHING we say is utter CRAP. I originally
questioned how I couldn't understand how the russian pilot failed to
notice the AP being switched off as I know from both the sim and
videos on real flightdecks that the Boeing 747 and 737's have them but
according to you lot THEY DONT because the 'desk pilot' says so. But
do I get an educated response saying 'well as we are only GA pilots
and also haven't physically flown a 747 you may be correct but this
particular Russian model didnt have an alarm' we just get a childish
'f@=k you'

Ibby

You grow up dumb ass. Just exactly like MX, in your ignorance and
inexperience you missed the whole point.

So how can someone who HAS physically controlled a real aircraft (me)
be compared to MX who HASN'T controlled a real aircraft????????????

The Sim isn't perfect but it DOES teach (especially with commercial
addons) elements of flight and navigation. It helped me understand
what was required on my first flight in a Cessna 152.
Infact the REAL aircraft was EASIER to roll, pitch and trim than the
sim. If my comments are so stupid about landing an airliner then YOU
describe to ME the process involved in doing so!! Why do airports
have ILS's, why do they have DME etc, for navigation and automated
flight. Why does the FMC have a full SID STAR database if the pilot
was just going to hand fly them based on his charts? Do commercial
airlines use the autopilot - yes they do from 500ft after takeoff to
potential touchdown. An airline pilot would NEVER hand fly an entire
route from takeoff, cruise to landing as per your assumptions. Doing
so WOULD be very difficult and I'd freely give credit to a pilot that
could do it but they use all systems available to ease their workload
- FACT. Ask a REAL airline pilot, not a GA pilot. Infact ask them
too, if you have an autopilot on your aircraft - DO you use it and why
do you use it if not to make the flight easier? You hardly use it 'for
the challenge'

Ibby

Relevance? (we're (you *were) talking autolands, not approaches or even
cruise flight).

--
Duncan- Hide quoted text -

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This all stems from earlier posts here on whether a NOVICE pilot
during an emergency could control an aircraft and successfully land
it.
The aircraft on this video did have an assigned STAR but has been
vectored to intercept the ILS localiser. The P.I.C. is NOT flying the
747, he is simply adjusting the MCP knobs and switches on the
glareshield

During an emergency a novice could do the exact same under the
guidance of ATC. With autoland enabled and a certified runway he
wouldnt have to touch the yoke or throttle at all. Other pilots here
believe an airliner MUST be handflown on finals just because their
automation systems do not offer the same capablilities of the
747-400. Yes some carriers request pilots to disengage the autopilot
and autothottle system on final and hand fly the remaining 500 feet
descent but it doesn't have to be done

On Mar 9, 12:50*pm, "Maxwell" #$$9#@%%%.^^^ wrote:
"Ibby" wrote in message news:02f02df5-278d-42e2-b0ee-

What a moron. Go back to the sim group gamer.

Maxwell

What aircraft do you personally fly??????????????
Does it have an autopilot???????????????
Can it capture an ILS Localiser?????????????
Can it capture an ILS Glideslope and maintain a constant descent
rate???????????????
Can it control your throttle/thrust to maintain a set
airspeed????????????????????????????????

I would assume it can't if it's a GA aircraft which means you manually
fly on finals just like I would expect to do in a similar sized plane.

Can a 747-400, 737NG, 767 do all the above - YES THEY CAN. This has
nothing to do with simming. They DO have these automated facilities
and they ARE bloody used.
How the hell is stating that they do use these systems be 'moronic' -
if they are NOT used then WHY HAVE THEM at the majority of controlled
airports?????????

Ibby

george writes:

Return at all haste to your 'sim' group and leave we poor real time
pilots to wallow in reality.

Since the behavior of the sim matches the behavior of the real aircraft, what
reality is lacking in simulation?

On Sun, 8 Mar 2009 17:20:20 -0700 (PDT), Ibby
wrote:


So you admit your ignorance on the matter of autopilot disconnect. In other
words, your wonderful simulator is inadequate. Sorry 'bout that little boy.

I will post this again as it's NOT ignorance, it is REALITY.
Watch this clip - A REAL CLIP ON A REAL BOEING 747-400 NOT A GAME
4min 58 seconds the autopilot is disconnected by the pilot via a
button on his control column.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pl-TW...eature=channel

This group is pathetic, I was going to try give you guys a chance but
you lot argue against ANYTHING depending on the source of the comment.
I'm sure most of you have experience in general aviation but are there
any real commercial pilots on here that will back your arguements, not
against the good or bad aspects of a sim but back your comments about
what you lot believe happens on a real commercial flightdeck

Do you not understand that increasing the volume of alarms or
tweaking operating modes of autoflight systems after an accident
caused wouldn't be unusual?

Ibby writes:

So how can someone who HAS physically controlled a real aircraft (me)
be compared to MX who HASN'T controlled a real aircraft????????????

We both fail to kowtow before the treehouse club, and to the club members,
that's all that matters. Welcome to USENET.

If you must take sides, at least be sure to choose your friends carefully.

On Mar 9, 4:53*pm, Ibby wrote:
Relevance? (we're (you *were) talking autolands, not approaches or even
cruise flight).

--
Duncan- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

This all stems from earlier posts here on whether a NOVICE pilot
during an emergency could control an aircraft and successfully land
it.
The aircraft on this video did have an assigned STAR but has been
vectored to intercept the ILS localiser. *The P.I.C. is NOT flying the
747, he is simply adjusting the MCP knobs and switches on the
glareshield

During an emergency a novice could do the exact same under the
guidance of ATC. *With autoland enabled and a certified runway he
wouldnt have to touch the yoke or throttle at all. Other pilots here
believe an airliner MUST be handflown on finals just because their
automation systems do not offer the same capablilities of the
747-400. *Yes some carriers request pilots to disengage the autopilot
and autothottle system on final and hand fly the remaining 500 feet
descent but it doesn't have to be done

I watched the real time adjustments during the approach, and have
serious doubts that someone alone in the cockpit with over the radio
instuctions could in fact do what the crew did, even if that person
had sim experience. In the world of psychology studies regarding open-
loop instruction systems have shown them to be very error prone. It
would take someone very good at giving blinded verbal instructions to
pull it off.

Read what happened in something I just posted about an F18 pilot being
given instructions on bringing his bird home in San Diego -- hardly
inexperienced, and yet the result was a deadly crash. The claim being
made here is someone with zero real experience would fare better. I'd
not bet on that.

The good news is, there are no bets to be made. It's an experiment not
being done.