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annual - hartzell AD
Hi all,
With the recent topics on Annuals hitting the group, I figured I'd relate my own, indulge myself in a short rant, and ask a question of you. Just got the call from our A&P today and our 172 w/180HP Avcon Conversion came through the annual in pretty good shape. Unfortunately, we did manage to get caught on one thing -- in spite of having spent almost $3K to overhaul our Hartzell CS prop in 2003, we just learned that it was hit with an AD issued in September 2006 for hub cracks. We have to fly out to our prop shop and have them do an eddy current inspection within the next few flight hours to determine if the hub can remain airworthy (ironic that they ask us to FLY it there), and then we have two choices: 1) Do the inspection again every 100 hours or 12 months, whichever comes first. It costs about $200 + the flight time to go out there, or about $400. or 2) Spend about $2500 to replace the hub to terminate the reoccurring inspection. When I read the service bulletin on which the AD is based, it looks like some kind of CYA letter. They provide specific technical information and examples of WHY the SB has been issued (that I can't debate since I'm not an aeronautical engineer), but then they go on to declare that "all pre-1991 hubs" are suspect. In my opinion, that's a bit of a broad stroke. Of course, we have to comply with the AD terms, so we will. But it comes to mind that if our prop was truly susceptible to this condition I figure it would have thrown a blade in the first 30 years and 2000 hours in service -- or at the very least failed the inspection at the recent overhaul. I have the distinct feeling that this is just another way for Hartzell's attorneys to cover their ass and to make a few bucks for the company at our considerable expense. Our prop shop empathized and said that this is a common problem with Hartzell. They like to write service bulletins and appear all too happy to help the Feds issue ADs to force owners to clean up their messes. Then when owners bitch about the lack of data to support the manufacturer's claims, the ADs are eventually rescinded. This rang true with me because an earlier AD on this prop that involved the blade shanks was in effect for almost 10 years before the Feds rescinded it due to a lack of supporting data. I can't help but think the new AD is another example of this brain-dead approach to airworthiness. The shop also said the AD was issued due to "several" blade separations in the field. This is news to me. I mean, I haven't been living under a rock the last 10 years. I know full well, for example, that neither Lycoming nor Continental's low-bid manufacturers can make a crankshaft to save anyone's life and I recall hearing about several catastrophic engine failures that resulted from those defects, but I haven't heard anything about these alleged blade separations. Anyone else affected by this AD? http://tinyurl.com/v68jk -Doug -- -------------------- Doug Vetter, ATP/CFI http://www.dvatp.com ------------------- |
#2
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annual - hartzell AD
"Doug Vetter" wrote in message
... Hi all, Anyone else affected by this AD? Me. Although, I've done such little flying lately that I have yet to come close to 50 hours since the AD became effective. But, since I'm planning to cross the threshold before my annual in May, I was just thinking of finding a prop shop in the area. Anyone have a good recommendation in the Chicago area? -- ------------------------------- Travis Lake N3094P PWK |
#3
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annual - hartzell AD
I'm in the same boat. We overhauled the prop on our Mooney in 2005,
just before the AD. We're going for the $5500 option of replacing the entire prop. Its a good deal, the blades alone would normally cost that. Do you recall how much was left on the blades after your 2003 OH? -Robert, CFII |
#4
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annual - hartzell AD
Doug,
Anyone else affected by this AD? Yup, our Tobago is. Apparently, one can negotiate discounts with Hartzell for the replacement. Also, there has been at least one fatal crash in the UK, IIRC. -- Thomas Borchert (EDDH) |
#5
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annual - hartzell AD
On Fri, 16 Feb 2007 21:21:03 -0500, Doug Vetter wrote:
Hi all, With the recent topics on Annuals hitting the group, I figured I'd relate my own, indulge myself in a short rant, and ask a question of you. Just got the call from our A&P today and our 172 w/180HP Avcon Conversion came through the annual in pretty good shape. Unfortunately, we did manage to get caught on one thing -- in spite of having spent almost $3K to overhaul our Hartzell CS prop in 2003, we just learned that it was hit with an AD issued in September 2006 for hub cracks. We have to fly out to our prop shop and have them do an eddy current inspection within the next few flight hours to determine if the hub can remain airworthy (ironic that they ask us to FLY it there), and then we have two choices: 1) Do the inspection again every 100 hours or 12 months, whichever comes first. It costs about $200 + the flight time to go out there, or about $400. or 2) Spend about $2500 to replace the hub to terminate the reoccurring inspection. Anyone else affected by this AD? Just went through it with my Mooney. I opted for the hub replacement. By the way, IF you opt for the hub replacement, you won't necessarily have to do that first eddy current inspection you mentioned above, unless you want to wait to do the replacement. And your regular shop can pull the prop and send it off to the shop (that's what we did). Also, Hartzell, in their infinite wisdom, would send ME a hub, but would not send it to my prop shop. Fortunately, the shop had a post-AD new hub on the shelf; so we were able to do a swap with minimum down-time. --ron |
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annual - hartzell AD
