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#11
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K8b restoration
On Saturday, February 2, 2019 at 1:15:04 AM UTC-6, Eric Munk wrote:
Much snippery... Wood is spruce by heart. Sorry, Eric, bust I must disagree with you on that. Keifer is not the same as Spruce. If you use Spruce in equivalent thickness, you come out with a weaker spar. Also, to another comment. Longer scarfs required for Keifer and backing blocks, as dictated by AC43.13 are not to be used, as they impart a "stiff spot" in the wing. Please buy a copy of the translation of Workshop Practices, join VSA, and absorb the knowledge that is available through this group (VSA). Steve Leonard |
#12
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K8b restoration
Kiefer is Pine, however can't you just pick the wood in the local warehouse, there is specifications as curls per cm, humidity etc to be OK for planes.
Workshop Practice by the Vintage Sailplane Association is translated from German and covers all you need to know on wood, selection, testing, gluing etc and some more. |
#13
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K8b restoration
John Foster wrote on 2/1/2019 5:29 PM:
I was given a junked K8b due to water damage to the wood at the wing root and multiple tears in the original fabric and chipped/peeling paint. However, it looks like it may be restorable (worth it, that's another story). Anyway, I'm interested to know if there is an online repair manual that lays out the specific techniques of repairing or replacing wood in the wings, and specifications on what type of wood to be used, etc. I looked around and found the list of ADs, but nothing that laid out what I am looking for. I've contacted Schleicher as well, but they simply directed me to a link on their website, that didn't really give the information I needed. This is a certified glider, and I'd like to keep it that way, as I'm hoping to use it as a club glider. Are you familiar with restoring wooden aircraft, and are just looking for specifics on the K8? If that's not the case, I suggest the first thing you look for is someone that has restored a K8, and go from there. A club ship should be restored to a higher standard than an individual might accept. -- Eric Greenwell - Washington State, USA (change ".netto" to ".us" to email me) - "A Guide to Self-Launching Sailplane Operation" https://sites.google.com/site/motorg...ad-the-guide-1 - "Transponders in Sailplanes - Dec 2014a" also ADS-B, PCAS, Flarm http://soaringsafety.org/prevention/...anes-2014A.pdf |
#14
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K8b restoration
On Friday, February 1, 2019 at 6:29:38 PM UTC-7, John Foster wrote:
I was given a junked K8b due to water damage to the wood at the wing root and multiple tears in the original fabric and chipped/peeling paint. However, it looks like it may be restorable (worth it, that's another story). Anyway, I'm interested to know if there is an online repair manual that lays out the specific techniques of repairing or replacing wood in the wings, and specifications on what type of wood to be used, etc. I looked around and found the list of ADs, but nothing that laid out what I am looking for. I've contacted Schleicher as well, but they simply directed me to a link on their website, that didn't really give the information I needed. This is a certified glider, and I'd like to keep it that way, as I'm hoping to use it as a club glider. My SWAG would be that type of restoration this glider might require will involve 3-4 years of part-time effort. Frank Whiteley |
#15
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K8b restoration
On Friday, February 1, 2019 at 7:29:38 PM UTC-6, John Foster wrote:
I was given a junked K8b due to water damage to the wood at the wing root and multiple tears in the original fabric and chipped/peeling paint. However, it looks like it may be restorable (worth it, that's another story). Anyway, I'm interested to know if there is an online repair manual that lays out the specific techniques of repairing or replacing wood in the wings, and specifications on what type of wood to be used, etc. I looked around and found the list of ADs, but nothing that laid out what I am looking for. I've contacted Schleicher as well, but they simply directed me to a link on their website, that didn't really give the information I needed. This is a certified glider, and I'd like to keep it that way, as I'm hoping to use it as a club glider. I was one of the two co-editors of the translation of Hans Jacobs book Werkstattpraxis - Workshop Practice. All the information you need can be found in this book, and more importantly, the information is appropriate for the construction utilized to build the K8b. A few copies of the book are still available thru the VSA website, Cumulus Soaring in the USA, and Eqip Publisher in Germany. Some repairs made using AC-43.13 or many