A aviation & planes forum. AviationBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » AviationBanter forum » rec.aviation newsgroups » Instrument Flight Rules
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Does an IPC count as a BFR?



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old March 12th 04, 07:59 PM
Mike Z.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

A buddy of mine actually got his II and had no intention of getting his CFI. He since relented but that is another story.

Mike Z

"Brad Z" wrote in message news:gTl4c.16400$bP2.83279@attbi_s53...
If your flight instructor certificate only has a "instrument-airplane"
rating (i.e. no airplane single engine or Airplane multi engine)

"Ron Natalie" wrote in message
. ..

"Brad Z" wrote in message

news:wgb4c.9456$bP2.70125@attbi_s53...
Not all CFII's can give BFR's.

You've lost me there. Why not?





  #12  
Old March 13th 04, 03:50 AM
C J Campbell
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Brad Z" wrote in message
news:gTl4c.16400$bP2.83279@attbi_s53...
If your flight instructor certificate only has a "instrument-airplane"
rating (i.e. no airplane single engine or Airplane multi engine)


That is one of the most bizarre things I have ever heard, and that despite
the fact that I have been reading the news groups for years.... :-)

Why on earth would any instructor do that, and how could he possibly do any
CFII instruction in an airplane that he is not allowed to give instruction
in?


  #15  
Old March 15th 04, 03:31 PM
Dave Butler
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

C J Campbell wrote:
"Michael" wrote in message
om...

wrote

In a similar vein, does an instrument checkride count as a BFR? I
thought it did since it added a rating to the ticket.


It does. However, an instrument instructor ride does not - even
though it is the same ride (only from the right seat).

Of course there's no reason for it - it's just our policy.



It may be your policy, but it does not really follow the regs. Yes, I know
the argument that the instructor certificate is not a pilot certificate, but
it sure gets treated as a pilot certificate for all other purposes. I also
know that the policy varies from one FSDO to another. I also know that most
examiners will sign the ride off as a BFR if you ask them to do that.


Isn't there a requirement, or a guideline, or something, that the BFR should
include an hour of ground instruction? Seems like I've had that requirement put
on me by instructors on the last few BFRs. The time is spent
grilling^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H instructing me on the FARs. I don't remember ever
having any ground instruction component as part of an IPC.

Dave
Remove SHIRT to reply directly.

  #16  
Old March 15th 04, 05:06 PM
Michael
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"C J Campbell" wrote
It may be your policy, but it does not really follow the regs. Yes, I know
the argument that the instructor certificate is not a pilot certificate, but
it sure gets treated as a pilot certificate for all other purposes. I also
know that the policy varies from one FSDO to another.


Actually, it varies from one inspector to another.

Not too long ago, we had a jumpship crash. The pilot did all the
right things, but when the engine of a heavy single fails in the climb
at 400 ft, you just don't have many options. The field was wet and
rough, and there was substantial damage but no injuries. The accident
was reported, and the investigation delegated to the FAA. The pilot
made the mistake of noting that he never seems to hear of automobile
engines having catastrophic failures, but certified airplane engines
fail with depressing regularity. Next thing you know, he's written up
for flying with an expired BFR - enven though he had taken his CFII
ride only a few months ago. Your tax dollars at work.

I also know that most
examiners will sign the ride off as a BFR if you ask them to do that.


That's another gray area, worse than the original.

61.56 Flight review.
(a) Except as provided in paragraphs (b) and (f) of this section, a
flight
review consists of a minimum of 1 hour of flight training and 1 hour
of ground
training.

The FAA is pretty adamant that a checkride is not instruction.

Personally, I don't understand why the instructor doesn't just sign
the BFR. There's no way I would be comfortable signing someone off
for a CFI ride and not willing to sign off a BFR.

Michael
  #17  
Old March 15th 04, 06:27 PM
Richard Kaplan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default





"Michael" wrote in message
om...

made the mistake of noting that he never seems to hear of automobile
engines having catastrophic failures, but certified airplane engines
fail with depressing regularity. Next thing you know, he's written up


What is the relationship between this statement and his being written up?


--------------------
Richard Kaplan, CFII

www.flyimc.com


  #18  
Old March 15th 04, 09:12 PM
Dale
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

In article m,
"Richard Kaplan" wrote:

"Michael" wrote in message
om...

made the mistake of noting that he never seems to hear of automobile
engines having catastrophic failures, but certified airplane engines
fail with depressing regularity. Next thing you know, he's written up


What is the relationship between this statement and his being written up?



Wondered that myself. If this is the incident I think it is, the pilots
problems probably stem from him having a bunch of water in the fuel,
which appears to have caused the loss of power.

--
Dale L. Falk

There is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing
as simply messing around with airplanes.

http://home.gci.net/~sncdfalk/flying.html
  #19  
Old March 16th 04, 12:18 AM
Michael
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

"Richard Kaplan" wrote
made the mistake of noting that he never seems to hear of automobile
engines having catastrophic failures, but certified airplane engines
fail with depressing regularity. Next thing you know, he's written up


What is the relationship between this statement and his being written up?


Oh, I'm guessing the inspector took it as a slight against the FAA -
the implication being that FAA certification hasn't actually made our
airplanes any safer, and in fact has retarded progress. Thus he
decided to teach this pilot with a 'bad' attitude a lesson. Happens
more often than you might think.

Michael
  #20  
Old March 16th 04, 02:49 AM
Mark Kolber
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Fri, 12 Mar 2004 18:53:55 -0800, "C J Campbell"
wrote:

but
it sure gets treated as a pilot certificate for all other purposes.


"All?" I have never seen even one FAR that =does= treat a CFI
certificate as a pilot certificate.

From a pure regulation standpoint, the FAR treats instructor
certificates separately from pilot certificates. Staring with

==============================
§ 61.1 Applicability and definitions.
(a) This part prescribes:
(1) The requirements for issuing =pilot, flight instructor, and ground
instructor certificates= and ratings; the conditions under which those
certificates and ratings are necessary; and the privileges and
limitations of those certificates and ratings.
(2) The requirements for issuing =pilot, flight instructor, and ground
instructor= authorizations; the conditions under which those
authorizations are necessary; and the privileges and limitations of
those authorizations.
(3) The requirements for issuing =pilot, flight instructor, and ground
instructor= certificates and ratings for persons who have taken
courses approved by the Administrator under other parts of this
chapter.
==============================

The differentiation continues throughout the FAR and general FAA
policy with amazing consistency, from medical certificate requirements
(a CFI doesn't need one unless he's also acting as PIC) to the
requirement to have each certificate available when exercising that
certificate's privileges to the requirement that, in order to teach in
an aircraft, a CFI must have both "A pilot certificate =and= flight
instructor certificate with the applicable category and class rating"
(61.195(b)(1).

There may be an FAR that =does= treat the flight instructor
certificate as a pilot certificate, but so far anyway, I haven't seen
one.

 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Where is approach good about multiple approaches and clearances in the air? Andrew Gideon Instrument Flight Rules 29 February 14th 04 03:51 AM
Zzzz Campbell's Second Lawsuit Against Sun-N-Fun Zzzz Ron Wanttaja Home Built 23 October 6th 03 02:09 PM
Aerial duel to the death - count to ten then Fire! pac plyer Home Built 18 August 12th 03 12:35 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:13 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 AviationBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.