Why We Lost The Vietnam War

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Spiv" wrote in message
...

Then pay attention.

What for? It's clear you don't know what you're talking about.

Where do you have a problem, then I ca help you.

You didn't get the point. Please focus.

You didn'r make a point. The point is nothing from the Comet went into
the
design of Boeing's bombers or the 707.

The engineering/metallurgy side did. You know too much about these sorts of
things do you?



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"Tex Houston" wrote in message
...

"Keith Willshaw" wrote in message
...

IT was a larger plane with 10 years of the Comet before it to fall
back
on.
The world's first transatlantic service was by the Comet not the 707.

Wrong, the pressurised Boeing Stratocruiser and Lockheed
Constellations were running transatlantic services before either
Comet or the 707. The Comet IV lacked the range to fly the
Atlantic non stop and the first jet non stop service was launched
in August 1959 using the Boeing 727-320

I think you are screwed up on your airplane designations. Sure it wasn't
a
707-320? The Boeing 727 series was a much later series. On the
Trans-Atlantic runs I remember crossing on the DC-6/C-118 airplanes long
before 1959. Don't leave Douglas out, please.

The topic is jet airliners, not prop jobs. The Comet was first.


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"Spiv" wrote:
"John Mullen" wrote in message
...
Spiv wrote:

...


The USA did give tasters to many buyers.

True. OTOH at least one of the lost Comets was on some kind of round the
world publicity stunt. Same difference.

Boeing tasters were financial. The VC10 was a superior plane to the 707
and
it did not sell well either.

Vickers designed an aircraft to the questionable requirements of a single
customer.

"Keith Willshaw" wrote:



On the 4th October 1958 two B.O.A.C. Comet 4s inaugurated the first
regular
transatlantic jet passenger service - another first for British
innovation.

But not non-stop, it had to stop in Newfoundland to refuel
while the 707 made the journey non stop.

I suggest you work on your reading skills.

Keith

Now now Keith. Newfoundland is on the western edge of the
Atlantic so it WAS 'transatlantic' wasn't it?...
--

-Gord.

"Brett" wrote in message
...

The USA did give tasters to many buyers.

True. OTOH at least one of the lost Comets was on some kind of round
the
world publicity stunt. Same difference.

Boeing tasters were financial. The VC10 was a
superior plane to the 707 and it did not sell well either.

Vickers designed an aircraft to the questionable
requirements of a single customer.

It wasn't the requirements, it was the timing. When the VC10 appeared on
the market it's competitors had already been in service for six and four
years and ironically the restricted 'hot and high' runways of Africa and the
Middle East for which the Standard VC10 had specifically been developed
would eventually all be lengthened to accommodate the 707 and DC-8, in the
process eliminating the VC10's main advantage. Had the original V.1000 been
built it would have been in time to compete but the VC10 was just too late.

The VC10 was a superior plane with passengers loving it as the engines were
all aft making the cabin quieter with less vibration. It was less
susceptible to turbulence with a superior wing design. It was more
expensive to operate. The Super VC10 was cheaper to run beating the US
planes. By then it was too late, Boeing and Douglas were entrenched in the
world's airlines. Only much later did the Airbus knock Boeing off its
throne.

The Chinese bought the VC10. In 1980 they ordered more planes after being
fully satisfied with the planes performance and running costs. Vickers were
facing opened up the production line after 11 years.



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"Spiv" wrote in message
...

"Brett" wrote in message
...

The USA did give tasters to many buyers.

True. OTOH at least one of the lost Comets was on some kind of round
the
world publicity stunt. Same difference.

Boeing tasters were financial. The VC10 was a
superior plane to the 707 and it did not sell well either.

Vickers designed an aircraft to the questionable
requirements of a single customer.

It wasn't the requirements, it was the timing. When the VC10 appeared on
the market it's competitors had already been in service for six and four
years and ironically the restricted 'hot and high' runways of Africa and
the
Middle East for which the Standard VC10 had specifically been developed
would eventually all be lengthened to accommodate the 707 and DC-8, in the
process eliminating the VC10's main advantage. Had the original V.1000
been
built it would have been in time to compete but the VC10 was just too
late.

The VC10 was a superior plane with passengers loving it as the engines
were
all aft making the cabin quieter with less vibration. It was less
susceptible to turbulence with a superior wing design. It was more
expensive to operate. The Super VC10 was cheaper to run beating the US
planes. By then it was too late, Boeing and Douglas were entrenched in
the
world's airlines. Only much later did the Airbus knock Boeing off its
throne.