other methods should be avoided, particularly spar repairs, since they add stress concentration. The methods in Workshop Practice are the best for wood airplanes of all types. The book also has several pages of addendum that I wrote to address items that have become available after the last edition of the book in German. You should consider joining the Vintage Sailplane Association (VSA in USA) and/or the Vintage Glider Club (VGC worldwide, but HQ in UK). Check out their Facebook pages as well (Vintage & Classic Sailplanes or Vintage Glider Club). There are many postings every day and it is an excellent way to get questions answered. Thru these organizations, you should be able to find someone near you that can help you assess the condition of the glider and make appropriate decisions on how to more forward. You may also find important parts and lessons for others who have done the work before. If you are in the USA, you could contact me directly thru email, my address is on the VSA website. I am also the Drawing Archivist for the VSA, and we can help you with drawings. Best of luck with what I believe to be a worthwhile endeavor. ..... Neal |
#16
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K8b restoration
On Saturday, February 2, 2019 at 6:55:07 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Friday, February 1, 2019 at 7:29:38 PM UTC-6, John Foster wrote: I was given a junked K8b due to water damage to the wood at the wing root and multiple tears in the original fabric and chipped/peeling paint. However, it looks like it may be restorable (worth it, that's another story). Anyway, I'm interested to know if there is an online repair manual that lays out the specific techniques of repairing or replacing wood in the wings, and specifications on what type of wood to be used, etc. I looked around and found the list of ADs, but nothing that laid out what I am looking for.. I've contacted Schleicher as well, but they simply directed me to a link on their website, that didn't really give the information I needed. This is a certified glider, and I'd like to keep it that way, as I'm hoping to use it as a club glider. I was one of the two co-editors of the translation of Hans Jacobs book Werkstattpraxis - Workshop Practice. All the information you need can be found in this book, and more importantly, the information is appropriate for the construction utilized to build the K8b. A few copies of the book are still available thru the VSA website, Cumulus Soaring in the USA, and Eqip Publisher in Germany. Some repairs made using AC-43.13 or many other methods should be avoided, particularly spar repairs, since they add stress concentration. The methods in Workshop Practice are the best for wood airplanes of all types. The book also has several pages of addendum that I wrote to address items that have become available after the last edition of the book in German. You should consider joining the Vintage Sailplane Association (VSA in USA) and/or the Vintage Glider Club (VGC worldwide, but HQ in UK). Check out their Facebook pages as well (Vintage & Classic Sailplanes or Vintage Glider Club). There are many postings every day and it is an excellent way to get questions answered. Thru these organizations, you should be able to find someone near you that can help you assess the condition of the glider and make appropriate decisions on how to more forward. You may also find important parts and lessons for others who have done the work before. If you are in the USA, you could contact me directly thru email, my address is on the VSA website. I am also the Drawing Archivist for the VSA, and we can help you with drawings. Best of luck with what I believe to be a worthwhile endeavor. ..... Neal Thanks for all the replies. I'm definitely going to have to get a copy of Jacob's book. I have a friend in town who is an A&P/IA, and has had a fair bit of experience doing repairs on wooden aircraft before. He has taken a brief look at this glider and feels "it has good bones". The spar seems good to him, although there are a few glue joints on the ribs that need to be "redone". The wing root rib seems to have delaminated on the left wing, which I'm thinking will need some attention, but otherwise it appears that it will mostly be a recovering job. Once I get the fabric off the bottom of the left wing, I'll have him take a closer look at it and let me know what he thinks. |
#17
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K8b restoration
Replacing wing root rib ply is a fairly straightforward job on the