Robert M. Gary wrote:
I'm in the same boat. We overhauled the prop on our Mooney in 2005, just before the AD. We're going for the $5500 option of replacing the entire prop. Its a good deal, the blades alone would normally cost that. Do you recall how much was left on the blades after your 2003 OH? I don't happen to have the specs (mechanic still has the airplane and the logbooks -- sorry) but when I called the prop shop while it was in for overhaul they commented that both blades were in very good shape and near "new" specs. He expected that both would have good life left in them after the overhaul. No sense in tossing what works, right? -Doug -- -------------------- Doug Vetter, ATP/CFI http://www.dvatp.com -------------------- |
#7
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annual - hartzell AD
Ron Rosenfeld wrote:
Just went through it with my Mooney. I opted for the hub replacement. By the way, IF you opt for the hub replacement, you won't necessarily have to do that first eddy current inspection you mentioned above, unless you want to wait to do the replacement. And your regular shop can pull the prop and send it off to the shop (that's what we did). Good point, however we've decided to go the inspection route for now as we don't know how much longer we'll have the airplane, and it would be 6+ years before we'd pay as much in inspections as we would in the case of hub replacement. And in a strange sense, I think I'll feel safer doing the routine inspection. No matter whether the part is new or old, affected by an AD or not, they can all develop cracks, and the ones you don't find in time are the ones that will kill you. Also, Hartzell, in their infinite wisdom, would send ME a hub, but would not send it to my prop shop. Fortunately, the shop had a post-AD new hub on the shelf; so we were able to do a swap with minimum down-time. My prop shop told me I could buy the hub directly from Hartzell at the shop's price and that way they wouldn't mark it up. That struck me as a bit strange, but I bet has something to do with the burden of liability shifting to the owner or to Hartzell for the owner-supplied part. -Doug -- -------------------- Doug Vetter, ATP/CFI http://www.dvatp.com -------------------- |
#8
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annual - hartzell AD
On Sat, 17 Feb 2007 11:32:35 -0500, Doug Vetter wrote:
Ron Rosenfeld wrote: Just went through it with my Mooney. I opted for the hub replacement. By the way, IF you opt for the hub replacement, you won't necessarily have to do that first eddy current inspection you mentioned above, unless you want to wait to do the replacement. And your regular shop can pull the prop and send it off to the shop (that's what we did). Good point, however we've decided to go the inspection route for now as we don't know how much longer we'll have the airplane, and it would be 6+ years before we'd pay as much in inspections as we would in the case of hub replacement. For my amount of flying, I'd be doing a few inspections per year. And I did not want to deal with the down time for that. And in a strange sense, I think I'll feel safer doing the routine inspection. No matter whether the part is new or old, affected by an AD or not, they can all develop cracks, and the ones you don't find in time are the ones that will kill you. Also, Hartzell, in their infinite wisdom, would send ME a hub, but would not send it to my prop shop. Fortunately, the shop had a post-AD new hub on the shelf; so we were able to do a swap with minimum down-time. My prop shop told me I could buy the hub directly from Hartzell at the shop's price and that way they wouldn't mark it up. That struck me as a bit strange, but I bet has something to do with the burden of liability shifting to the owner or to Hartzell for the owner-supplied part. Interesting. My prop shop (and also Hartzell themselves) told me that Hartzell would not sell them a hub. --ron |
#9
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annual - hartzell AD
On Feb 17, 8:16 am, Doug Vetter wrote:
I don't happen to have the specs (mechanic still has the airplane and the logbooks -- sorry) but when I called the prop shop while it was in for overhaul they commented that both blades were in very good shape and near "new" specs. He expected that both would have good life left in them after the overhaul. No sense in tossing what works, right? Yea, sounds like in your case the new hub is the way to go. Send your old blades in and have them attach them to the new hub. I believe they are required by the FAA to reoverhaul the blades again but it shouldn't be a big deal. I know that some people who live in the South have gotten really good deals on the eddie inspection and will just do that. I live in California and pay up to $400 each time so its a no-brainer to dump the old hub. -Robert |
#10
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annual - hartzell AD
Robert M. Gary wrote:
Yea, sounds like in your case the new hub is the way to go. Send your old blades in and have them attach them to the new hub. I believe they are required by the FAA to reoverhaul the blades again but it shouldn't be a big deal. My prop shop only said that as long as the blades are within TBO (flight and calendar time), all they'd have to do is a reseal. I know that some people who live in the South have gotten really good deals on the eddie inspection and will just do that. I live in California and pay up to $400 each time so its a no-brainer to dump the old hub. Total costs for us will be around $350 (including flight time out there), but it still makes sense for us to get another 5 years or so out of things as they are. By that time it will either be someone else's problem or it will be ready for another overhaul. Who knows...next year we might change our mind, but for now it's inspections for us. -Doug -- -------------------- Doug Vetter, ATP/CFI http://www.dvatp.com -------------------- |
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