Airbus knocked BCAG off their throne?

Spiv wrote:
snip
The Chinese bought the VC10. In 1980 they ordered more planes after being
fully satisfied with the planes performance and running costs. Vickers were
facing opened up the production line after 11 years.


have you got a cite for that I've never heard of the chinese operating
the VC10 never mind trying to buy more (apart from anything else I'd
have half expected the RAF to but new airframes if the production line
was opening up again).

"Tarver Engineering" wrote in message
...

"Spiv" wrote in message
...

"Brett" wrote in message
...

The USA did give tasters to many buyers.

True. OTOH at least one of the lost Comets was on some kind of
round
the
world publicity stunt. Same difference.

Boeing tasters were financial. The VC10 was a
superior plane to the 707 and it did not sell well either.

Vickers designed an aircraft to the questionable
requirements of a single customer.

It wasn't the requirements, it was the timing. When the VC10 appeared
on
the market it's competitors had already been in service for six and four
years and ironically the restricted 'hot and high' runways of Africa and
the
Middle East for which the Standard VC10 had specifically been developed
would eventually all be lengthened to accommodate the 707 and DC-8, in
the
process eliminating the VC10's main advantage. Had the original V.1000
been
built it would have been in time to compete but the VC10 was just too
late.

The VC10 was a superior plane with passengers loving it as the engines
were
all aft making the cabin quieter with less vibration. It was less
susceptible to turbulence with a superior wing design. It was more
expensive to operate. The Super VC10 was cheaper to run beating the US
planes. By then it was too late, Boeing and Douglas were entrenched in
the
world's airlines. Only much later did the Airbus knock Boeing off its
throne.

Airbus knocked BCAG off their throne?

Yes.....

Tuesday, December 23, 2003

Airbus meets delivery goal to be 'market leader'

By ANDREA ROTHMAN
BLOOMBERG NEWS

Airbus delivered its 300th aircraft this year and plans "a few more" before
Dec. 31 to beat its target and overtake The Boeing Co. as the world's
biggest planemaker, Chief Executive Noel Forgeard said.

The goal was reached Friday evening when Airbus turned over Singapore
Airlines Ltd.'s first A340-500 long-haul plane, Forgeard said at his offices
in Toulouse, France.

This target of 300 deliveries by Airbus, a unit of European, Aeronautic
Defense & Space Co., exceeds Boeing's goal of 280 planes. Airbus' order
backlog stands at 1,500 planes versus 1,100 aircraft for Boeing, indicating
the planemaker will continue to deliver more aircraft per year in coming
years.

"Everyone was skeptical they could be equal with Boeing, but they have
achieved that and now they're No. 1," said Klaus Breil, who helps oversee
about $5.9 billion at Adig Investments in Frankfurt including 4 million
shares in EADS.

Airbus, which is 80 percent owned by EADS and 20 percent by BAE Systems, may
also beat Boeing on new orders for the fourth time in five years. Airbus
last year received orders for 300 planes against 251 for Boeing. In the
first 11 months of 2003, Airbus won contracts for 263 planes versus 229 at
Boeing.

"We are the market leader in new orders and backlog and this year in
deliveries," Forgeard said. "And we want to be the leader as preferred
supplier" to airlines.




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"Spiv" wrote:
"Brett" wrote in message
...

The USA did give tasters to many buyers.

True. OTOH at least one of the lost Comets was on some kind of round
the
world publicity stunt. Same difference.

Boeing tasters were financial. The VC10 was a
superior plane to the 707 and it did not sell well either.

Vickers designed an aircraft to the questionable
requirements of a single customer.

It wasn't the requirements, it was the timing.

It was the requirements! It didn't help that it got stuck with a low bypass
(basically due to the Victor's engine configuration) Conway.

When the VC10 appeared on
the market it's competitors had already been in service for six and four
years and ironically the restricted 'hot and high' runways of Africa and
the
Middle East for which the Standard VC10 had specifically been developed

As I said "questionable requirements of a single customer"

snip the junk

"Spiv" wrote:

snip

The Chinese bought the VC10. In 1980 they ordered more planes after being
fully satisfied with the planes performance and running costs. Vickers
were
facing opened up the production line after 11 years.

The Chinese bought the Trident!