K8. Good luck! Lovely little gliders... At 10:08 03 February 2019, John Foster wrote: On Saturday, February 2, 2019 at 6:55:07 PM UTC-7, = wrote: On Friday, February 1, 2019 at 7:29:38 PM UTC-6, John Foster wrote: I was given a junked K8b due to water damage to the wood at the wing ro= ot and multiple tears in the original fabric and chipped/peeling paint. Ho= wever, it looks like it may be restorable (worth it, that's another story).= Anyway, I'm interested to know if there is an online repair manual that l= ays out the specific techniques of repairing or replacing wood in the wings= , and specifications on what type of wood to be used, etc. I looked around= and found the list of ADs, but nothing that laid out what I am looking for= .. I've contacted Schleicher as well, but they simply directed me to a link= on their website, that didn't really give the information I needed. This = is a certified glider, and I'd like to keep it that way, as I'm hoping to u= se it as a club glider. =20 I was one of the two co-editors of the translation of Hans Jacobs book We= rkstattpraxis - Workshop Practice. All the information you need can be fou= nd in this book, and more importantly, the information is appropriate for t= he construction utilized to build the K8b. A few copies of the book are st= ill available thru the VSA website, Cumulus Soaring in the USA, and Eqip Pu= blisher in Germany. =20 Some repairs made using AC-43.13 or many other methods should be avoided,= particularly spar repairs, since they add stress concentration. The metho= ds in Workshop Practice are the best for wood airplanes of all types. The = book also has several pages of addendum that I wrote to address items that = have become available after the last edition of the book in German. =20 You should consider joining the Vintage Sailplane Association (VSA in USA= ) and/or the Vintage Glider Club (VGC worldwide, but HQ in UK). Check out = their Facebook pages as well (Vintage & Classic Sailplanes or Vintage Glide= r Club). There are many postings every day and it is an excellent way to g= et questions answered. Thru these organizations, you should be able to fin= d someone near you that can help you assess the condition of the glider and= make appropriate decisions on how to more forward. You may also find impo= rtant parts and lessons for others who have done the work before. =20 If you are in the USA, you could contact me directly thru email, my addre= ss is on the VSA website. I am also the Drawing Archivist for the VSA, and= we can help you with drawings. =20 Best of luck with what I believe to be a worthwhile endeavor. ..... Neal Thanks for all the replies. I'm definitely going to have to get a copy of J= acob's book. I have a friend in town who is an A&P/IA, and has had a fair = bit of experience doing repairs on wooden aircraft before. He has taken a = brief look at this glider and feels "it has good bones". The spar seems go= od to him, although there are a few glue joints on the ribs that need to be= "redone". The wing root rib seems to have delaminated on the left wing, w= hich I'm thinking will need some attention, but otherwise it appears that i= t will mostly be a recovering job. Once I get the fabric off the bottom of= the left wing, I'll have him take a closer look at it and let me know what= he thinks. |
#18
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K8b restoration
On Sunday, February 3, 2019 at 5:30:05 AM UTC-6, Eric Munk wrote:
Replacing wing root rib ply is a fairly straightforward job on the K8. Good luck! Lovely little gliders... And this time, I agree with Eric. Ply delam on the root rib is one thing. Should be relatively easy fix. I only have two flights in mine (so many other planes to play with!), but it is a lovely flying plane! Was so nice to fly a silent plane. No electrics. Not even a hand held radio on board. Too bad the pee tube was blocked.. Made things a bit sporting there for a while, flying with a full funnel! I was very glad the baggie didn't have a leak in it! Steve Leonard Ka-8B N6660D |
#19
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K8b restoration
At 17:32 02 February 2019, Steve Leonard wrote:
On Saturday, February 2, 2019 at 1:15:04 AM UTC-6, Eric Munk wrote: Much snippery... Wood is spruce by heart. Sorry, Eric, bust I must disagree with you on that. Keifer is not the same as Spruce. If you use Spruce in equivalent thickness, you come out with a weaker spar. Also, to another comment. Longer scarfs required for Keifer and backing blocks, as dictated by AC43.13 are not to be used, as they impart a "stiff spot" in the wing. Please buy a copy of the translation of Workshop Practices, join VSA, and absorb the knowledge that is available through this group (VSA). Steve Leonard Always happy to stand corrected, Steve. Have been putting lots of Kiefer in Schleicher's finest as of late, on the European side of the Atlantic, but thought spruce would be a good translation for it... PS: the VSA's translation of Jacobs' masterpiece is lovely! |
#20
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K8b restoration
Get in touch with the Australian Gliding museum,they are in the process of restoring a K8 to airworthy condition from a wreck found in a trailer .they have a wealth of experience and expertise.
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